SPA gauges, opinions and sugestions... also how to dash install...
03-02-05, 12:27 AM
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SPA gauges, opinions and sugestions... also how to dash install...
Well i was searching around the forums and a qestions that i have been wondering about for some time was finally answerd. is it possible to make a 52mm gauge fit in the stock gauge location? the coolant temp gauge isnt accurate and the oil psi gauge seems a bit flaky some times, so why not replace them with gauges that work. well the answer is yes its possible. (here is the link: http://maxcooper.com/rx7/how-to/spa_gauges/index.html )
So my questions now are how well do these gauges work and do they need a controller like the defi gauges? Does the red background color match the red lighting of the stock gauges? Also in the install i noticed that they had a fuel psi w/ water temp and oil temp w/ oil psi but when i got on gotham i didnt see either of the two gauges. And if spa made them i think i would want water and oil temp in one and fuel and oil psi in the other. And my final question is there any other sites besides gotham that carry them, so i could match prices, the only other ones i have found i coulnt read (not in english).
--Thanks in advance, Arron
So my questions now are how well do these gauges work and do they need a controller like the defi gauges? Does the red background color match the red lighting of the stock gauges? Also in the install i noticed that they had a fuel psi w/ water temp and oil temp w/ oil psi but when i got on gotham i didnt see either of the two gauges. And if spa made them i think i would want water and oil temp in one and fuel and oil psi in the other. And my final question is there any other sites besides gotham that carry them, so i could match prices, the only other ones i have found i coulnt read (not in english).
--Thanks in advance, Arron
03-02-05, 01:18 AM
#2
You can buy the gauges from lots of places, including direct from SPA:
http://spatechnique.com/ (includes a complete list of the gauge combinations)
http://pegasusautoracing.com/group.asp?GroupID=SPADUAL
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...=Google+Search (lots of options)
There are thermocouples for sale on the SPA page, but each gauge comes complete with a wiring harness, pushbutton switches, and sensors -- you don't need to buy anything else for the gauge itself. Pegasus sells the sensors separately in case you need a replacement.
The SPA gauges work well. I don't like digital gauges for things like boost that change often and that I want to watch. But for other things, digital is adequate or even preferable. For instance, I can't lie to myself about water temps because "210" is "210" rather than some needle position that I might talk myself into being lower than I really remember. Also, the SPA gauges record peaks for all the readings, and allow both an internal alarm (bright LED) and an external alarm that you can hook up to something else (another light, a buzzer) if you want. All the alarms can be configured independently (reading 1 internal, r1 ext, r2 int, r2 ext). You can also choose the units you want. You'll need to mount the buttons for the gauges to recall (or reset) the peaks and do the programming. I had mine mounted next to the gauge in an a-pillar mount before moving them into the dash. Now I have the buttons mounted lower on the dash, next to some LEDs I used to relocate the low oil and water levels alarms that used to be in the stock gauges that I replaced. You can also adjust the backlight color, brightness, sample rate, etc. -- lots of options, but they have sane defaults and you don't have to mess with the more detailed settings if you don't want to.
The senders thread right into the stock WP and OP ports without re-tapping, and I haven't had any leaks. For oil temp, you need to get the sender into the flow of the oil (and not just at the end of a hose). I used a T fitting in one of my aftermarket oil lines for that and it seems to be working well. I think GReddy makes a sensor block that fits under the stock oil filter that would also work -- I looked at the offerings from Racing Beat initially, but they didn't have anything that worked for the FD. You might be able to tap one of the banjo bolts for oil readings, too. For fuel pressure, the sender can thread into the 1/8 NPT port on an aftermarket regulator, but I used some brass fittings and some 1/4" fuel injection hose to remote-mount mine on the fender near my FPR because it sticks out too far for my installation with it threaded directly into the FPR. If you have the stock FPR, you can tap into the line that feeds the primary rail. I had it plumbed like that before using a 1/4 NPT female T, two 1/4 NPT to 5/16" hose barb brass fittings, and a 1/4" NPT to 1/8" NPT adapter that I threaded the sensor into. I also grounded the T fitting with a wire to the firewall, but I am not sure that is necessary (in hindsight, I don't think the ground was needed).
I have had a few issues. The water temp sender goes bad periodically, but it is cheap ($30) to replace and it is obvious when it happens (really wacky readings and/or "fault" displayed). I've never had a pressure sender go bad (thankfully -- they are $100 each!
