Furb

iTrader: (2)

that is some decent info, thnx guys!
im really new to all this and want to learn more..

what kind of temperature drops (both IAT and EGT) are usual for this type of application?
most important issue for me is safety.. my engine is lasting over 6 years now, due to a lot of safety mods. it has dealt with detonation, running lean, boostcreep and never gave up!
or maybe i am just lucky.. :p

i like thinking different and i would be the first rotary in Holland running WI

regardless the fact that i want safety, i like to keep options open
if i should decide in the future to set up a high boost setting, like 20 psi, how much water would be needed then?

so correct me if i'm thinking all wrong, but i want to know the basics..
with your mech system running a certain nozzle, if you run more boost, you get slightly more water due to the higher pressure right?
but that wont be enough to compensate for the higher amount of boost right?

Furb

iTrader: (2)

hows that turbo performing with a streetport?
what rpms does it spool and when are you on full boost?
and how about hp/tq?

just curious.. still debating what to do if my engine ever dies

thnx dude

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

I have a couple of guys running the systems trunk mounted, but haven't heard back with their results. Using the check valve will keep the pressure up and keep the response time up when letting off the gas and getting back on, the only other issue would be the 20+ foot of hoses and any pressure losses associated with it. Probably not enough hose to make a big difference, but something to consider anyways. I can get black hose, but the standard fittings have blue on them. That's where most of the cost comes from in the "upgraded kit" is the stainless steel push lock fittings.

I don't monitor EGT's but I've heard 100-150 degree drop in temps can be expected. Will running higher boost null and voids this? I have no idea, but my engine and turbo are still holding together.

At 20 psi I like to run between 500-600cc/min. You could get by with less, or run more but this amount seems to work nicely. I can't comment on an application running 30+ psi, so far no one running my system has pushed it that far. But from 10 psi on up to mid-high 20's the same nozzle works great and kills any knock. It also has the option of turning it down with the meter control valve if so desired. Since water isn't a fuel you can run a vast difference in the amount of water you decide to run without majorly effecting the tune. You could run a little and still have a considerable amount of cooling, or if your ignition can handle it you can run massive amounts of water. I run in the middle area and it works really well. I would say my engine is more reliable at 25 psi on water then it was at 15 psi without water.

To calculate additional flow from higher pressure use the formula: sqrt of new pressure divided by old pressure, multiplied by old flow = new flow.

So if the nozzle is set to 550cc/min at 20 psi what will if flow at 25 psi? (SQRT 25 /20 x 550= 688) That's nearly a 150cc/min increase.

94touringFD

iTrader: (30)

I put this kit in last year and and am a big fan of it thus far
I haven't pushed things yet so I don't have data, just my opinion so far as a consumer.

Furb

iTrader: (2)

good info, thnx

then i will keep options open and use a 500-600 nozzle like you.
so this meter control valve is part of the kit?
and does it actually control the amount of water or reduce the air pressure?


i also like the idea of using a check valve to keep pressure up inside the tank. it will help atomisation if pressure iis a little higher i guess

BurntOrangeT2

iTrader: (30)

Top right connection is for air. Bottom left connection is water supply. Notice the threaded "piston" looking part on the bottom left, you adjust this for amount of water desired.




Notice the light grey line closest to the turbo on the boost pipe? That is your atomization feed, it mixes with the water at the nozzle and thus creates atomization. Therefor fine tuning the amount of water at the desired PSI is key.




Hope all this helps.

- Cory

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

Thanks butntoranget2 for pulling up the pics.

The meter control valve is part of the kit and adjusts the water flow, air pressure is adjusted by the turbo. If you decide to run a check valve make sure the boost switch is not T'ed into the tank, otherwise the first time the tank is pressurized the solenoid will open and keep draining the tank until it drops to 8-10 psi. Atomization will be the same with the check valve, the only difference is the time it will take to get the tank pressurized. Basically the lag time of the system. With short lines it's not an issue, but it could be with a trunk mount, I just haven't tested long lines to see what the result is. A check valve with 1/8" npt would be ideal.

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

BurntOrangeT2 ^*** Sorry I was replying from my iphone and just noticed I goobered up your name.

Thought I would post pics of a dual nozzle kit I made for a forum member. It has the larger 2.5 Gallon tank. Pics are shown without the lower fitting installed to keep the tank sitting flat for pics. He will probably do a writeup once he gets it in.

Click for bigger view.

just startn

iTrader: (33)

What is the reason for 2 nozzles? Is it a FD w/ twins still?

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

Yeah twin turbo. I think he said they are upgraded but I don't know for sure.

