This is getting out of hand ... enough is enough
Well I got nailed about a week ago northbound on the 400 near my exit. It was about 1am on a Thursday night and there was little to no traffic but it was quite foggy so I didn't see the cruiser.
I pulled over quickly and the female officer approached my window and announced that she clocked me at 156 and then a second time at 149. I didn't say a word to the officer other than to answer direct questions. My insurance card was expired. She ignored that infraction and said she was giving me a break by giving me the ticket for 149 since she didn't want to tow my car. I was driving my 850 at the time and expect the outcome would have been different if I was in any of my previous rx7s. But keep a cool head and don't say anything that can end up in the officer's notes. I drove home wrote down the weather, light conditions etc. and anything else I thought was relevant. I'll file for a trial date and take it from there. Had I been towed I would have done the same thing.
To actually sieze my vehicle requires an application that one can defend. The process is not new. I have defended siezure in other settings for example where a client has been accused of drug dealing and all the cash on his person at the time of the arrest has been siezed as proceeds of crime. Even though I maybe successful in defending the substantive charges they can still proceed with regards to the cash.
Back to the case at hand, I think it would be a major inconvenience to have my car towed but the actual siezure application would fail miserably especially considering there were no other vehicles involved in my infraction. And even if there were other vehicles on the road I think it is questionable as to whether a Police officer's word could amount to proving the onus even on a balance of probabilities. Unfortunatetly it would cost money to defend and not the type of cash you pay paralegals. That said if anyone finds themselves in the precarious scenario of having their car towed this summer give me a shout since I am interesting in defending fellow automotive enthusiasts.
I pulled over quickly and the female officer approached my window and announced that she clocked me at 156 and then a second time at 149. I didn't say a word to the officer other than to answer direct questions. My insurance card was expired. She ignored that infraction and said she was giving me a break by giving me the ticket for 149 since she didn't want to tow my car. I was driving my 850 at the time and expect the outcome would have been different if I was in any of my previous rx7s. But keep a cool head and don't say anything that can end up in the officer's notes. I drove home wrote down the weather, light conditions etc. and anything else I thought was relevant. I'll file for a trial date and take it from there. Had I been towed I would have done the same thing.
To actually sieze my vehicle requires an application that one can defend. The process is not new. I have defended siezure in other settings for example where a client has been accused of drug dealing and all the cash on his person at the time of the arrest has been siezed as proceeds of crime. Even though I maybe successful in defending the substantive charges they can still proceed with regards to the cash.
Back to the case at hand, I think it would be a major inconvenience to have my car towed but the actual siezure application would fail miserably especially considering there were no other vehicles involved in my infraction. And even if there were other vehicles on the road I think it is questionable as to whether a Police officer's word could amount to proving the onus even on a balance of probabilities. Unfortunatetly it would cost money to defend and not the type of cash you pay paralegals. That said if anyone finds themselves in the precarious scenario of having their car towed this summer give me a shout since I am interesting in defending fellow automotive enthusiasts.
Last edited by ScrappyDoo; Jul 23, 2007 at 11:54 AM.
stunt driving is drifting, it is sitting on your sun roof and sterrign with your feet, its that kind of stuff, you know stunting....
as for the lancer comercial i have seen several other commericals with cars weaving in and out of traffic, even getting some air going over a bump in the road, and i think this commerical is for lexus, or mercedes....
for them to pick on one car and not hte rest is BS...
as for the lancer comercial i have seen several other commericals with cars weaving in and out of traffic, even getting some air going over a bump in the road, and i think this commerical is for lexus, or mercedes....
for them to pick on one car and not hte rest is BS...
). Then you can corner and accelerate absurdly hard without squealing 
Senior Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 627
Likes: 0
From: above ground
Anyone catch the CTV national news last night? We had an "incident" in Calgary of a number of high $$ exotics hitting 300km/hr + on a rural highway that was filmed by a local exotic dealership. Of course no charges have been laid yet, they're still "investigating". I suspect nothing will happen because if you can afford a 350,000$ car, you have probably have powerfull friends and expensive lawyers.
However, following that, there was a 10 second blurb about how Ontario has passed legislation that anyone caught at 50km/hr over the posted speed limit would be classified as a streetracer and fined from 2,000 to 10,000 as well as a 7-day vehicle impoundment.
I haven't lived in Ontario for about 10 years now, but i swear i remeber the average speed on the QEW being about 130 km/hr to keep up with traffic flow.
However, following that, there was a 10 second blurb about how Ontario has passed legislation that anyone caught at 50km/hr over the posted speed limit would be classified as a streetracer and fined from 2,000 to 10,000 as well as a 7-day vehicle impoundment.
I haven't lived in Ontario for about 10 years now, but i swear i remeber the average speed on the QEW being about 130 km/hr to keep up with traffic flow.
When I'm in the passing lane (to actually pass, and usually a handful of vehicles at once) I find that I'm travelling 20-30 km/hour faster then the cars I am approaching ahead of me in the same lane. My rambling observations from my drivers seat...
Problem #1 Lane discipline - unless you are passing someone or going silly fast get the F over. This is the root cause of much of the carnage on highways in Ontario. When people sit in the passing lane needlessly it forces other drivers (usually impatient or hurried ones) to dangerously weave through traffic to find the quickest way to the next unimpeded stretch of highway.
