E85 vs AI
#1
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E85 vs AI
So most of you know that most of the characteristics of e85 are pros but how do yall think it compares with ai, wi etc.? I love the idea of e85 but honestly I'd wanna keep my car a DD. Or is there anyone who DD's there e85 car? Please share.
For example
e85: Almost 100% detonation proof
Big reliable power safely
Car usually becomes a weekend warrior
AI: Can make running high boost very safe
Also big reliable power
Car can stay a DD
Adding ai can make another place for failure
Please add more pros and cons to the two, I know theres many more but I couldn't think of em. I couldn't find a thread comparing the two so I just made one, and I know posting it here I'll probably get more people in favor of e85 but humor me anyway please. Thank you.
For example
e85: Almost 100% detonation proof
Big reliable power safely
Car usually becomes a weekend warrior
AI: Can make running high boost very safe
Also big reliable power
Car can stay a DD
Adding ai can make another place for failure
Please add more pros and cons to the two, I know theres many more but I couldn't think of em. I couldn't find a thread comparing the two so I just made one, and I know posting it here I'll probably get more people in favor of e85 but humor me anyway please. Thank you.
Last edited by audoetuk; 12-05-12 at 12:57 PM.
#2
yessir
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E85 vs AI is really location location location. If you don't have an E85 station in town, you will be making compromises to use e85.
And another place for failure isn't too bad, most already have hundreds of places of failure.
And another place for failure isn't too bad, most already have hundreds of places of failure.
#3
tard of teh century
I agree on the location. I know some people around Chicago daily e85 cars, worse comes to worse you can always put gas in it and just run a different map. Though you take a huge hit on mileage with e85 which means you'll be going to the pump more often as well.
#4
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Thank you very much for the input, I live a good 10-15mins from an e85 pump, I have a lil suv that I daily, and didn't really plan to daily this 7 as much as my suv so that's two points for e85 so far.
#7
Racing Rotary Since 1983
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"what is the actual mileage difference from using e85 compared to normal petrol on average"
Gasoline 116,090 BTUs per gallon
E85 82,300 BTUs per gallon
E85 mileage should be 71% of gas.
hc
Gasoline 116,090 BTUs per gallon
E85 82,300 BTUs per gallon
E85 mileage should be 71% of gas.
hc
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#9
Racing Rotary Since 1983
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i will stir the pot a bit more w another option.....
i plan to run half E85 and half gasoline for all track and dyno events.
there is a point of diminishing returns between the replacement of gasoline w E85.
yes, you gain higher octane and and cooling w ethanol but you lose BTUs per volume.
you also have to run lots more injector capacity, pump capacity and perhaps larger lines...
mix the two equally and you may be able to get what you want.
the primary issue is the real world need for two maps (gas and E85), and a computer that will interpolate between the two based on fuel composition... which necessitates a FFS.
the benefits could be large.
Luke tuned out a Genesis coupe turbo 4 (GT3076) at 420 on pump/AI
he then drained the tank, filled it w half pump and half E60 (winter in Green Bay is E60)
he then tuned the Genesis out at 570.
the motor was in the exact spot in relation to knock on pump at 420 as it was on the blend at 570.
case closed for me.
howard
i plan to run half E85 and half gasoline for all track and dyno events.
there is a point of diminishing returns between the replacement of gasoline w E85.
yes, you gain higher octane and and cooling w ethanol but you lose BTUs per volume.
you also have to run lots more injector capacity, pump capacity and perhaps larger lines...
mix the two equally and you may be able to get what you want.
the primary issue is the real world need for two maps (gas and E85), and a computer that will interpolate between the two based on fuel composition... which necessitates a FFS.
the benefits could be large.
Luke tuned out a Genesis coupe turbo 4 (GT3076) at 420 on pump/AI
he then drained the tank, filled it w half pump and half E60 (winter in Green Bay is E60)
he then tuned the Genesis out at 570.
the motor was in the exact spot in relation to knock on pump at 420 as it was on the blend at 570.
case closed for me.
howard
#10
Enthusiast
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AEM has a flex fuel system that will calculate the 'blend' of fuel passing through and the tuner can adapt their map as such...the turbo BMW guys have started to give it a shot but I don't know of anyone who has perfected it yet. Sounds like the best of both worlds to me, then spary a little bit of WI on top of that and you're almost bullet proof until you find the next weak link.
AEM Infinity Stand-Alone Engine Management System - 30-710 - Modern Automotive Performance
AEM Infinity Stand-Alone Engine Management System - 30-710 - Modern Automotive Performance
#11
The king of the highway!
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E85 daily driver here with 700hp... 3 in (super quiet) exhaust... AC, power steering.... & smoke zr1's whenever i feel the need to put corvettes in there place
& when i mean daily drive i mean everyday i go to work.... i use the car for what its for
oh and my temps are around 170F... and 190F with the ac on
& when i mean daily drive i mean everyday i go to work.... i use the car for what its for
oh and my temps are around 170F... and 190F with the ac on
#12
Rising of the Phoenix
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That’s the beauty of the some of the current aftermarket EMS like my ProEfi, the ability to manage pump gas to E85 and everything in-between. I can’t wait to get my can running!