). Also, while SPA has apparently corrected this issue in the current gauges, the ones I have in my dash currently become difficult or impossible to read when the gauge display unit gets hot. Sun on dash turns the display black and completely unreadable. Even using the heater on a cool night starts to make the displays harder to read. However, you can identify the newer displays easily as they have switchable illumination (red or pale green), where the older ones were all pale green. There might be some even older ones that were only red, but they would be >5 years old at this point. Anything you buy now will almost certainly be new stock, but you can verify this by asking if they have switchable red/green illumination. I have some of the newer displays now and will install them when I get time, but I haven't tested them out for heat issues yet. The heat issue was one of the specific issues the newer displays are supposed to address -- I did power them up just to see how red they are, and they are very red (even though they look amber on the SPA web site) -- they won't match the amber illumination of the stock gauges. But the stock display has some red elements (warning lights) and they should look a lot better than my pale green ones from a "visual integration" standpoint.
They only come in so many different configurations, and most have one pressure and one temperature reading (though there are some other choices). The OP/OT and FP/WT gauges covered the things I wanted to read, so those are the ones I chose. I guess it makes sense to have two temps together in one gauge and two pressures in the other, but the pairing of OT and OP has a certain logic to it as well. I would be happy with either set of pairings.
-Max
http://spatechnique.com/ (includes a complete list of the gauge combinations)
http://pegasusautoracing.com/group.asp?GroupID=SPADUAL
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...=Google+Search (lots of options)
There are thermocouples for sale on the SPA page, but each gauge comes complete with a wiring harness, pushbutton switches, and sensors -- you don't need to buy anything else for the gauge itself. Pegasus sells the sensors separately in case you need a replacement.
The SPA gauges work well. I don't like digital gauges for things like boost that change often and that I want to watch. But for other things, digital is adequate or even preferable. For instance, I can't lie to myself about water temps because "210" is "210" rather than some needle position that I might talk myself into being lower than I really remember. Also, the SPA gauges record peaks for all the readings, and allow both an internal alarm (bright LED) and an external alarm that you can hook up to something else (another light, a buzzer) if you want. All the alarms can be configured independently (reading 1 internal, r1 ext, r2 int, r2 ext). You can also choose the units you want. You'll need to mount the buttons for the gauges to recall (or reset) the peaks and do the programming. I had mine mounted next to the gauge in an a-pillar mount before moving them into the dash. Now I have the buttons mounted lower on the dash, next to some LEDs I used to relocate the low oil and water levels alarms that used to be in the stock gauges that I replaced. You can also adjust the backlight color, brightness, sample rate, etc. -- lots of options, but they have sane defaults and you don't have to mess with the more detailed settings if you don't want to.
The senders thread right into the stock WP and OP ports without re-tapping, and I haven't had any leaks. For oil temp, you need to get the sender into the flow of the oil (and not just at the end of a hose). I used a T fitting in one of my aftermarket oil lines for that and it seems to be working well. I think GReddy makes a sensor block that fits under the stock oil filter that would also work -- I looked at the offerings from Racing Beat initially, but they didn't have anything that worked for the FD. You might be able to tap one of the banjo bolts for oil readings, too. For fuel pressure, the sender can thread into the 1/8 NPT port on an aftermarket regulator, but I used some brass fittings and some 1/4" fuel injection hose to remote-mount mine on the fender near my FPR because it sticks out too far for my installation with it threaded directly into the FPR. If you have the stock FPR, you can tap into the line that feeds the primary rail. I had it plumbed like that before using a 1/4 NPT female T, two 1/4 NPT to 5/16" hose barb brass fittings, and a 1/4" NPT to 1/8" NPT adapter that I threaded the sensor into. I also grounded the T fitting with a wire to the firewall, but I am not sure that is necessary (in hindsight, I don't think the ground was needed).
I have had a few issues. The water temp sender goes bad periodically, but it is cheap ($30) to replace and it is obvious when it happens (really wacky readings and/or "fault" displayed). I've never had a pressure sender go bad (thankfully -- they are $100 each!