Problem #2 Being Aware - all drivers should remain constantly aware of their surroundings, including all mirror checks (especially rearview), road conditions, weather, etc. I'm a flasher, I admit it. I will (for a millisecond) flash someone ahead of me while I am in the passing lane if I am approaching them very quickly. Its not so much so that I am gaining on them at a ridiculous speed (125-135) but that those that I flash are usually travelling at an unsafe speed for the passing lane (90-110) and typically without a logical reason as to why they can't return to the middle or right lane. And think ahead! Half the congestion on the northbound DVP is caused by ******* who wait to move over to the correct lanes for their exit choice until the last second. Cars crossing 2-3 lanes at the last moment throughout rush hour is not uncommon. Don't these people drive this route everyday and should they not recognize that if they select the right lane for the 401 eastbound as they approach York Mills then they won't be putting anyone in an usafe position while also making a more fluid exit?
Problem #3 - Brats. Integra's or their parents cars with the music turned up and not a care in the world. Say, I'll race you up to Wasaga in my Mom's Oldsmobile Achieva! Teens think their immortal behind the wheel of a car. Part of this is due to a poor testing system (although it has improved somewhat). I think every kid needs the life scared out of them once before they drive more sanely.
Problem #4 - Our lawmakers and the Media. Since it's not the summer of the gun the poor driving habits of other have left them with nothing to focus on except... poor drivers labelled as street racers. *sigh*. The media dragged this out for a few weeks, got ever 40 something on board and Fantino saw the opportunity to carry those voices to the provincial legislature. Great. The papers have described this summer as street racing "carnage". What were their one or two accidents that were actually attributed to street racing this calendar year?
Crap, I better get back to work so I can save up to pay for the first time my car is impounded and I have to pay for the ticket, towing and storage of my car because I was doing 140+ kph safely...
Problem #1 Lane discipline - unless you are passing someone or going silly fast get the F over. This is the root cause of much of the carnage on highways in Ontario. When people sit in the passing lane needlessly it forces other drivers (usually impatient or hurried ones) to dangerously weave through traffic to find the quickest way to the next unimpeded stretch of highway.
Problem #2 Being Aware - all drivers should remain constantly aware of their surroundings, including all mirror checks (especially rearview), road conditions, weather, etc. I'm a flasher, I admit it. I will (for a millisecond) flash someone ahead of me while I am in the passing lane if I am approaching them very quickly. Its not so much so that I am gaining on them at a ridiculous speed (125-135) but that those that I flash are usually travelling at an unsafe speed for the passing lane (90-110) and typically without a logical reason as to why they can't return to the middle or right lane. And think ahead! Half the congestion on the northbound DVP is caused by ******* who wait to move over to the correct lanes for their exit choice until the last second. Cars crossing 2-3 lanes at the last moment throughout rush hour is not uncommon. Don't these people drive this route everyday and should they not recognize that if they select the right lane for the 401 eastbound as they approach York Mills then they won't be putting anyone in an usafe position while also making a more fluid exit?
Problem #3 - Brats. Integra's or their parents cars with the music turned up and not a care in the world. Say, I'll race you up to Wasaga in my Mom's Oldsmobile Achieva! Teens think their immortal behind the wheel of a car. Part of this is due to a poor testing system (although it has improved somewhat). I think every kid needs the life scared out of them once before they drive more sanely.
Problem #4 - Our lawmakers and the Media. Since it's not the summer of the gun the poor driving habits of other have left them with nothing to focus on except... poor drivers labelled as street racers. *sigh*. The media dragged this out for a few weeks, got ever 40 something on board and Fantino saw the opportunity to carry those voices to the provincial legislature. Great. The papers have described this summer as street racing "carnage". What were their one or two accidents that were actually attributed to street racing this calendar year?
Crap, I better get back to work so I can save up to pay for the first time my car is impounded and I have to pay for the ticket, towing and storage of my car because I was doing 140+ kph safely...
Anyone catch the CTV national news last night? We had an "incident" in Calgary of a number of high $$ exotics hitting 300km/hr + on a rural highway that was filmed by a local exotic dealership. Of course no charges have been laid yet, they're still "investigating". I suspect nothing will happen because if you can afford a 350,000$ car, you have probably have powerfull friends and expensive lawyers.
I haven't lived in Ontario for about 10 years now, but i swear i remeber the average speed on the QEW being about 130 km/hr to keep up with traffic flow.
I haven't lived in Ontario for about 10 years now, but i swear i remeber the average speed on the QEW being about 130 km/hr to keep up with traffic flow.
as for the QEW the few times i have driven it the average speed is like 15 km/h! stupid traffic...
now coming down the 401 between like Kingston and Toronto i will be doing a good clip but there always seems to be people passing me probably about 50 km/h over the limit...so i guess that lady and her kids in the minivan will get pulled over and get a $10k ticket for street-racing?
Rotary Enthusiast
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 874
Likes: 0
From: Ottawa, Canada
Problem #1 Lane discipline - unless you are passing someone or going silly fast get the F over. This is the root cause of much of the carnage on highways in Ontario. When people sit in the passing lane needlessly it forces other drivers (usually impatient or hurried ones) to dangerously weave through traffic to find the quickest way to the next unimpeded stretch of highway.
