GregW

The guy just gave me a bad guy and I dont think I deserve it. My add said OBO and I told him I would not sell the parts without him saying yay or nay.

Well a few days later I get a local dude offering me $100 more and the night before I have him telling me some bs about why he cant pay at that time becuse of low funds in his paypal account. He "said" he was gonna pay me but I honestly did not bealive him. He also did not want to talk with me on the phone which made me kinda weary of him. I always try to talk to guys on the phone just to put them at ease and me at ease with knowing they are for real.

In my opinion he didnt move on the parts in a timely manner and missed out.

Im not gonna sit and be someones door mat so they can pay me when ever they want.

Its that simple.

I did learn one thing. When you guys are selling stuff, tell the buyer they have 24 hours to produce payment or the deal is totally off and it all starts over.

That way you wont get whiny *** bitches posting you as a bad guy

SpooledupRacing

I think u should have taken your own advise.. it sounds to me like u did not ask him to pay by a certian time. if u did not and u sold it out from under him then that is shaddy business REGARDLESS..

RR has a PERFECT good guy rep he would have never went south on the deal or left u hanging.. u got greedy and thats why u got the bad feedback plain and simple..

ON another note. some people dont keep loads of money on paypal some people have to add funds to the accoutn before they can use it if they dont have a cc and bank account on the account for direct use.. sometimes transactions take time but at the end of the day it is ALWAYS good business to get back to the potential buyer and VERIFY all options before u sell anything from under him/her..

you are in the wrong here I am sorry to say.. You did not conduct a proper business sale.

last thing.. I NEVER talk to anyone on the phone first off I think this is just fine, not saying I wont but then again u can call all over the nation and get stuck talking to somone for 20 minutes and spend 5-10.00 on yoru phone bill over a couple questions..

13b4me

When Kevin Landers says something, he always follows through with it. I can't honestly believe you would think any different, given his status as a reputable businessman, both on and off the forums. He never tries to sugarcoat anything, and will always be straightforward in his dealings. He can be an ******* sometimes, but at least he's an honest *******.

mar3

iTrader: (8)

u got greedy

Bears repeating....YOU GOT GREEDY and broke a deal...you are the jerk. I've been on the side bashing RR and also on the side hoo-raying RR. Both times, he's weathered it well and PM'd me directly on the bad times wondering wuzzup with my intervention. The facts as stated on both threads clearly shows YOU GOT GREEDY.

If a Man ain't good fer his Word, he ain't good fer nothin'...

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

This section of the forum needs some serious moderation. People whining about all kinds of rediculous BS.

Keep it simple. 1st person to pay gets the part and let the buyer know your policy from the get go.

mar3

iTrader: (8)

The Hustle and the Flow...

rx7roller02

let's address this appropriately....

Let's clear one thing up right now--the very instant you tell someone that you will sell them a part, that part is sold to that person. PERIOD. You cant run around with this OBO crap the way you tried to. OBO doesnt mean you get to tell someone they got the part, then change your mind before payment arrives just because aomeone else offered you more. OBO means "I'll take the best offer I get, UP UNTIL THE PART IS DEEMED SOLD. After that, sold means sold."

I agree with the others--you got greedy. When you tell someone the part is theirs, you at that point inherit the obligation to be the responsible seller to them. You failed.

here is your next mistake---why the hell would you not believe Kevin Landers? You have been on this forum for what, six years now? And you dont know enough about this person in that six years to know how far he goes out of his way for everyone in this community? The guy has gone so far over and beyond what any other person or shop does, and he has done it so many times it aint funny. And you have been here to see all of that....but all of a sudden "you honestly didnt believe him"?? Here's a hint--I "honestly" feel that the only reason you just posted that "honestly didnt believe" part was because you wanted more money. Otherwise, it is my experienced opinion that you would have just said "I didnt believe him". But you HONESTLY didnt believe, which says to me that you are already trying to justify your actions.....and you wouldnt need to justify anything if you didnt know you were in the wrong. Kevin Landers is the absolute LAST person on this forum that deserves doubt from anyone in such a situation. I have helped him in the past get money back from someone who scammed him--and I incurred costs on my own in the process, happily so, without asking for or taking a dime of his money. Why? Simple--because he seriously does that much good for fellow 7 owners. you have been here way too long to have that as an excuse.

in my opinion, you had a responsibility to keep communicating with your buyer, and if circumstances were going to change, you had the responsibility of notifying him FIRST, before you double-sold the part. You failed to do two things here--first, you set no limit of doing business with Kevin. It isnt like you set time limit terms on the sale that he broke--you just plain didnt say anything. Second, you had the obligation, no matter what, to at least contact Kevin before agreeing to sell the part the second time, and say "look, someone else wants the part, do you still want it or can I sell it to this guy?"

That is called courtesy. And it would have been so simple to do, and made you look like you had class. oh well.....

