94 R2 N/A 3 Rotor Build
 

This is a project of mine that has been in the works for, well years now actually. So.. for a bit of background history. I bought my first Rx-7 at 16, a 86 GXL. Joined the forum shortly after. Didnt take long for me to develop a passion and appreciation for Rx7s and rotaries in general. Through the years, as most of us do, I started accumulating more cars and parts, as well as modifying the ones I owned. At one point I had a bit of a small "side business" buying/fixing/selling FCs, etc. As with anyone I suppose in their late teens/early 20s, I was bitten by the power bug and had huge plans for my FC. It had a massive, laggy T70 turbo, Haltech, Kaaz rear, etc etc.. Went to a few local track days, got some experience with some other cars and over time started to develop an appreciation for a smooth and well balanced machine, as opposed to just a power monster. Having friends with cars ranging from supercharged Z06s and camaros, to big block muscle cars, I was fortunate enough to get a bit of a feel for alot of things. A few years passed, and I ended up selling my FCs, and bought my FD in May of 2005. a BB 94 R2, which aside from an exhaust and a set of springs was bone stock. I fell in love with RX7s all over again, and to this day still see my FD as something Ill keep forever. I did some light mods, and enjoyed it like that for a while. Unfortunately road debris one day took out my oil pan without me knowing, and loss of oil pressure led to not happy bearings. That was about.. Im guessing 5 years ago now. As with all things, what could have been a simple fix or replacement snowballed into a huge project. I went back and forth on everything from LSx swap to BNRs, and just couldnt make up my mind.
As the car sat in the garage, I happened to purchase an S2000 for a DD. Oddly enough, this car is what made me make up my mind on what engine to swap into the FD. I absolutely loved my S2k. While a bit anemic in a straight line, the balance and feel of the car was superb. The linear acceleration and flat torque (torque...haha) curve of the car, with its 9k rpm 2.0 and 6 speed was just a joy to drive. I dont think Ive had a car before that I had so much fun in. They really are excellent cars. I wanted that same feeling in my FD, just perhaps taken to the next level. So, after reading all that, that is where this brings me now. My FD is undergoing a complete rebuild. Engine, chassis, everything. In the past year or so Ive pretty much had every nut and bolt off the car, and there is very little left that has not been replaced with new or upgraded. The end vision I have always had for the car, I always tell myself is a "budget" 911 GT3 RS. I dont necessarily have a "power goal", but shooting for 375RWP. That in a well balance chassis and ~2600lbs should make for a very exciting and fun car. I want it to be at home on the track, but have a bit of refinement and be able to be driven on the street. I have alot of pics so far, and in the next few days will be uploading as I have time. For now here is a basic list of all that is being completed:

Engine
3Rotor being built by Logan at Defined Autoworks
Rx-8 10:1 Rotors, large street port. Custom built header and Exhaust
Custom ITB Intake
Full drysump oil system with Mazdaspeed front cover
Electromotive Tec3R ECU

Drivetrain
G-force T5, build with helical gearset and dog ring engagement (synchro-less)
Mustang Cobra 8.8 IRS with ford racing 4.3 gears

Chassis/Suspension
AME TM02 wheels 18x9.5 +22 on all 4
Dunlop Star spec 255/35r18s
RacingBrake 4 Corner BBK
Zeal Function Xs Coilovers
Full Superpro Bushing replacement
Rotary Extreme Toe links/Trailing Arms
Tanabe F and R Antisway bars
Raceshop 4Pt Rollbar
ATL 13Gallon Fuel Cell
Manual Steering conversion by Chips Motorsports

This project has been in the works for some time now. I feel lucky enough to be able to do this at all, but Im not made of money so its been slow going. I didnt want to start a thread 2 years ago that dragged on forever, but now there is light at the end of the tunnel. Shooting for a completion sometime this coming summer.

First Pics, just parts accumulating...

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=446357
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=446358
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=446359
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=446360
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=446361

(Ive since sold the CCWs..)

A few "Progress" Pics. First is the original engine pull, back in my old tiny garage

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=446362

I had to replace my front core support. This just after I welded the new part in

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=446363

Rear fender rolling. The fronts are shine autos OEM oversize fenders. Cant even tell theyre not factory but have a bit more clearance

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=446364

Looks great. Really interested to follow this. How are the OEM Shine fenders? I have been eying a set since they came out but haven't heard too much about them.

I have them just mocked up right now loosely and the fit seems pretty good so far. May need a bit of adjustment, the drivers one seems to be a bit higher back by the windshield and where it flows into the door, but I haven't spent alot of time fitting them to find out what needs done. The quality is nice, and as I said you really cant tell they arent oem. Ive been focusing alot on other parts of the build so getting all the panels back on precisely is still some time away.

