oo7arkman

iTrader: (2)

This past weekend I installed my exedy twin plate and fw. The job wasn't that bad but I almost never got that stupid fw nut off of there.... Anyways the car drives fine, shifts into every gear fine both accelerating and decellerating but when I come to a complete stop and then try and put it into gear it doesn't want to go into gear very easily... Kinda strange. Same thing when I first go out to the car and try and put it in reverse. Can anyone shed some light on this? Thanks.

bryant

you may need to bleed your system again??

FCNAred

iTrader: (2)

you might also need to adjust some dead space out of your clutch pedal to make sure it is full disengaging the clutch. I had a similar issue with my OS giken twin plate.

njstreetrx7

ADJUST UR CLUTCH PEDAL.......i had this same problem after my clutch install....then my friend adjusted it and now perfect

oo7arkman

iTrader: (2)

So I took the advice of those above and adjusted the clutch (although it felt fine) and still the same problem. Although the pedel feels a lil better and I was able to get it to engage a lil closer to the floor. BUT still I have difficulty getting the car into first and reverse from a stop. If downshifting the first while moving it goes in just fine. Also when the car is not running it goes into gear just fine as well. I am going to take out my B&M short throw and reinstall the stocker to see if that is it although I have my doubts about that being the problem. ANYONE ELSE HAVE ANY IDEAS???? I am stumped.....

oo7arkman

iTrader: (2)

So does anyone have any ideas?

cewrx7r1

iTrader: (2)

Does it feel like it has air in the clutch system? Anyway, bleed it.

Why did you buy a twin plate?

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

I doubt it's a shifter problem.

I still think you're fighting a clutch engagement problem - whether it's a bent clutch fork, loose t/o bearing connection to the pressure plate, air in the clutch line, etc.

Dave

Monkman33

iTrader: (28)

Yeah. It is clutch engagement. somewhere, something is not letting your clutch pull away fully. I just completely rebuilt a transmission with all new cluth keys and clutch key springs, new shift select spindles, new synchros, new everything except for gears and housings and shift select froks. And it doesn't fight me at all sitting out side the car. that shows me that your clutch disk still has pressure being applied to it while you are trying to shift from a dead stop.

Get it fixed now. The longer you wait, the more your clutch and flywheel are just rubbing for no reason.

ehos

When you took off your shifter, did you put all the bushings back? If you don't put them all back, you get a really horribly notchy shifter.

Does it go into gear when the car is off? Or when you go 2nd then 1st?

DaveW

Is the pilot bearing in good shape? If you had any difficulty installing the trans to the engine, or didn't lube a new one, you may have damaged it, and that may be the cause of your problems.

That would explain why adjusting the clutch, etc., had no effect.

Monkman33

iTrader: (28)

^^^ That's a good point. The pilot bearing is good to replace any chance you get. due to the particularly nasty possible consequences of a failure. Plus, if that bearing is trying to sieze, it will keep tension on the front mainshaft of the transmission. this shaft has 4th gear on the end of it. (for a 1:1 ratio in the transmission) The rear mainshaft actually spins independantly of the front mainshaft. But anyways, I got off topic.

The pilot bearing siezing will actt eh same as a slight amount of clutch pressure, since they both would affect teh same shaft going into the transmission.


Also, it could be the bearing inside the transmission.. in between the front and rear mainshaft. this bearing serves the same style of application as the pilot bearing.... except in a different place... and with out a dust seal... I hope for your sake it is neither of these.

oo7arkman

iTrader: (2)

I replaced the pilot bearing when I did the clutch change. It is too cheap not to just replace it when I am in there. I also inspected the clutch fork and it is in great shape. TB is also in great shape. When mating the trans back to the motor it seemed to go back together pretty well, I don't think I damaged anything (for my sake I reeeeaaaally hope I didn't damage that bearing). I will put the car back on stands and check the TB connection to the pressure plate.

With the clutch in it does go into every other gear very smoothly. Also after putting the car into third, second then it seems to go into first a lil easier, but it is still just not normal.. Same thing with reverse is going from fifth to reverse it goes into gear better....

I am not driving the car, although I do have about 350miles on it in this condition. I also have ordered a ss clutch line and I will bleed the system again too. I really appreciate the ideas. Anything else lemme know.

Monkman33

iTrader: (28)

It is normal for a car to go into reverse better after going into 5th... while stopped of course. This is because they share the same clutch hub.

Same for 1st/2nd, and also 3rd/4th.

Have you put synthetic gear oil in your transmission yet?

Don't fret too much, just pick off the small things one at a time. bledd the system untill you have basically changed the fluid out completely. This will help ensure there are no bubbles. Check your shifter bushings.. and also, take your shifter out and double check everything is installed properly. Something to keep in mind when trouble shooting. always nab the easy ones first, then resort to the big things that could be your culprit.

Monkman33

iTrader: (28)

I could take a few pictures of the internals of the FD transmission to better explain my posts... But it will be a few days.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (7)

No need. I have dozens of pics of tranny internals.

www.davidgeesaman.com

I wonder if it would help to disconnect the driveshaft at the diff flange. Leave the tranny in gear and have someone hold the clutch pedal in. Then rotate the shaft to feel for resistance or dragging.