I see this all the time, and it is noticeably getting much worse these days. A variant of this is people changing into the fast lane to "make room" for people merging. Probably due to people not knowing how to merge in the first place.
Senior Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 627
Likes: 0
From: above ground
I would LOVE to see the stats in a years time that show the number of 149 in a 100 zone tickets given to Minivans, SUV's and Sedans driven by middle aged women and men, and the number of STREET RACING tickets handed out to young males of a visibly minorty.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9lbgF8oRk8
This reminds me of how the Ontario gov't is dealing with Street Racing ... haha
This reminds me of how the Ontario gov't is dealing with Street Racing ... haha
GIVE IT A READ IF YOU HAVE THE TIME
Section 172 of the Act is repealed and the following substituted:
Racing, stunts, etc., prohibited
172. (1) No person shall drive a motor vehicle on a highway in a race or contest, while performing a stunt or on a bet or wager.
Offence
(2) Every person who contravenes subsection (1) is guilty of an offence and on conviction is liable to a fine of not less than $2,000 and not more than $10,000 or to imprisonment for a term of not more than six months, or to both, and in addition his or her driver’s licence may be suspended,
(a) on a first conviction under this section, for not more than two years; or
(b) on a subsequent conviction under this section, for not more than 10 years.
Determining subsequent conviction
(3) In determining whether a conviction is a subsequent conviction for the purposes of subsection (2), the only question to be considered is the sequence of convictions and no consideration shall be given to the sequence of commission of offences or whether any offence occurred before or after any conviction.
10-year limitation
(4) A conviction that is more than 10 years after the previous conviction is deemed to be a first conviction for the purpose of subsection (2).
Police to require surrender of licence, detention of vehicle
(5) Where a police officer believes on reasonable and probable grounds that a person is driving, or has driven, a motor vehicle on a highway in contravention of subsection (1), the officer shall,
(a) request that the person surrender his or her driver’s licence; and
(b) detain the motor vehicle that was being driven by the person until it is impounded under clause (7) (b).
Administrative seven-day licence suspension
(6) Upon a request being made under clause (5) (a), the person to whom the request is made shall forthwith surrender his or her driver’s licence to the police officer and, whether or not the person is unable or fails to surrender the licence to the police officer, his or her driver’s licence is suspended for a period of seven days from the time the request is made.
Administrative seven-day vehicle impoundment
(7) Upon a motor vehicle being detained under clause (5) (b), the motor vehicle shall, at the cost of and risk to its owner,
(a) be removed to an impound facility as directed by a police officer; and
(b) be impounded for seven days from the time it was detained under clause (5) (b).
Release of vehicle
(8) Subject to subsection (15), the motor vehicle shall be released to its owner from the impound facility upon the expiry of the period of impoundment.
Early release of vehicle
(9) Despite the detention or impoundment of a motor vehicle under this section, a police officer may release the motor vehicle to its owner before it is impounded under subsection (7) or, subject to subsection (15), may direct the operator of the impound facility where the motor vehicle is impounded to release the motor vehicle to its owner before the expiry of the seven days if the officer is satisfied that the motor vehicle was stolen at the time that it was driven on a highway in contravention of subsection (1).
Duty of officer re licence suspension
(10) Every officer who asks for the surrender of a person’s driver’s licence under this section shall keep a record of the licence received with the name and address of the person and the date and time of the suspension and shall, as soon as practicable after receiving the licence, provide the person with a notice of suspension showing the time from which the suspension takes effect and the period of time for which the licence is suspended.
Duty of officer re impoundment
(11) Every officer who detains a motor vehicle under this section shall prepare a notice identifying the motor vehicle that is to be impounded under subsection (7), the name and address of the driver and the date and time of the impoundment and shall, as soon as practicable after the impoundment of the motor vehicle, provide the driver with a copy of the notice showing the time from which the impoundment takes effect, the period of time for which the motor vehicle is impounded and the place where the vehicle may be recovered.
Same
(12) A police officer shall provide a copy of the notice prepared under subsection (11) to the owner of the motor vehicle by delivering it personally or by mail to the address of the owner shown on the permit for the motor vehicle or to the latest address for the owner appearing on the records of the Ministry.
No appeal or hearing
(13) There is no appeal from, or right to be heard before, a vehicle detention, driver’s licence suspension or vehicle impoundment under subsection (5), (6) or (7), but this subsection does not affect the taking of any proceeding in court.
Lien for storage costs
(14) The costs incurred by the person who operates the impound facility where a motor vehicle is impounded under this section are a lien on the motor vehicle that may be enforced under the Repair and Storage Liens Act.
Costs to be paid before release of vehicle
(15) The person who operates the impound facility where a motor vehicle is impounded under subsection (7) is not required to release the motor vehicle until the removal and impound costs for the vehicle have been paid.
Owner may recover losses from driver
(16) The owner of a motor vehicle that is impounded under this section may bring an action against the driver of the motor vehicle at the time the vehicle was detained under clause (5) (b) to recover any costs or other losses incurred by the owner in connection with the impoundment.
Offence
(17) Every person who obstructs or interferes with a police officer in the performance of his or her duties under this section is guilty of an offence and on conviction is liable to a fine of not less than $200 and not more than $5,000 or to imprisonment for a term of not more than six months, or to both.
