My first turboed car ;)
10-13-14, 09:47 PM
#578
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Great
Great!!! build Shawn
I'll keep an eye out for updates
I'll be also running an efr8374 soon
Getting ready to pull my motor out tomorrow or the day after
Check out my YouTube channle for the rx7 auto to manaul tranny swap under sleepydogz
Good luck and much respect!!!
I'll keep an eye out for updates
I'll be also running an efr8374 soon
Getting ready to pull my motor out tomorrow or the day after
Check out my YouTube channle for the rx7 auto to manaul tranny swap under sleepydogz
Good luck and much respect!!!
11-12-14, 11:05 AM
#580
I've been following this thread since I joined the forum, and I just got done re reading it again. It's amazing how much work you've put into it. Any idea how much money you have into it so far? If you even care to think about it, or share that info haha.
What are your plans for the winter?
I plan on doing pretty much the same upgrades as you, minus the ethanol. Is there anything you would have changed/done differently looking back on it now? (I'm specifically wondering about the rw vmount kit)
What are your plans for the winter?
I plan on doing pretty much the same upgrades as you, minus the ethanol. Is there anything you would have changed/done differently looking back on it now? (I'm specifically wondering about the rw vmount kit)
11-12-14, 12:08 PM
#581
I've been following this thread since I joined the forum, and I just got done re reading it again. It's amazing how much work you've put into it. Any idea how much money you have into it so far? If you even care to think about it, or share that info haha.
What are your plans for the winter?
I plan on doing pretty much the same upgrades as you, minus the ethanol. Is there anything you would have changed/done differently looking back on it now? (I'm specifically wondering about the rw vmount kit)
What are your plans for the winter?
I plan on doing pretty much the same upgrades as you, minus the ethanol. Is there anything you would have changed/done differently looking back on it now? (I'm specifically wondering about the rw vmount kit)
Interior is going to be pretty much all function at this part.
Full engine build
New fuel system
Some fun exterior
11-12-14, 10:04 PM
#583
I'm not even sure any stations around me have e85, although I've never really payed attention to it. What I do know is, I can get race gas only 5 minutes from home. And building a fuel system for ethanol sounds a bit more pricey, but I may be wrong.
Also, I apologize to Shawn for muddying up his thread :p
11-13-14, 02:38 PM
#585
I too am considering e85 but I do not drive my car much which is an issue. The injectors would need changed out for stainless units which is not cheap as e85 is known to cause rusting in standard injectors i.e. ev14, and their ID counterparts.
12-02-14, 03:36 PM
#587
I say OEM lines....Upgraded Lines.. your good to go. I'd just swap the OEM filter at the least. Don't believe a lot of the crazy speculation on changing...usually the problem isn't the Ethanol...it's in the set up...and the problem would've shown itself either way. It's just people are quick to point the finger ya know what I'm saying?!
12-02-14, 05:15 PM
#588
yeah the ID injectors are just the bosch EV injectors THAT ARE MATCHED BY LATENCY, which is a big deal and requires very expensive equipment. this makes a noticeable difference in smoothness especially at idle (low on-time and slightly lower voltage) with big primaries.
i ran two id2000 primaries (because we drive on them 99.9% of the time) and two ev2200 secondaries and they were great.
i ran two id2000 primaries (because we drive on them 99.9% of the time) and two ev2200 secondaries and they were great.
12-05-14, 03:08 AM
#589
Good call Jacob. IDs = flow matched Bosch EV14s.
I recently was on the phone with ID after a rust scare with my 2000s. After sitting for a month I no longer had fuel entering the engine. I was pretty convinced that I had just hosed $800 of injector but luckily they were cleaned and tested just fine.
The problem is that they are pulsed using magnetism and the ferrous metal used in the internals is susceptible to rust when sitting in hydroscopic fuel like E85. The clearances are very tight so even a small amount of surface rust can begin to affect performance. Eventually the injector will seize. How long you have is largely dependent on the climate. If your car is the kind that doesn't run regularly, you can help prevent absorption of ambient moisture by using an ethanol stabilizer ( ). Another thing that came up in my conversation with ID is premix. Those of us running premix fuel may have a slightly larger window since the injector internals are being lubricated by the fuel. Of course when they are sitting and not in use there is no lubrication, but the premix may provide a bit of rust inhibition. This is just theory with no data as far as ID is concerned.
If you can get away with it, one option would be the ID1300 which are constructed of rust resistant stainless internals. Flow might be an issue depending on power goals, but you can always run 6 of them with the Xcessive LIM. A higher flowing stainless ID injector is in the works (1650 I believe?) and should be available next year. They also mentioned they will be redoing the 2000's with stainless internals at some point, but we won't see that anytime soon.
Another thing to consider with E85 is that ethanol is a great solvent and has the ability to "clean" any deposits present in your fuel system from years of gasoline use. This is where old lines and fuel tanks come into play. People who don't take the time to clean their old varnished fuel system components risk running into issues with injectors and filters getting gunked up. The ID/EV14 internal filter is 7 microns. Then people think they can install a 40 micron stainless element filter...you can see how this might be a bad idea. If you want to protect your injectors you need to run a filter element that is smaller than the injector filter. The best E85 filter currently on the market is the 6 micron fiberglass from Fuel Lab. Ive confirmed this with ID. ID is also working on their own filter which should be available next year.