Blowing by the likes of ZR1’s and such must generate a lot of bitter looks…
Blowing by the likes of ZR1’s and such must generate a lot of bitter looks…
#13
Living on the North Coast
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AEM has a flex fuel system that will calculate the 'blend' of fuel passing through and the tuner can adapt their map as such...the turbo BMW guys have started to give it a shot but I don't know of anyone who has perfected it yet. Sounds like the best of both worlds to me, then spary a little bit of WI on top of that and you're almost bullet proof until you find the next weak link.
AEM Infinity Stand-Alone Engine Management System - 30-710 - Modern Automotive Performance
AEM Infinity Stand-Alone Engine Management System - 30-710 - Modern Automotive Performance
#14
The king of the highway!
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YA BUT its 100% e85. No 95/85 mix.... so its just as having a pump gas stock fd.....filling up as if i look stock. Until i burn the Nitto Nt03 tires.
i try to keep it stock with the looks but when you have some big 40mm drag radial tires in the back they know i must have them on for a reason.
#15
Viper Eater
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YA BUT its 100% e85. No 95/85 mix.... so its just as having a pump gas stock fd.....filling up as if i look stock. Until i burn the Nitto Nt03 tires.
i try to keep it stock with the looks but when you have some big 40mm drag radial tires in the back they know i must have them on for a reason.
i try to keep it stock with the looks but when you have some big 40mm drag radial tires in the back they know i must have them on for a reason.
#16
Committee Member #2
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i will stir the pot a bit more w another option.....
i plan to run half E85 and half gasoline for all track and dyno events.
there is a point of diminishing returns between the replacement of gasoline w E85.
yes, you gain higher octane and and cooling w ethanol but you lose BTUs per volume.
you also have to run lots more injector capacity, pump capacity and perhaps larger lines...
mix the two equally and you may be able to get what you want.
the primary issue is the real world need for two maps (gas and E85), and a computer that will interpolate between the two based on fuel composition... which necessitates a FFS.
the benefits could be large.
Luke tuned out a Genesis coupe turbo 4 (GT3076) at 420 on pump/AI
he then drained the tank, filled it w half pump and half E60 (winter in Green Bay is E60)
he then tuned the Genesis out at 570.
the motor was in the exact spot in relation to knock on pump at 420 as it was on the blend at 570.
case closed for me.
howard
i plan to run half E85 and half gasoline for all track and dyno events.
there is a point of diminishing returns between the replacement of gasoline w E85.
yes, you gain higher octane and and cooling w ethanol but you lose BTUs per volume.
you also have to run lots more injector capacity, pump capacity and perhaps larger lines...
mix the two equally and you may be able to get what you want.
the primary issue is the real world need for two maps (gas and E85), and a computer that will interpolate between the two based on fuel composition... which necessitates a FFS.
the benefits could be large.
Luke tuned out a Genesis coupe turbo 4 (GT3076) at 420 on pump/AI
he then drained the tank, filled it w half pump and half E60 (winter in Green Bay is E60)
he then tuned the Genesis out at 570.
the motor was in the exact spot in relation to knock on pump at 420 as it was on the blend at 570.
case closed for me.
howard
When they retuned the Genesis on the mixer, was it on the same computer/dyno/settings as when they tuned on pump ? If they made changes what exactly did they change ?
I actually find it interesting as I was talking with a buddy of mine and I told him I wanted to try mixing 1/2 tank of 93 with 1/2 tank of E85 to see how the FD would run. I just haven't done so out of fear it may cause an issue.
Thanks
#18
Living on the North Coast
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The key thing to remember about E85 is that depending on your region of the country and the season of the year, the Ethanol content is not always the same. Some times is can be E70 or even E60. So even if you always fill up at the E85 pump, it still would be smart to have the Ethanol content sensor along with an ECU that can read the sensors input signal and programming to compensate for the changes in the fuel automatically.
#22
The king of the highway!
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synthetic is the best for premix.... I use Amsoil but its pretty expensive
i think your going to be my biggest fan... who follows me everywhere & answers all my questions...
i think your going to be my biggest fan... who follows me everywhere & answers all my questions...
#24
Racing Rotary Since 1983
iTrader: (6)
"When they re-tuned the Genesis w half pump and half E60, was it on the same computer/dyno/settings as when they tuned on pump ? If they made changes what exactly did they change ?"
i can check w Luke to give you that info but primarily the additional 150 hp came from being able to increase boost w no detonation.... due to the alcohol.
hc
i can check w Luke to give you that info but primarily the additional 150 hp came from being able to increase boost w no detonation.... due to the alcohol.
hc
#25
FD Project
iTrader: (58)
"When they re-tuned the Genesis w half pump and half E60, was it on the same computer/dyno/settings as when they tuned on pump ? If they made changes what exactly did they change ?"
i can check w Luke to give you that info but primarily the additional 150 hp came from being able to increase boost w no detonation.... due to the alcohol.
hc
i can check w Luke to give you that info but primarily the additional 150 hp came from being able to increase boost w no detonation.... due to the alcohol.
hc
Nice
I just started testing with 50% fuel/E85 on my second fuel map, right of the bat had to add 30 more fuel after only idling for 2 minutes in order to keep car at steady idle.