Only a complete fool would seriously think that this person would want you to be his door mat. Sincerely. Come on dude, even you dont appear to believe this BS....so why would you expect anyone else to?

I'll tell you whats that simple--

1--you agreed to sell a part to Kevin for a certain price.
2--someone else comes along afterwards and offers you $100 more
3--you saw $$$ and proceeded to tell your original customer nothing....just take the money and run.
4--you then wonder why your original buyer wants to know why you didnt honor your word.....like it is his fault that you cannot communicate like you should.

there, simple...

Having been here for six years, no doubt you have probably heard this before, but I will say it anyways. Kevin is a one-man show. He runs his own shop and spends too much time as it is working to give his customers more than they pay for. I can easily see why talking on the phone is not something he has a lot of time for....the only question is why cant you?

Again, dont come in here and post about how you were so wary of dealing with Kevin. you have been here for six years. I have no doubt at all that you were aware of his reputation before this all took place. I dont believe you for even an instant--know why? Easy--because if you really were this wary of doing business with Kevin, you wouldnt have agreed to do business with Kevin. Dont blow smoke up our asses here. Most of us know better.

You clearly need to learn more. Why is Kevin a whiny bitch? Because you couldnt handle your business like a man? Look---there are some obvious things here. First, Kevin would not reasonably think you were selling him the part unless you told him you were. So, when you whine about waiting for payment, thats because you were not clear enough on your desired terms. I have spoken to Kevin plenty, I know that if you were straight and said " I cannot wait that long for payment, sorry", he would at least respect you for being honest. But you werent....and you dont have any place calling him a whiny bitch because of it.

Class dismissed. Good day.

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

As usual, when the **** hits the fan, all my loyal customers, friends, and people I have never even met or spoken to a day in my life come to my defense. Why is that? I don't even say anything to them or give any nudging to post in my favor. THEY DO IT BECAUSE I AM HONEST. I do what I say I will do. I call it like it is. I call a spade a spade. It might not be PC, or even always very courteous, but people know they can always expect 100% honesty from me whether it be technical advice, work I am doing for them, parts they are buying, parts they are selling, it doesnt matter. The HUNDREDS of positive comments I have on this forum alone should prove that. And think about it...if hundreds of people took the time to type out something on my behalf, what about the hundreds more that are too lazy to actually do so?


Slow? I responded within 24 hours to each pm. Usually more like 6.

No, unlike some people, I cannot spend every waking minute on the computer. I am expected to actually accomplish work at some point in time.

You called me AT 9 ******* OCLOCK ON A SUNDAY NIGHT and you wonder why I did not take the call. HOW RUDE. Nobody wants to do business on a personal or business level on a sunday night.

PM's for those who care to look (some irrelevant and personal info left off):

me: I'll take them right now if you'd do $300 shipped. Pm me your paypal info and I'll get the payment to you immediately.

him: Ok, Ive got my paypal stuff all setup,

Just wanted to verify that your looking at the RE housings right?

me:Yeah, the cosmo housings. What kind of kickass deal will you make me on the s4's you have for sale if I buy all at once?

him:$190 shiped on the S4 housings. If you buy the RE housings for $300

him: <asks for my phone number so he can call me>

me: Alright I'll take 'em all. IF you want to call me tonight the number is 423-748-7977, I'll be available until around midnight EST. I'm usually not available to talk during the day. What do we need to discuss again?

If you want me to wait until we talk to pay, that is fine, but please dont sell them out from under me in the meantime. If you want the money now then let me know and you will have it.

him: Dont worry, Your fist in line on them and Im not gonna sell them untill you say yay or nay

him:
I have everything packaged up. Just nee $490 in the paypal and a shiping address and I can send them out tommrow..... Planning on UPS with tracking.

me:I'll have to send the paypal tomorrow night. I have most of the funds in my account, and the rest in the attatched credit card. However, if I pay you now, it will use up all of my funds in the account before billing any of it to the CC. This is a problem because I have 2 or 3 items to ship via paypal/ups shipping, which requires a balance in the account. So I have to create my labels before I send your money, and I have to pack and weigh the stuff before I can make the labels.

him:I just sold the RE housings for $400 to a local guy. I told him they were sold but waiting on payment but he wanted them bad enough to give me 400. He also bought all my rotors and RE end plates.

Sorry, just could not resist since I dont hafta pay shipping/paypal.

Let me know if you still want the S4 housings.

me: Hmmm, well, I dont really know what to say. I saw this last night right when you sent it, as I was on the computer preparing my shipping stuff and getting ready to send paypal in about 30 more minutes. I guess it kinda annoyed me so I didn't respond at the time, not wanting to say something I shouldn't while in a bad mood, not having thought about what I was going to say.