PTFE is mostly for fuel smell rather than corrosion. Ethanol (and even pump gas now days with all the additives in it) is able to permeate through synthetic rubber lines causing fuel smell. Teflon (PTFE) lined hose stops this. PTFE hose cost varies greatly, ranging from a little bit more than synthetic rubber to baller $30/ft motorsports stuff. The difference is usually weight and flexibility. I believe Summit sells their own budget brand PTFE hose. Aeroquip also has a very affordable "ST-W" hose (S-TW Series Smooth Bore -). At $2.67/ft for -6 I don't think you're looking at much of an increase (if any) over synthetic rubber. One thing to consider is hose ends...most brands of PTFE hose will require the use of a specific hose end and costs can vary greatly here as well.
IMO the "proper" way to prep an older car for E85 is to replace the lines and have the tank professionally cleaned. Starting off clean gives yourself the best chance of avoiding any issues down the line. Otherwise its a bit of a crap shoot...like Aaron says, he's been running on stock lines (not sure about his tank) without issue. Do some research and you will surely find others who were not so fortunate. It probably depends on the amount of varnish in the system.
All and all though, E85 seems to be great stuff for us rotary guys.
I recently was on the phone with ID after a rust scare with my 2000s. After sitting for a month I no longer had fuel entering the engine. I was pretty convinced that I had just hosed $800 of injector but luckily they were cleaned and tested just fine.
The problem is that they are pulsed using magnetism and the ferrous metal used in the internals is susceptible to rust when sitting in hydroscopic fuel like E85. The clearances are very tight so even a small amount of surface rust can begin to affect performance. Eventually the injector will seize. How long you have is largely dependent on the climate. If your car is the kind that doesn't run regularly, you can help prevent absorption of ambient moisture by using an ethanol stabilizer ( ). Another thing that came up in my conversation with ID is premix. Those of us running premix fuel may have a slightly larger window since the injector internals are being lubricated by the fuel. Of course when they are sitting and not in use there is no lubrication, but the premix may provide a bit of rust inhibition. This is just theory with no data as far as ID is concerned.
If you can get away with it, one option would be the ID1300 which are constructed of rust resistant stainless internals. Flow might be an issue depending on power goals, but you can always run 6 of them with the Xcessive LIM. A higher flowing stainless ID injector is in the works (1650 I believe?) and should be available next year. They also mentioned they will be redoing the 2000's with stainless internals at some point, but we won't see that anytime soon.
Another thing to consider with E85 is that ethanol is a great solvent and has the ability to "clean" any deposits present in your fuel system from years of gasoline use. This is where old lines and fuel tanks come into play. People who don't take the time to clean their old varnished fuel system components risk running into issues with injectors and filters getting gunked up. The ID/EV14 internal filter is 7 microns. Then people think they can install a 40 micron stainless element filter...you can see how this might be a bad idea. If you want to protect your injectors you need to run a filter element that is smaller than the injector filter. The best E85 filter currently on the market is the 6 micron fiberglass from Fuel Lab. Ive confirmed this with ID. ID is also working on their own filter which should be available next year.
PTFE is mostly for fuel smell rather than corrosion. Ethanol (and even pump gas now days with all the additives in it) is able to permeate through synthetic rubber lines causing fuel smell. Teflon (PTFE) lined hose stops this. PTFE hose cost varies greatly, ranging from a little bit more than synthetic rubber to baller $30/ft motorsports stuff. The difference is usually weight and flexibility. I believe Summit sells their own budget brand PTFE hose. Aeroquip also has a very affordable "ST-W" hose (S-TW Series Smooth Bore -). At $2.67/ft for -6 I don't think you're looking at much of an increase (if any) over synthetic rubber. One thing to consider is hose ends...most brands of PTFE hose will require the use of a specific hose end and costs can vary greatly here as well.
IMO the "proper" way to prep an older car for E85 is to replace the lines and have the tank professionally cleaned. Starting off clean gives yourself the best chance of avoiding any issues down the line. Otherwise its a bit of a crap shoot...like Aaron says, he's been running on stock lines (not sure about his tank) without issue. Do some research and you will surely find others who were not so fortunate. It probably depends on the amount of varnish in the system.
All and all though, E85 seems to be great stuff for us rotary guys.
12-16-14, 09:00 AM
#593
12-29-14, 07:55 AM
#596
After next season I am planning on fun next winter instead of having the car in pieces!
Building Home-Made Studded Tires for the ICE. [Generation 3] | 365-racing.net Blog
Building Home-Made Studded Tires for the ICE. [Generation 3] | 365-racing.net Blog
12-29-14, 12:36 PM
#599
I love my FD
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Shawn, just a heads up you will need to restrict the flow a little without a thermostat. Without a restrictor in the flow path the coolant will move to quickly in the system and cause improper cooling. Unless that pump has variable speed...