Intent of suspension and impoundment
(18) The suspension of a driver’s licence and the impoundment of a motor vehicle under this section are intended to promote compliance with this Act and to thereby safeguard the public and do not constitute an alternative to any proceeding or penalty arising from the same circumstances or around the same time.
Forms
(19) The Minister may require that forms approved by the Minister be used for any purpose of this section.
Regulations
(20) The Lieutenant Governor in Council may make regulations,
(a) requiring police officers to keep records with respect to licence suspensions and vehicle impoundments under this section for a specified period of time and to report specified information with respect to licence suspensions and vehicle impoundments to the Registrar and governing such records and reports;
(b) exempting any class of persons or class or type of vehicles from any provision or requirement of this section or of any regulation made under this section, prescribing conditions for any such exemptions and prescribing different requirements for different classes of persons or different classes or types of vehicles;
(c) defining the terms “race”, “contest” and “stunt” for the purposes of this section.
Definition
(21) In this section,
“driver’s licence” includes a driver’s licence issued by another jurisdiction.
22. Part X of the Act is amended by adding the following section:
Nitrous oxide fuel systems prohibited
172.1 (1) No person shall drive or permit to be driven on a highway a motor vehicle manufactured or modified after its manufacture such that nitrous oxide may be delivered into the fuel mixture unless,
(a) the part of the fuel system that may connect to a canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel capable of containing nitrous oxide can be clearly seen by looking at the interior or exterior of the motor vehicle;
(b) there is no canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel connected to that part; and
(c) if the part of the fuel system that may connect to a canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel capable of containing nitrous oxide is located inside the passenger compartment, there is no canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel capable of containing nitrous oxide in the passenger compartment.
Same
(2) No person shall drive or permit to be driven on a highway a motor vehicle manufactured or modified after its manufacture such that nitrous oxide may be delivered into the fuel mixture unless,
(a) the part of the fuel system that may connect to a canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel capable of containing nitrous oxide is completely disconnected from the part of the system that connects to the engine;
(b) the disconnection can be clearly seen by looking at the interior or exterior of the motor vehicle; and
(c) the disconnected parts cannot be reconnected from inside the passenger compartment.
Offence
(3) Every person who contravenes subsection (1) or (2) is guilty of an offence and on conviction is liable to a fine of not less than $500 and not more than $2,000 or to imprisonment for a term of not more than six months, or to both.
23. Subsection 214.1 (7) of the Act is amended by striking out “and in addition his or her licence or permit may be suspended for a period of not more than two years” at the end and substituting “and in addition his or her licence or permit may be suspended for a period of not more than the maximum period for which his or her licence could be ordered suspended by a court under section 130 or 172, as the case may be”.
24. Section 217 of the Act is amended by adding the following subsection:
Exceptions to release of motor vehicle
(4.1) A motor vehicle shall not be released under subsection (4) if it was removed, stored, detained or impounded pursuant to any provision of this Act other than subsection (4) of this section.
Section 172 of the Act is repealed and the following substituted:
Racing, stunts, etc., prohibited
172. (1) No person shall drive a motor vehicle on a highway in a race or contest, while performing a stunt or on a bet or wager.
Offence
(2) Every person who contravenes subsection (1) is guilty of an offence and on conviction is liable to a fine of not less than $2,000 and not more than $10,000 or to imprisonment for a term of not more than six months, or to both, and in addition his or her driver’s licence may be suspended,
(a) on a first conviction under this section, for not more than two years; or
(b) on a subsequent conviction under this section, for not more than 10 years.
Determining subsequent conviction
(3) In determining whether a conviction is a subsequent conviction for the purposes of subsection (2), the only question to be considered is the sequence of convictions and no consideration shall be given to the sequence of commission of offences or whether any offence occurred before or after any conviction.
10-year limitation
(4) A conviction that is more than 10 years after the previous conviction is deemed to be a first conviction for the purpose of subsection (2).
Police to require surrender of licence, detention of vehicle
(5) Where a police officer believes on reasonable and probable grounds that a person is driving, or has driven, a motor vehicle on a highway in contravention of subsection (1), the officer shall,
(a) request that the person surrender his or her driver’s licence; and
(b) detain the motor vehicle that was being driven by the person until it is impounded under clause (7) (b).
Administrative seven-day licence suspension
(6) Upon a request being made under clause (5) (a), the person to whom the request is made shall forthwith surrender his or her driver’s licence to the police officer and, whether or not the person is unable or fails to surrender the licence to the police officer, his or her driver’s licence is suspended for a period of seven days from the time the request is made.
Administrative seven-day vehicle impoundment
(7) Upon a motor vehicle being detained under clause (5) (b), the motor vehicle shall, at the cost of and risk to its owner,
(a) be removed to an impound facility as directed by a police officer; and
(b) be impounded for seven days from the time it was detained under clause (5) (b).
Release of vehicle
(8) Subject to subsection (15), the motor vehicle shall be released to its owner from the impound facility upon the expiry of the period of impoundment.
Early release of vehicle
(9) Despite the detention or impoundment of a motor vehicle under this section, a police officer may release the motor vehicle to its owner before it is impounded under subsection (7) or, subject to subsection (15), may direct the operator of the impound facility where the motor vehicle is impounded to release the motor vehicle to its owner before the expiry of the seven days if the officer is satisfied that the motor vehicle was stolen at the time that it was driven on a highway in contravention of subsection (1).