Pics of the fenders being mocked?!! post up man!! haha Sounds like an awesome build! can't wait for progress!

- ap

Also, were the Rx-8 10:1 rotors a recommendation by Logan? Or something you requested. I am curious to see how they do compared to the old FC NA rotors in terms of power. I understand they're a higher comp ratio, I guess I just haven't seen many people going this route. Definitely interested to see how it goes :)

That Mazdaspeed front cover is a nice piece too!

The 10:1 rx-8 rotors were my request. Logan didn't seem to have a problem with them as far as reliability or engine longevity, but neither of us are really sure if there will be any power gain. I'm a bit nervous of them myself, as I know they are for the most part untested, and in some instances actually lost power. They are something I wanted to experiment with, and I'm hoping since we are building a custom intake and exhaust setups we can tune it to optimize whatever different resonances there may be with these vs the fc rotors.

Did they bolt up as factory? How's the fitment? Thanks!

congrats on the build, enjoy and keep the pics coming.

Subscribed. N/A 3 rotor ftw. I would have gone that route if parts, etc. weren't so damn expensive and I had to experiment so much, not to mention CA emissions B.S. we have to deal with out here. Badass concept and car, look forward to seeing it running. Please post pics and vids. Lots of them :)

EDIT: how do you plan on mounting the cobra 8.8? Not sure if you know, but Justin Samberg on norotors.com makes a cradle for it.... I highly recommend him as all of my mounting stuff for the lsx swap was from him.. he's a great fabricator and very good with customer service.

http://www.norotors.com/index.php?topic=126.0

You may have to be a member to view pics. I'll post them here in case you can't see them.

mounting kit:
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...1&d=1320526803

diff cover mod:
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...1&d=1320526803

I already have the Cobra IRS mounted. Well, I did then I pulled it back out to get some stuff powdercoated. I am using one of the first cradles from Jimlab. I am also using a LPW rear diff cover, which gives me a bit of extra capacity, as well as allows you to brace the bearing caps. Picture of that below:

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=446635

Normally aspirated ftw! Can't wait to watch some videos of this beast.

Engine bay prep has been my project for the past couple weeks. Just finished up spraying it today. Excuse the not-so-great pictures.

Before:
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=447180



After:
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=447181

Didnt have that much time to do anything this weekend. I did get my new improved racing swaybar endlinks in, so threw them in the rear. Also dropped the front subframe and steering rack back in, and started putting the suspension pieces back together. Drivers side mostly complete, also a mock up of my brake ducts. Theyll need slightly modified to fit correctly.

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=447383
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=447384
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=447385

looking good!! awesome, keep it up!!!

Wow. This is going to be good. Im so jealous of you guys with garages. Would love to do an entire makeover to my fd.

Been a while since an update. Dont have a whole lot to show picture wise, but some work was done. Got all the suspension/brakes back in the car, and for the first time in years the car hit the ground as a roller. I trailer-ed the car off to DefinedAutoworks over the weekend. So hopefully soon I will be able to update some more.

Off she goes:

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=459097
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=459098

Dropped off at Defined. Its the first time Ive ever taken any of my cars somewhere for work, much less my FD. But Im confident shes in good hands, and sometimes you need to know your own limitations

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=459099

My Engine:
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=459100

^ Nice, great build.

wow wonderfull car, im in progress of a similair build but still tossing and finding out about lots of things.

Like what come's to it when drysumping the 20b.
and stuff about the drivetrain setup.

I keep my eyes on ur's in the meanwhile!
Keep us posted :D
thanks.

go all out and do a semi-p NA build!

There's a few reasons why I decided to stay side port. Mainly, I want this engine to last a long time, and as we all know rpms can be an engine killer, and you need to do alot to prep for the 10k+ rpm to take full advantage of them. My engine is pretty much capable of that anyway, but sticking with a powerband that maxes out in the 8500-9k rpm range should provide all the power I need, and prove reliable for many years to come.

Looking good so far keep the pics coming!

looks very nice. Were did you get those brakes ducts, If you dont mind me asking?

There was a group buy here on the forum a while back. I believe they were a copy of AP racing ducts. Ive actually since ditched them, I wasnt 100% happy with the fitment, and decided to make my own once I get the car back.

While waiting for the guys at Defined to do their thing, Im trying to get my transmission and some other things buttoned up. As I mentioned before, I will be using a Gforce modified T5. T5s from a mustang are practically a dime a doezen, but one issue is length. An FD trans, from bellhousing to center of the shifter is approximately 32 3/4". The usual Mustang T5 is approximately 26 5/8". So as you can see, with the engine mounted at factory location, the T5 shifter would sit about 6" too far forward. This issue can be "fixed" with things like shifter re-locators, but I sort of wanted a more elegant solution. So, after a bit of searching, I discovered that Nissan used a T5 in the 82-83 280ZX Turbos, and in that application they used a different tailhousing with the shifter about 4" further rearward. There is a small issue with these though, as they use a smaller diameter output shaft, and a Gforce gearset will not work. So, I need to yank the tailhousing and send it out to get machined to accept the larger output shaft and seal. So, thats what I did today, removed tailhousing and sent it out for machinework.