Dave

juicyjosh

iTrader: (29)

dgeesaman,

I just had my transmission rebuilt in January.

Your site is very informative. Thank you !

Josh

oo7arkman

iTrader: (2)

Monkman - I know those gears are on the same clutch hub, I was using that trick to get it to go into gear easier.. I couldn't think of much else. You explain yourself very well don't worry about that. Yeah when I reinstalled the transmission I used full synthetic tranny oil.

Dave - Thanks for the pics. Those may come in handy. I was going to start with all the simple things. It seems more often than not one of those is the culprit anyways. Then again...I don't really want to have to pull the tranny again if I don't need to. Even with the car in first gear and I am sitting it does not feel like there is a load on the flywheel. I can hear the tranny freely spinning and I have to move the pedal a ways to get the clutch to being to have any sort of a grab. That is a great idea on the drive shaft Dave, I may have to use that..

I am going to wait to bleed the clutch until my new clutch line gets here since I will bleed the whole system then.

On the shifter bushings I am not sure what bushings you are talking about. With the B&M it is a whole replacement unit that bolts directly to the tranny. Not like other short shifters that I have seen that just replace the shift lever. There are just 4 bolts that fix it to the transmission.

You guys have been a lot of help. I am just going to start from the beginning and go through each thing one by one and see what I come up with. Thanks again guys. I really appreciate it.

adam c

iTrader: (2)

Adjusting the clutch to engage closer to the floor will only make your problem worse. A properly adjusted clutch will engage close to the top of the throw, with just a little bit of play in the pedal.

streetdreamzny

iTrader: (6)

oo7arkman i also have an exedy twin plate + b+m short shifter and have the exact same problem as you, very hard to get in 1st gear from a stop or reverse and once the cars moving it drives fine. i had a mechanic remove the tranny check all the bearings + clutch fork and he said everything was fine. also tried swapping out tranny with another and still no luck. i'm going to continue searching if i find anything i will let you know and if you solve the problem please let me know

oo7arkman

iTrader: (2)

Actually the ideal or OEM clutch engagement position is close to the middle of the pedal throw.

And I tried everything from engagement at the top of the pedal to engagement right off the floor.... Same issue..

That is very interesting that you have the same issue that I have with the exedy and B&M. PLEASE let me know if you find anything out.

DaveW

From what you said before about it going into 1st easily with the engine off, I would say that there is no problem with your shifter. It has to be the clutch not fully disengaging.

A few questions:
1. do the clutch plates move freely on the input shaft splines?
2. does the intermediate pressure plate move freely in its housing?
3. what is the clutch disk material - is there any chance it could leave a "sticky" deposit on the pressure plates, preventing the disk(s) from disengaging?

Good luck!

oo7arkman

iTrader: (2)

Hey DaveW! Ok I will answer your questions first.
1. The clutch plates slide onto the input shaft just as a stock clutch would. They interlock if I am not mistaken. This is why they must be aligned and then the shaft aligned when it slides into the clutch assembly.
2. The intermediate plate is bolted between the pressure plate and the flywheel. So the intermediate plate moves at the same rotation speed as the flywheel and pressure plate.
3. clutch disk material is ceramic.


OK now I would like to say that it appears that the problem is fixed... I started with the clutch and everything felt fine. Next I moved to the short shifter. I still have my stock shifter assembly so I reinstalled it, started the car and it smooth as butter goes into reverse to back out of the garage. I place the car in first gear no problem and pull away. On the short drive I took each time the car slide right into first gear. I tried reverse again once in the garage and it didn't go in quite as smoothly as I would like to maybe I need to tweek the clutch a bit more BUT it appears the culprit here is the B&M short shifter. WHY??? No idea... But I now have a $200 paperweight that is barely a year old. oh well, maybe someone on here needs one cheap that can actually use it.

Any thoughts would be welcome. Thanks again guys for all the help. Hopefully this could help someone else later as well...

Monkman33

iTrader: (28)

Try reinstalling the short shifter. maybe something was just out of whack?

Also, short shifters require you to put significantly more pressure on the shifter to shift gears. especially 1st (since you do not have any momentum of the shift ****/transmission internals, etc. and reverse: same reasons.

Otherwise, your smoothest shifts will be 3 to 4, due to less difference in the gear ratios, less effective ratio, plus you have momentum coming out of 3rd and going into 4th.

SpoolinRX

iTrader: (6)

Back from the dead, I just got done installing this exact clutch in my car. But i only got it all buttoned up then i had to quit for the night. But i was able to take it around the block and i am experiencing the exact same problem. I figured it just needed to be adjusted or bled. But after reading this I'm kinda confused, mainly cause i have a stock shifter in and the aftermarket sifter seemed to be the cause of his trouble. When filling the trans with oil again i filled the reservoir where the shifter is inserted (as my mechanic friend told me to) which i personally thought was odd, n now sounds like that may be the cause of my trouble. No? Ill give it another look tomorrow. But does anyone have any good input?