This is exactly the scenario that I thought of when I said to you earlier "please dont sell them out from under me in the meantime. If you want the money now then let me know and you will have it" to which you replied "Dont worry, Your fist in line on them and Im not gonna sell them untill you say yay or nay".

To me, that sounds like a man's word, a promise, and probably even a written contract, though I'm no legal expert.

I understand about more money and not having to ship. And if the things that were said above had not been said, I'd have absolutely no problem with you doing this. But since you came out and said what you did above, the fact that you turned around and did something else makes you, well, a liar. Before you start saying that I'm calling you names, that is what the dictionary says about a person that says one thing and does another, isn't it?

Feel free to correct me if something is wrong with my observations.

No, I dont want the housings or any of the other parts. I choose not to do business with those of lower ethical standards whenever I know about it.

him: A reply post calling me names and telling me how slow and stupid I am.

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

his last reply:

Ok, Im sorry you feel that way.

I assumed your slow responses and excuse on the credit card/paypal thing was getting close enough to a nay. Extra money and the prospect of missing out on ANY sale moved my view to a nay.

Dont start spouting that sothern man of his word bullshit. If you want something, act like it. I gave you my paypal hours after our initial contact. I assumed you would pay me shortly there after and I even wanted to talk to you on the phone to seal the deal but aparently your to bussy to even pick up a phone.

Its not about extra money, its not about having to ship, its about me missing out on selling these things to anyone let alone you. I honestly did not think you were gonna come through on payin me. Especially after your last excuse. If you want to call me a liar I feel I should be able to call you a slow *** southerner and we can call it even.

Wow, your cool, holy **** ive got repeat people as well. I stick to my word too, but I expect others to move their *** becuse the world does not revolve around them. I wanted to call you and find out what is taking so long but as you stated your too cool to answer any kind of phone during the day.

It dosent sound shady its sounds like the way the free market works.

A deal is complete when you have purchased the goods. Purchace price can be agreed uppon but can change over time the more time the more chance of it changing, especially with slow *** buyers that string things along like the world revolvs arround them. Thats why you move your *** and pay people right away, and if they ask to talk to you on the phone to make sure your for real you do it!

Your welcome to feel however you want. My obsservation is that your not very on top of things.

If your implying that I have low ethacal standars then I have no problem saying **** you.

Honestly, I thought you were jerkin my chain on this deal. Thats why I moved to the next person that was obviously more motivated.

You taught me one thing here. From now on Im telling folks they have 24 hrs to complete payment and after that Im moving on the the next person and negotiation starts over.

Dont bother responding to this as Im gonna delete anything comming from you without reading it.

I choose not to do business with people that confuse their slow actions with others having poor ethics.

Hint hint,... this is how people politely say move your *** or your gonna loose out.... You told me you had money then suddenly your broke. What the hell am I supposed to think.

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

To set a few things straight regarding his replies:

1) I never went more than a few business hours between replies to his PM's. The pm's started friday at 4pm and he sold the housings Monday afternoon. I don't conduct business saturday night or sunday. How is this slow or not communicating?

2) he never gave me his phone number to call. The only message I have from where he called me was 9pm on a sunday night.

3) I never told him I didnt have the money. I told him I needed to create a couple of shipping labels from my account balance before sending the remainder to him, because of the way paypal shipping vs account balance works in paypal. He never said there was a problem with this.

Johny zoom

iTrader: (5)

Like Chuck Norris; Kevin will always come out on top.

telum01

when it comes to business, as soon as a price is agreed on for a part (as this case would be) and both sides accept this, you have a deal. consider this a contract. the buyer is then expected to pay for the part within a reasonable amount of time, and the seller is expected to ship the part within a reasonable amount of time. if the buyer doesn't hold up his end, the seller has every right to move on with another customer. this is all pretty much grey-area, but if you don't have anything specific (either verbal or written), then this is basically law. it's just good business practice to keep each other informed no matter what, *especially* if the deal starts to fall through. selling the part to a someone with a higher offer after making a deal with someone does not give the seller the right to cancel the deal. i don't know either Kevin or Greg personally, but from what i've seen over the years (i was a lurker, er, researcher, long before i picked up my FD and joined the forums), Kevin has done very well at keeping up his end when it comes to business. some of us do everything in our power to maintain the highest standards for our business practices.

personally, when i sell parts i am very verbose about the deal and keep constant communication until the transaction is complete. as soon as we come to an agreement, i start packaging the parts. as soon as i receive payment i ship them. i almost always ship within 24 hrs, usually within just a few hours, but this takes a lot of effort on my part, and i've been to UPS two or three times in one day on numerous occasions. however, i work a night shift and i can usually shift my sleep schedule to afford the time to make those UPS trips. some people, like Kevin, have a business that demands their time and they can't wait around a computer to immediately reply to ever PM they get.

business isn't a hard concept to grasp, as long as you keep your head free of your ***. and even the basics are hard to mess up if you use some common sense. if you (i.e. anyone reading this) are in the wrong, learn your lesson and apply it to the next time you participate in a business transaction. one of the worst mistakes a person can make is trying to justify a mistake. one justification will lead to another, and then another, with each justification for a bigger mistake.

just thought i'd toss in my $.02 since threads like this seem to be so common.