Duty of officer re licence suspension
(10) Every officer who asks for the surrender of a person’s driver’s licence under this section shall keep a record of the licence received with the name and address of the person and the date and time of the suspension and shall, as soon as practicable after receiving the licence, provide the person with a notice of suspension showing the time from which the suspension takes effect and the period of time for which the licence is suspended.
Duty of officer re impoundment
(11) Every officer who detains a motor vehicle under this section shall prepare a notice identifying the motor vehicle that is to be impounded under subsection (7), the name and address of the driver and the date and time of the impoundment and shall, as soon as practicable after the impoundment of the motor vehicle, provide the driver with a copy of the notice showing the time from which the impoundment takes effect, the period of time for which the motor vehicle is impounded and the place where the vehicle may be recovered.
Same
(12) A police officer shall provide a copy of the notice prepared under subsection (11) to the owner of the motor vehicle by delivering it personally or by mail to the address of the owner shown on the permit for the motor vehicle or to the latest address for the owner appearing on the records of the Ministry.
No appeal or hearing
(13) There is no appeal from, or right to be heard before, a vehicle detention, driver’s licence suspension or vehicle impoundment under subsection (5), (6) or (7), but this subsection does not affect the taking of any proceeding in court.
Lien for storage costs
(14) The costs incurred by the person who operates the impound facility where a motor vehicle is impounded under this section are a lien on the motor vehicle that may be enforced under the Repair and Storage Liens Act.
Costs to be paid before release of vehicle
(15) The person who operates the impound facility where a motor vehicle is impounded under subsection (7) is not required to release the motor vehicle until the removal and impound costs for the vehicle have been paid.
Owner may recover losses from driver
(16) The owner of a motor vehicle that is impounded under this section may bring an action against the driver of the motor vehicle at the time the vehicle was detained under clause (5) (b) to recover any costs or other losses incurred by the owner in connection with the impoundment.
Offence
(17) Every person who obstructs or interferes with a police officer in the performance of his or her duties under this section is guilty of an offence and on conviction is liable to a fine of not less than $200 and not more than $5,000 or to imprisonment for a term of not more than six months, or to both.
Intent of suspension and impoundment
(18) The suspension of a driver’s licence and the impoundment of a motor vehicle under this section are intended to promote compliance with this Act and to thereby safeguard the public and do not constitute an alternative to any proceeding or penalty arising from the same circumstances or around the same time.
Forms
(19) The Minister may require that forms approved by the Minister be used for any purpose of this section.
Regulations
(20) The Lieutenant Governor in Council may make regulations,
(a) requiring police officers to keep records with respect to licence suspensions and vehicle impoundments under this section for a specified period of time and to report specified information with respect to licence suspensions and vehicle impoundments to the Registrar and governing such records and reports;
(b) exempting any class of persons or class or type of vehicles from any provision or requirement of this section or of any regulation made under this section, prescribing conditions for any such exemptions and prescribing different requirements for different classes of persons or different classes or types of vehicles;
(c) defining the terms “race”, “contest” and “stunt” for the purposes of this section.
Definition
(21) In this section,
“driver’s licence” includes a driver’s licence issued by another jurisdiction.
22. Part X of the Act is amended by adding the following section:
Nitrous oxide fuel systems prohibited
172.1 (1) No person shall drive or permit to be driven on a highway a motor vehicle manufactured or modified after its manufacture such that nitrous oxide may be delivered into the fuel mixture unless,
(a) the part of the fuel system that may connect to a canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel capable of containing nitrous oxide can be clearly seen by looking at the interior or exterior of the motor vehicle;
(b) there is no canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel connected to that part; and
(c) if the part of the fuel system that may connect to a canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel capable of containing nitrous oxide is located inside the passenger compartment, there is no canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel capable of containing nitrous oxide in the passenger compartment.
Same
(2) No person shall drive or permit to be driven on a highway a motor vehicle manufactured or modified after its manufacture such that nitrous oxide may be delivered into the fuel mixture unless,
(a) the part of the fuel system that may connect to a canister, bottle, tank or pressure vessel capable of containing nitrous oxide is completely disconnected from the part of the system that connects to the engine;
(b) the disconnection can be clearly seen by looking at the interior or exterior of the motor vehicle; and
(c) the disconnected parts cannot be reconnected from inside the passenger compartment.
Offence
(3) Every person who contravenes subsection (1) or (2) is guilty of an offence and on conviction is liable to a fine of not less than $500 and not more than $2,000 or to imprisonment for a term of not more than six months, or to both.
23. Subsection 214.1 (7) of the Act is amended by striking out “and in addition his or her licence or permit may be suspended for a period of not more than two years” at the end and substituting “and in addition his or her licence or permit may be suspended for a period of not more than the maximum period for which his or her licence could be ordered suspended by a court under section 130 or 172, as the case may be”.
24. Section 217 of the Act is amended by adding the following subsection:
Exceptions to release of motor vehicle
(4.1) A motor vehicle shall not be released under subsection (4) if it was removed, stored, detained or impounded pursuant to any provision of this Act other than subsection (4) of this section.
Rotary Freak
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,817
Likes: 16
From: South Carolina
Corrected.
Why do you (not you personally - but poeple in general) defend street racing of any kind. Just take it to the track and you don't have to worry about losing your car.