-==L=a=N=c=E==-

whats one of your kits worth?

just startn

iTrader: (33)

wannaspeed.com

$400.00

Ball joint

iTrader: (6)

I purchased the kit. It's going to be used on Non-sequential BNR stage 3's. I'll post a write up when it's complete. Still waiting on the BNR's.

just startn

iTrader: (33)

Oh wow, your the one that bought the twin nozzel setup. LMK when you get them i want to see!!!

Ball joint

iTrader: (6)

I'm still waiting on the BNR's before I finish the installation, but I've already mounted the tank and am trying to figure out how I'm going to mount the Nozzle's. Her's my impression so far.

The 2.5 gallon tank fits where the stock battery went. It's a tight fit, but it fits in the stock battery tray and you can use the stock battery tie down bracket to hold the tank down. Although, you do have to cut out a chunk of the battery tray to make clearance for the water line connector.

The biggest problem that I'm running into is mounting the dual nozzles. The intake piping is 2.5" which is too small to mount the nozzle in the pipe. You could do it, but it restricts the airflow in the pipe by about 50%. The standard K&N filters that everyone runs are too small to fit the nozzle inside of it and the plastic at the end of the filter is too thick to drill a hole and insert the nozzle. What I'm going to do is run velocity stacks instead of air filters and fabricate a bracket that will mount the nozzle in front of the velocity stack. I'll insert a mesh screen in between the velocity stack and intake pipe to make sure rocks and junk don't get sucked in. I'll post pictures when I'm all done.

Dudeman: How did you hook up your system to a air compressor to measure the flow of the system? I know you run compressed air to the tank, but do you also run compressed air to the injection nozzles as well? Thanks.

just startn

iTrader: (33)

hat I'm going to do is run velocity stacks instead of air filters and fabricate a bracket that will mount the nozzle in front of the velocity stack. I'll insert a mesh screen in between the velocity stack and intake pipe to make sure rocks and junk don't get sucked in. I'll post pictures when I'm all done.

EXACTLY what im going to do.

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

To test the flow of the system I only pressurize the tank. No need to have the atomizing line hooked up for flow testing purposes.

Slides

That is not what the air atomiser flow charts I have looked at say. With different air to water pressure ratios the flow rates vary significantly, so if you have no air pressure when you test it you will be getting less with the air on.

I saved specs from a couple of manufacturers somewhere and with slight variations from below to above 1:1 water to air ratio there is significant difference, compared to zero air pressure I imagine it would be sizable. The higher the pressure the more noticeable the effect was.

Jobro

iTrader: (2)

You are looking at the wrong flow charts. Specifically you are reading ones for internal mix whereas we all use external mix jets.

Slides

You are right.


Have any of you tried the internal mix type?

I have a few different caps & jets here (internal & external mix), I might have a play & see what I like best.

Jobro

iTrader: (2)

I saw an old rice racing kit that used an internal mix jet. Upon trawling through all the cataloges external mix jets work from lower air pressures.

If the manufacturer says 3psi for the external mix and 8psi for the internal mix (can't remember exact details) much safer choice to use the external mix and switch it on above say 7psi. I used to use TPS above 60% I believe. I have a responsive turbo setup and it will always have good pressure on the turbo outlet if the throttle is above 60%.

Ball joint

iTrader: (6)

So I finally made some progress on the dual nozzle pre-turbo water injection setup. Like I said before, finding a place to mount the nozzles before the twin's was challenging and I ended up having to mount them before some velocity stacks. Here's some pictures of the setup so far.

large 2.5 gallon tank mounted in stock battery location. I tapped the Greddy elbow for the pressure lines going to the tank and nozzles. I'm going to tee the air line going to the dual nozzles.




These are the velocity stacks that I ordered from Velocity Stacks Online. After looking at many velocity stacks it's hard to find one that's 2.5" and doesn't bevel out to some ridicules 6" or more. These are 4" in diameter which means that they will clear the hood. Here's the link http://www.velocitystacksonline.com/product/B154-131



Next up was to fabricate some brackets to hold the nozzles above the velocity stack. I ordered some sheet aluminum from Mcmaster.com and was able to create four identical brackets using simple hand tools.



Put it all together and this was the final product. A T-bolt clamp is holding the brackets inside the silicone coupler and the push-lock fittings are tightened through the brackets.



I'll write another update when I get everything back together on the car.

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

Awesome work so far, great job. Look forward to seeing the finished results

Ball joint

iTrader: (6)

The install is finished! The velocity stacks barely fit and I had to bend part of the stack to clear the hood. In the end it came out well. I'll report back with power numbers after I get the car tuned.

Ball joint

iTrader: (6)

Engine Bay.