). Also, while SPA has apparently corrected this issue in the current gauges, the ones I have in my dash currently become difficult or impossible to read when the gauge display unit gets hot. Sun on dash turns the display black and completely unreadable. Even using the heater on a cool night starts to make the displays harder to read. However, you can identify the newer displays easily as they have switchable illumination (red or pale green), where the older ones were all pale green. There might be some even older ones that were only red, but they would be >5 years old at this point. Anything you buy now will almost certainly be new stock, but you can verify this by asking if they have switchable red/green illumination. I have some of the newer displays now and will install them when I get time, but I haven't tested them out for heat issues yet. The heat issue was one of the specific issues the newer displays are supposed to address -- I did power them up just to see how red they are, and they are very red (even though they look amber on the SPA web site) -- they won't match the amber illumination of the stock gauges. But the stock display has some red elements (warning lights) and they should look a lot better than my pale green ones from a "visual integration" standpoint.They only come in so many different configurations, and most have one pressure and one temperature reading (though there are some other choices). The OP/OT and FP/WT gauges covered the things I wanted to read, so those are the ones I chose. I guess it makes sense to have two temps together in one gauge and two pressures in the other, but the pairing of OT and OP has a certain logic to it as well. I would be happy with either set of pairings.
-Max
Last edited by maxcooper; 03-02-05 at 01:23 AM.
03-02-05, 01:27 AM
#3
I see the temp senders are $50 now instead of $30. Mine used to go bad every year, but my current one has lasted longer. Maybe they improved them to be more durable or something.
-Max
-Max
03-02-05, 04:19 PM
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does anyone have the newer gauges installed and if so do they still have the heat issue the max was talking about? and if anyone has some pic with the lights on that would be nice too.
--Arron
--Arron
03-03-05, 12:42 AM
#7
No, most people complain about the price and don't consider it as two gauges in one.
I've got the same SPA gauges as Max, purchased in 2002 so the backlight is switchable b/t green and red. You can get them with a chrome ring now.
Mine are mounted in a 3-gauge DIN holder above the stereo. No problems with the heat. See pic at http://ourworld.cs.com/_ht_a/talvendi/id194.htm
I used an Aluminum plate sandwhiched b/t the block and oil filter pedistal to tap for the oil press/temp senders. Racing Beat has a 1st gen part for this that will work on the FD but uou have to unplug the TPS when changing the oil filter.
Jack
I've got the same SPA gauges as Max, purchased in 2002 so the backlight is switchable b/t green and red. You can get them with a chrome ring now.
Mine are mounted in a 3-gauge DIN holder above the stereo. No problems with the heat. See pic at http://ourworld.cs.com/_ht_a/talvendi/id194.htm
I used an Aluminum plate sandwhiched b/t the block and oil filter pedistal to tap for the oil press/temp senders. Racing Beat has a 1st gen part for this that will work on the FD but uou have to unplug the TPS when changing the oil filter.
Jack
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03-06-05, 12:47 AM
#8
Nice setup Jack! The IC/piping/fuel system/etc all looks to be very nicely done.
I snapped a few pictures of my gauge setup tonight. I've got the two old-style (green illumination only) SPA gauges in there, a PFS (SPI) analog boost gauge in the RE steering column pod, and a Tech Edge wideband Velcro-ed to the dash to the right of the steering column. See below for pics...
-Max
I snapped a few pictures of my gauge setup tonight. I've got the two old-style (green illumination only) SPA gauges in there, a PFS (SPI) analog boost gauge in the RE steering column pod, and a Tech Edge wideband Velcro-ed to the dash to the right of the steering column. See below for pics...
-Max
Last edited by maxcooper; 03-06-05 at 12:50 AM.
03-06-05, 09:12 AM
#9
PM "Maxpesce"
He has done an in-dash conversion to different gauges. He has some pics in his "garage"
https://www.rx7club.com/vbgarage.php?do=view&id=2939
He has done an in-dash conversion to different gauges. He has some pics in his "garage"
https://www.rx7club.com/vbgarage.php?do=view&id=2939
03-07-05, 12:13 AM
#10
Originally Posted by maxcooper
Nice setup Jack! The IC/piping/fuel system/etc all looks to be very nicely done.
-Max
-Max
Jack
03-07-05, 10:27 AM
#11
Ex fd *****
Originally Posted by adam c
PM "Maxpesce"
He has done an in-dash conversion to different gauges. He has some pics in his "garage"
https://www.rx7club.com/vbgarage.php?do=view&id=2939
He has done an in-dash conversion to different gauges. He has some pics in his "garage"
https://www.rx7club.com/vbgarage.php?do=view&id=2939
FD3SR1
I have 3 AutoMeter Sport Comp (52mm) gauges mounted in the stock dash (see pics at link above and details in this thread:
https://www.rx7club.com/forum/showth...hreadid=199139
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