Now, if the g starts to just randomly start pulling cars off the street and crushing them, then I think you have a real greivance.
Why do you (not you personally - but poeple in general) defend street racing of any kind. Just take it to the track and you don't have to worry about losing your car.
Now, if the g starts to just randomly start pulling cars off the street and crushing them, then I think you have a real greivance.
Last edited by BLKTOPTRVL; Aug 15, 2007 at 06:59 PM.
Burning up Time
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 805
Likes: 2
From: Earth
now coming down the 401 between like Kingston and Toronto i will be doing a good clip but there always seems to be people passing me probably about 50 km/h over the limit...so i guess that lady and her kids in the minivan will get pulled over and get a $10k ticket for street-racing?
This is really hurting ...
Looking at the law, if you are suspected of racing, then your car and license will be gone for 7 days. If you try to reason with the officer as to what you are doing, you will be charged for obstruction of justice and can be fined and thrown into jail.
What's worst is that there is no appeal or hearing for the impoundment of the car or your license suspension.
Looking at the Charter of Rights, http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/charter/
Doesn't section 172.13 on the HTA violate #2(b) and 11(d) of our charter of rights?
Looking at the law, if you are suspected of racing, then your car and license will be gone for 7 days. If you try to reason with the officer as to what you are doing, you will be charged for obstruction of justice and can be fined and thrown into jail.
What's worst is that there is no appeal or hearing for the impoundment of the car or your license suspension.
Looking at the Charter of Rights, http://laws.justice.gc.ca/en/charter/
Doesn't section 172.13 on the HTA violate #2(b) and 11(d) of our charter of rights?
Corrected.
Why do you (not you personally - but poeple in general) defend street racing of any kind. Just take it to the track and you don't have to worry about losing your car.
Now, if the g starts to just randomly start pulling cars off the street and crushing them, then I think you have a real greivance.
Why do you (not you personally - but poeple in general) defend street racing of any kind. Just take it to the track and you don't have to worry about losing your car.
Now, if the g starts to just randomly start pulling cars off the street and crushing them, then I think you have a real greivance.
It's just that the new law violates our Charter of Rights that generations of Canadian fought for and are pround of.
It we let these things slide, Canada is not Canada anymore. We might as we call it Russia or Cuba or China.
Rotary Freak
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,817
Likes: 16
From: South Carolina
Hell, Give a few more of your rights and you might start to become like some other North Americans we know. Maybe in the future we might have to come by to borrow a cup of freedom from you.
I sent my letters, I even left voicemails. I signed the petition.
I used to commute 1000+km on the 401 every week, and i think that probably 90% of that was at faster than 50km/h over the limit, but I never got caught, never hurt anyone and I certainly wasn't "racing"
50km/h over is pretty fast, but with the way police radar works it wouldn't surprise me if someone got this ticket for going 115.
a few years ago I was towing a trailer behind a DIESEL vw jetta at about 110km/h, I got pulled over and the officer informed me that he radared me at 146, and gave me a ticket for 135. I lost in court despite proving my innosence, the judge's call was "well, he pulled you over, so obviously you were speeding."
Anyways, it sucked and ended up costing me about $1200 over 2 years between costs of fighting it, time off work to go fight it, and increased insurance costs (my insurance DID go up and it still is, so this number is still increasing). I can just imagine getting charged with "street racing".
I tell you this: I hope their helicopters are fast and get scrambled quickly, because if I think I'm facing a $10k fine, I'm going to make sure they have to use them.
Looks like the OPP may get an airplane (I think only one), not any helicopters.
They might as well get an F-16 with air to surface missiles just enough to disable a car if you're gonna drive it like you stole it.
They might as well get an F-16 with air to surface missiles just enough to disable a car if you're gonna drive it like you stole it.
More Mazdas than Sense
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,168
Likes: 0
From: Sunny Downtown Fenwick
I'm thinking the LS1 Jaguar sedan is looking more and more attractive every day.
I don't know how to interprete that ... but with Homeland Security, a lot of privacy and freedom have been forfited.
www.corskan.on.ca/svao/
If there is a similar import orientated organization that someone knows of please let me know.
IMHO The best thing one can do to assist is to setup a fund for the first person that is wrongfully targeted by this legislation. The cost of making charter challenges is not cheap even when you have a lawyer willing to help. A small donation from the thousands of enthusiasts in Ontario would go along way.
For a more grassroots approach it would be fun to have someone follow around the various advocates of this legislation and report on their driving habits. Hiring a private investigator to do this would be cost prohibitive. You find someone who has no criminal record, a car and lots of time on their hands. Train them on what you want, pay them a living wage and send them out to report on the driving habits of Bryant, Klees, etc. Unfortunately the higher ups will have drivers paid for by us but those that don't would probably make enough gaffs in a day or twos driving to make good news material.
Last edited by ScrappyDoo; Aug 16, 2007 at 11:07 AM.
Senior Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 627
Likes: 0
From: above ground
The only way to fight this, would be to get a few hundred thousand people on one side. I'd donate even from Ablerta, to someone legal fees to contest this on grounds of the charter of rights. We'd need a national organization, commited to voting in unison.
Zoom - Zoom...
