Anyone try using h202(hydrogen peroxide) instead of just water?? I wonder if we could take advantage of that extra oxygen atom or is this just going to cause more problems.

What are your thoughts???

 

This is such a good question I am so interested on the answers

 

I cant comment if it will work any better or not.

But even if it did have added benefit. Still would not use it. The whole idea of water injection is that its cheap, easy and available to anybody straight out of a tap.

 

Hydrogen peroxide is corrosive to metals.

 

I agree that water is cheap, easy, well tested and works amazing. but what if you can take it to the next step....

I have seen a few rockets that use h2o2 as a fuel source after it is pasted through a catalyst. What if any process would we have to go through to use AI on a pump gas powered car??? I read a article last night claiming incresses in cylinder pressures while keeping pre-ignition in check. IE safely adding more boom in the combustion chamber. Has anyone on here played with h202, beside using it on cuts???

I was unaware/ didn't even think about it, that h2o2 is corrosive to metals, I am by no means a chemist, but won't water cause metals to corrode as well?? I guess my question is, "how corrosive is it"?

 

google "T stoff" and you will find out that its not just corrosive to metals
it was used as a rocket propellent ( also for submarines and torpedoes ) during ww2

you will findd that they went to extreme lengths to prevent concentrated T stoff from getting on the pilot and ground crew !!

for your magic elixr,, maybe you should investigate the properties of urea and aqueous NH3

 

T-Stoff - In Detail 2
Hydrogen Peroxide H2O2 80% by Weight
Water H2O 20% by Weight
Stabilisers Phosphoric Acid
Sodium Phosphate
8-Oxyquinoline

The 20% dilution factor was tested by experiment. Walter research indicated that at concentrations greater than 85%, the peroxide would detonate rather than decompose in a controlled fashion.

The additives to the T-Stoff were to stabilise it, preventing it from decomposing during storage.

Walter Werke had also done a lot of research into suitable materials for engine components, as a number of metals will spontaneously decompose T-Stoff. To be avoided, were copper and lead and any organic materials. At least one explosion at the Japanese factory attempting to develop their own copy of the Walter engine, was due to using an organic-based gasket within a pump.

All organic and combustible materials had to be avoided, because contact with the 85% peroxide would cause spontaneous combustion. Peroxide is also extremely caustic and contact with the skin would result in serious burns in seconds. Therefore, during any operations involving the movement or dispensing of T-Stoff, hoses of running water were always on hand to wash away and dilute any accidental spillage.

Materials that could be used, were austenitic steels, aluminium and polyvinylchloride (PVC) products.

SEEMS TO ME THAT THIS IS A CAN OF WORMS I DON'T WANT TO OPEN DUE TO IT BEING TO DAMN DANGEROUS.

 

take a look at the msds on it sometime it really is extremely volatile.

 

I always wanted to try deuterium but I can't find it anywhere...

 

http://www.coleparmer.com/catalog/pr...u=8817586&pfx=

 

You might as well just hook up an o2 bottle..
it really makes no sense to me that nobody has jumped on pure o2 as a replacement for n02, which is only 2/3rds oxygen..

 

It's the reduction of intake temps that is taken advantage of when H2O is injected. The phase change from liquid to gas extracts heat from the air, which lowers temperatures. Besides being corrosive, even 100% H2O2 has a 65% lower heat of vaporization than H2O. This means that it would only be about 2/3 as effective as injecting water & a huge pain to work with.

N2O used in racing is in liquid form. It is stored at very high pressures to maintain this state. When it is released into an intake manifold, it vaporizes, expands and extracts heat from the air around it (heat of vaporization = 376.14 kJ/kg). The release of O2 molecules into the system for combustion is not the only benefit from its use.

In contrast, you would need a bottle of LOX (liquid oxygen), not a bottle of oxygen gas to mimic the effect with O2. But while molecular oxygen does have a higher heat of vaporization (426.25 kJ/kg) than N2O, which would mean further reduction of intake charge temps, it is also HIGHLY volatile. Liquid N20 is much safer, and won't combust if you look at it wrong.

 

Oxygen, in itself, is not combustible. Neither is Nitrous Oxide.

 

Of course not. If you want to put it in explict terms, liquid oxygen is a strong oxidizer that leads to vigorous acceleration of combustion of organic materials. That's straight from the MSDS. N2O is also an oxidizer, but is safer to work with.

I think this quote says it all " If liquid oxygen spills on asphalt or other surfaces contaminated with combustibles, do not walk on or roll equipment over the area of the spill." - Harvard Chemistry Dept./ Air Products. http://www-safety.deas.harvard.edu/services/oxygen.html

 

Thanks for sharing you knowledge.

 

Petroleum products are prone to spontaneous combustion when in the presence of pure oxygen. The beauty of N20 is that it stays inert until the heat of combustion breaks apart the molecules, releasing oxygen and nitrogen. The nitrogen then acts as a buffer to combustion, making it more stable.

 

Thanks! I ordered some. I'll post some result when I finish the containment tank.

 

well that explains it then

 

H2O2 is a monopropellant in rocketry. Release of the extra Oxygen atom in the presence of a catalyst is a highly exothermic reaction, which means that it releases a lot of heat that, in sufficient concentration, will vaporizer the water creating steam that produces thrust without any other chemicals needed. The uses are typically low impulse forces, such as maneuvering thrusters in space, not rocket launch thrust. A few years ago, in the previous Chinese Olympics, a man flew around the Olympic stadium with a peroxide rocket thruster back pack. The effect of releasing the oxygen atom produces heat,, quite the opposite of a cooling effect. The concentration for the flying trick generated about 900 degree C superheated steam. Using a hydrogen peroxide injector with a catalytic nozzle in place of the spark plug in your rotary engine would run in either direction without any other fuel. Without a proper one way anti backup valve directing the peroxide out of the injector, the catalyst could conceivably convert all of your peroxide to superheated steam and create quite a powerful explosion in rupturing your peroxide storage tank.

 

We’ll I feel better now that a useless and forgotten 13 year old thread was resurrected and you were able to answer questions no one was asking any longer.