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

Internet king

Fritz Flynn

iTrader: (263)

That will usually hold true but after selling numerous parts on this forum to a wide variety of people 25% of the time the buyer will change his mind so my policy will always be the 1st person to send payment gets the part.

However with that said if Kevin was buying a part me from I'd send it in advance of payment without worries.

Atkins Dan

I copyed this from another thread....

Quote:
Originally Posted by FourtyOunce
Kevin,

Stop wasting your time with these kids.... It's not worth it.
This is one of the main reasons why I stopped selling parts here, and if I do, some discretion is used regarding the buyer.

__________________________________________________ _______________________


This is why I list about 99.9% of the parts I have on E-bay or my online store as it is too hard to sell here on the forums to some people...


AnyWay Kevin is a 100% stand up guy and he will all ways come throu...

Dan

RotaryResurrection

iTrader: (8)

So, Greg, where's your boys at? I mean, you told me in your PM that you had loyal return customers and supporters because you're such an honest guy, so where are they now?

So far, in both threads, everything that has been said, has been said in my favor, or on a neutral basis. Nobody seems to see things your way there, yankee trader! That alone should tell you something. Starting **** with me on this forum is internet sales suicide. You've just owned yourself, thanks for the entertainment.

Heisenberg

iTrader: (3)

Talk about a backfire.

Dont tell sombody you are going to hold a part untill they give you the yes or no. Then just sell it out from under their feet. Thats just plain dishonorable. I understad you got a better offer but just for future reference, dont make promises your not willing to keep.

GregW

New policy is working great, Im on my 3rd sale.... giving them the links to both threads made it very obvious how transactions are gonna work

Want to thank you for getting my stuff noticed

GregW

Very strange thing happend today, Ive gotten two offers for things that are pending....Told them I am waiting on payment. Both openly said "hey, Ill pay ya more, sell them to me"? I told them nope sorry got to wait...

One of two things going on here.....

Your "boys" are having fun with me...

Or buyers actually condone first pay first serve....

which is it??

Welp, Im sticking to my guns on this...As I said, its not worth it.... At least now there is a stated time limit...

jic

iTrader: (1)

its called the teasers

13b4me

Of course buyers, or ones in line anyways, will condone first pay first serve. They want your parts, and if it means the first guy didn't get them, who cares right?

What you did to Kevin was total dick. If someone offers you more for something, you should at least approach Kevin with said potential buyer's offer. Then it's up to him whether he wants to offer you more or not. Kevin never got the chance to say "yay or nay", as you so kindly afforded him. That makes you a liar. Way to be a pretentious *******.

FrankV702

iTrader: (14)

Ive sold a few things on this forum.. And im more the first pay first get person.. Whoever pays first.. gets the part im selling. I wont take dibs on parts like most people call out. But, there is occasions where I would change if a reputable person was inquiring and telling me for sure theyd buy the parts, such as Kevin. Now I dont know Kevin at all but from what I read on his posts on here, and from that I can see he is a very honest and stand up guy. If he was wanting to buy some of my parts, Id send them to him before I recieved payment just because I know he wouldnt rip me off. What you did to him was wrong. Selling parts to get more money right out from under his feet like that, AFTER you know he is a honest guy and told you he would buy them from you was wrong. Sorry, There is no excuse for that.

X-JaVeN-X

i can definitely see where both sides are coming from. If you take reputations out of the equation, I can see where Greg is coming from...I've had buyers flake out on me too that had said they were definitely buying the part and were sending the payment @ a given time....I've turned down other offers during that time period, then had the original person throw out an excuse and no sale.

With that said, put reputations back in the mix, and you have to assume that kevin is going to do what he says.

so yea...i see both sides...and i'm not so sure negative feedback should have been left for either person in this case.

Jager

iTrader: (10)

I'm not that bad Dan.

rx7roller02

thats just it though--you cant take reputations out of it. A person's reputation is all that a seller has in a case like this, dont you think? At that stage, the only thing a seller has to verify the buyer's claim of "I will send payment" is that buyer's proven reputation. How can you take that out?

Additionally, even if you did take it out, this seller clearly gave first nod to Kevin. he then proceeded to change his mind without honoring that first nod. No communication took place from the seller until after he had already sold it to someone else. Now, I know how most of us feel about "dibs", but it is quite clear that this seller chose all by himself to offer such a deal to Kevin. That alone, reputation or no reputation, required this seller to keep to his word. In that, he failed. There is undeniable blame there.