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 729
Likes: 0
From: Oshawa
I don't street race anymore.... I grew some common sense as I got older... but at the same time, my car is likely on the local law enforcement's list of "street racing vehicles" as I used to get pulled over at least once a week... So if this legislation gets pushed through and I have my car serviced, they'll crush it even though I haven't raced illegally in 4 years? Stupid. Uttery stupid. 50 over = street racing is also stupid. It's excessive speeding, but not necesarily racing... Idiots should just come up with a new charge... all i know is that if someone crushed my car, I'd likely go on a rampage, Grand Theft Auto style...lol
Senior Member
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 627
Likes: 0
From: above ground
If I were in Ontario, I SURE AS **** know what i would do.
I would phone CTV, GLOBAL and CBC, and get ahold of all the local car enthusiasts and car boards i could find and organize a car cruise in protest of offensive and discriminatory legislation.
I rent two of thos portable advertisting vans, stating who we are and what we're opposing and why. They would lead and follow the cruise.
The sign would reald "Car Enthusiasts, Not Street Racers" or something to that effect.
We would then proceed to drive on the 401 accross every lane of traffic at 90km/hr from Toronto to Kitchener and back on a saturday afternoon.
I would phone CTV, GLOBAL and CBC, and get ahold of all the local car enthusiasts and car boards i could find and organize a car cruise in protest of offensive and discriminatory legislation.
I rent two of thos portable advertisting vans, stating who we are and what we're opposing and why. They would lead and follow the cruise.
The sign would reald "Car Enthusiasts, Not Street Racers" or something to that effect.
We would then proceed to drive on the 401 accross every lane of traffic at 90km/hr from Toronto to Kitchener and back on a saturday afternoon.
Last edited by Crymson; Aug 16, 2007 at 05:32 PM.
Interesting read ...
___________________________
Spinning his hot wheels
If you can't take the heat, pass a new law against street racing
By ALAN YOUNG
Stephen Harper thinks the national media are out to get him, so he's taking measures to restrict and regulate media access at the press gallery.
I feel obliged to offer the besieged PM some words of advice so he doesn't become a national embarrassment.
Thicken your skin, Stephen. If you're too sensitive to take the sting of criticism, you're in the wrong job.
If you can't take the heat, consider the wide array of anti-psychotic medications for curbing paranoia.
The only surefire way to reduce critical press scrutiny is to start making good public policy instead of promoting ineffective proposals that invariably lead to ridicule.
Take Harper's latest proposal to introduce a new law against street ra-cing, presumably in response to a number of tragic fatalities in Ontario and BC.
There is no question that great dangers are created by men with small dicks who need to live out their fast and furious fantasy in a 1976 Starsky And Hutch Ford Grand Torino. But why create yet another law when the Criminal Code already addresses this problem?
We currently have a crime of dan-gerous driving, which calls for a sentence of 14 years in the case of death. Street racing fits squarely within this prohibition.
Also, the Criminal Code allows the sentencing judge to issue a licence suspension of up to five years to anyone convicted of dangerous driving. Adding a new offence of street racing is a purely symbolic gesture with few practical gains.
In recent years, the city of San Diego has significantly reduced its high incidence of street racing without new cri-minal laws. It did so by vigorously enforcing existing driving laws and by introducing the RaceLegal program to allow street racers access to public racetracks for organized competitions.
With a little ingenuity, social problems can be effectively dealt with by proper enforcement of existing laws. But far too often, politicians prefer to play politics, championing legislative initiatives in order to appear to be responding to a social problem without actually taking the risk of doing something new.
Remember the creation of the anti-biker "criminal organization" law in 1997? It was designed to cover extortion, pimping, drug running and murder, but only when committed by a criminal organization a group of people dedicated to a life of extortion, pimping and drug running. Holy redundancy, Batman! We already have laws against these crimes and many, many more.
Whether these crimes are committed as part of gang activity is clearly relevant when considering the severity of sentence or punishment, but it is not really a new crime. So why was it put into our Code? Because the police in Quebec wanted the feds to respond to the increasing wave of biker violence, a response that usually translates into votes at election time.
There have been real gains in Quebec, primarily because of increased resources and greater collaboration between police and prosecutors, but for the most part the new law has only led to protracted constitutional challenges and failed mega-trials in newly built high-security courthouses across the country.
Closer to home, Crown prosecutor Hank Goody has referred to the current prosecution of the Galloway Boys in Scarborough under the criminal organization law as a "logistical nightmare."
Similarly, the enactment of a new street racing law will do little to enhance public safety and will invariably raise a whole host of definitional issues for lawyers: What is a race? What constitutes evidence of a race? Does the race need to be planned or can it arise spontaneously? Do you need spectators and wagering? What are the legal implications of being a spectator?
Prosecuting street racers under the current dangerous driving provisions is a simple task, whereas Harper's proposal will just add a layer of unnecessary complexity to the law.
The automobile may be a dangerous weapon in the hands of a reckless few, but in light of the current legal regime, this is clearly not a pressing issue in need of an immediate political response.
Canada actually has the third-lowest road fatality rate in the Western world, and in 2001 Ontario reported its lowest number of fatalities in 50 years (845 deaths).
Stephen Harper is wasting time and resources by making the fight against street racing a pressing legislative objective while ignoring the real dangers presented by the 19 million passenger vehicles that congest our roadways and our lungs. It is not surprising that he's trying to shield himself from aggressive media questioning.