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=460898
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https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=460900
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=460901

So, long time no update. We've had a bit of a hang up on the rotors. Having issues getting them back from the shop doing the balancing. Hopefully we can either get them back very soon, or have to send out another set for balancing, and if thats the case they wont be rx8 rotors, Ill have to use the tried and true 9.7:1s. In the meantime, thought I would at least update with some pictures of parts. I also decided to ditch my ABS and booster setup, and go with a dual master manual brake setup.

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=469039
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=469040
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=469041
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=469042
https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=469043

Wow, I can't wait to see this come together!

Thanks Gordon, like I mentioned before it was hard to let someone else take the car and do work on it, especially as intensive as this, but I trust Logan wont do me wrong. :)

Wow I had no idea the old Z cars used a T5. Great idea and I hope it works out.

Awesome build my man. Not that it matters, but my name is Lenny too. We are a rare-ass breed. :)

Haha, yea havent met too many others. And Im actually not using this particular T5. I would have worked, but after talking with the guy a Gforce he recommended against it, being it is an older unit and all bearings,etc are usually NLA and it would just be not as strong. Turns out a T5 from a late 90s/early 00s V6 F-body has almost the exact same shifter placement, so thats what they used as my core.

Looks like its gonna be sick man ive sat shotgun in a couple of na 20b's, drives i will never forget either.

I never knew a car like this existed in Western, PA. Let alone in Burrell hahaha (I work in Tarentum).

Great build, let me know how things are at Defined. I'm thinking of taking my FC there for a TII swap in the future.

^ We'll have to meet up sometime once my cars back on the road. Most likely wont be until next spring at this point. And if you ever want to sell your '88 to maybe just fund a TII purchase, I may be interested.

I don't know when I'll be back, graduating college next year. But you may have seen it around. I work at the car wash under the New Ken. bridge. And I don't think it will ever be for sale lol.

Unfortunately I dont have any new progress to report. I know Logan and the guys at defined have had one or two other large projects to complete, and on top of that there has been more issues with rotors. Those should be sorted now, we've purchased a set of S5 N/A 9.7:1 rotors, and those are currently being scalloped and balanced, and should have them back at any time. Once those are in, Logan said there should be alot of progress very quickly. Lets hope :)
In the meantime, just wanted to post my latest addition...

https://www.rx7club.com/attachment.p...hmentid=477349

Amazing job you are doing here. Great build, I cant wait to see it running!
I sent you a message with a couple of questions that maybe you can answer relating to your build.
take care...
Leo

^ Thanks! I hope to have some progress to report very soon. I have replied to your question via PM.

That plate is awesome.

Haha, thanks. I wanted "3-Rotor", but I think some old geezer with another black N/A FD already took it...

:D

LOVE the pedal box man

Look forward to seeing things progress. Much luck to ya.

Am I the only NA 20b that didn't choose Defined to build their car? Do you have their number BTW, seems their website is down and I want to order a few parts...

Thanks!

Yes you are the only one ;) That is a joke, but maybe not too far off lol. Our website is back up though, send me a PM if you ever need anything and cant see the site for some reason.

Looks like a fantastic build! A few questions:

1. What 7.25" flywheel are you using?

2. Why did you decide on Quartermaster?

I have been looking at a triple organic plate clutch from PPT with a Mazdatrix flywheel and am wondering if I am making the right decision. I am also interested to hear about the drivability of the clutch.

Thanks for sharing the build!

-Andrew

Perhaps Logan can chime in when he gets a chance and answer these questions a bit more specifically. With using the T5 transmission, I personally was a bit unsure of what combinations of clutch/flywheel would work well with my setup. Being that Logan had also had a T5 trans in his own 20B FD, I pretty much just told him what I was looking for in a clutch, and left the choice in his hands.

The flywheel is a Taylor engineering unit. I've used both Taylor and mazdatrix, but mazdatrix is better suited for race only. Taylor uses a steel starter ring gear so it will last longer on repeated startup. Quartermaster is a well known and durable brand. Will take a beating and replacement parts are easy to get. Drivability isn't much different than a non-sprung ACT cerametallic clutch.

I know I already sent you a PM but figured a public answer is good for everyone else too :)

Thanks for posting the reply here, this is where a lot of my research starts. Hearing what other people are using and why always helps me out. Nice work man!

jeez dude, very tasteful build

Is that an old nascar radiator? I just got a $1,500 quote for a radiator and air to air cooler. Not sure if its worth it.