Last year a report by Toronto Public Health estimated that in Toronto alone there were 822 deaths due to air pollution and 120 due to extreme heat. Traffic fatalities across Canada rarely exceed 3,000 a year, whereas the Ontario Medical Association estimated in 2005 that 5,800 people would be killed by air pollution in Ontario alone. In 2002, the World Health Organization reported that 3 million people die each year from air pollution. This is three times the number of deaths from worldwide traffic accidents. WHO also concludes that half the deaths caused by air pollution can be traced to car emissions.
When it comes to cars, the real political issue that needs to be addressed with courage and innovation is the sad reality that our car fetish is slowly choking us all to death. Ironically, Harper wants to get tough with street racers while reneging on our obligations under the Kyoto Accord.
http://www.nowtoronto.com/issues/200...ews_story2.php
___________________________
Spinning his hot wheels
If you can't take the heat, pass a new law against street racing
By ALAN YOUNG
Stephen Harper thinks the national media are out to get him, so he's taking measures to restrict and regulate media access at the press gallery.
I feel obliged to offer the besieged PM some words of advice so he doesn't become a national embarrassment.
Thicken your skin, Stephen. If you're too sensitive to take the sting of criticism, you're in the wrong job.
If you can't take the heat, consider the wide array of anti-psychotic medications for curbing paranoia.
The only surefire way to reduce critical press scrutiny is to start making good public policy instead of promoting ineffective proposals that invariably lead to ridicule.
Take Harper's latest proposal to introduce a new law against street ra-cing, presumably in response to a number of tragic fatalities in Ontario and BC.
There is no question that great dangers are created by men with small dicks who need to live out their fast and furious fantasy in a 1976 Starsky And Hutch Ford Grand Torino. But why create yet another law when the Criminal Code already addresses this problem?
We currently have a crime of dan-gerous driving, which calls for a sentence of 14 years in the case of death. Street racing fits squarely within this prohibition.
Also, the Criminal Code allows the sentencing judge to issue a licence suspension of up to five years to anyone convicted of dangerous driving. Adding a new offence of street racing is a purely symbolic gesture with few practical gains.
In recent years, the city of San Diego has significantly reduced its high incidence of street racing without new cri-minal laws. It did so by vigorously enforcing existing driving laws and by introducing the RaceLegal program to allow street racers access to public racetracks for organized competitions.
With a little ingenuity, social problems can be effectively dealt with by proper enforcement of existing laws. But far too often, politicians prefer to play politics, championing legislative initiatives in order to appear to be responding to a social problem without actually taking the risk of doing something new.
Remember the creation of the anti-biker "criminal organization" law in 1997? It was designed to cover extortion, pimping, drug running and murder, but only when committed by a criminal organization a group of people dedicated to a life of extortion, pimping and drug running. Holy redundancy, Batman! We already have laws against these crimes and many, many more.
Whether these crimes are committed as part of gang activity is clearly relevant when considering the severity of sentence or punishment, but it is not really a new crime. So why was it put into our Code? Because the police in Quebec wanted the feds to respond to the increasing wave of biker violence, a response that usually translates into votes at election time.
There have been real gains in Quebec, primarily because of increased resources and greater collaboration between police and prosecutors, but for the most part the new law has only led to protracted constitutional challenges and failed mega-trials in newly built high-security courthouses across the country.
Closer to home, Crown prosecutor Hank Goody has referred to the current prosecution of the Galloway Boys in Scarborough under the criminal organization law as a "logistical nightmare."
Similarly, the enactment of a new street racing law will do little to enhance public safety and will invariably raise a whole host of definitional issues for lawyers: What is a race? What constitutes evidence of a race? Does the race need to be planned or can it arise spontaneously? Do you need spectators and wagering? What are the legal implications of being a spectator?
Prosecuting street racers under the current dangerous driving provisions is a simple task, whereas Harper's proposal will just add a layer of unnecessary complexity to the law.
The automobile may be a dangerous weapon in the hands of a reckless few, but in light of the current legal regime, this is clearly not a pressing issue in need of an immediate political response.
Canada actually has the third-lowest road fatality rate in the Western world, and in 2001 Ontario reported its lowest number of fatalities in 50 years (845 deaths).
Stephen Harper is wasting time and resources by making the fight against street racing a pressing legislative objective while ignoring the real dangers presented by the 19 million passenger vehicles that congest our roadways and our lungs. It is not surprising that he's trying to shield himself from aggressive media questioning.
Last year a report by Toronto Public Health estimated that in Toronto alone there were 822 deaths due to air pollution and 120 due to extreme heat. Traffic fatalities across Canada rarely exceed 3,000 a year, whereas the Ontario Medical Association estimated in 2005 that 5,800 people would be killed by air pollution in Ontario alone. In 2002, the World Health Organization reported that 3 million people die each year from air pollution. This is three times the number of deaths from worldwide traffic accidents. WHO also concludes that half the deaths caused by air pollution can be traced to car emissions.
When it comes to cars, the real political issue that needs to be addressed with courage and innovation is the sad reality that our car fetish is slowly choking us all to death. Ironically, Harper wants to get tough with street racers while reneging on our obligations under the Kyoto Accord.
http://www.nowtoronto.com/issues/200...ews_story2.php