j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

you would think, but with the E11 and platinum ECU's the log comes from the software, so the entire output side of the ECU can shut down, and it doesn't show in the logs (rpm drops and AFRs go lean, but everything else looks fine). Haltech also updates the software all the time, bad updates are possible.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

Mazda only sells 2 piece, but in Japan they will take that and make it 3, and clearance it for more power

Howard Coleman

iTrader: (6)

just some general comments/opinions:

unless Mazda has significantly changed their OE seals they should not be used in any single turbo setup. they do work better than non OE seals as to being friendly to the rotor housing however they are prone to losing a piece of the seal near the angled tip. often this will scar the rotor housing, partially embed into the rotor and ding the turbine wheel. the better non OE apex seals will generally will not break but may warp. it is reasonable to expect that you WILL encounter significant knock at some point... generally a tank of sub par gas.

it is all about detonation or pre-ignition. the newer ECUs are generally capable of mitigating detonation damage by changing the ignition to zero advance at a certain knock level. if set correctly this does work. it worked for me when i had a tank of bad gas. no damage. forget about boost cut or fuel cut as they take seconds. ignition is immediate. you need immediate when the power pulses are 30 per second.

i moved to a mountainous area in NE Georgia a couple of years ago. no straight roads and around 2500 Ft. i do road tuning and can only do 3rd gear to about 7800 before i run out of semi straight road at 110. nevertheless i have done and logged over 230 3rd gear pulls. initially w REC seals. i sold the motor which had around 110 psi to buy a new block motor. the new block motor has over 100 pulls w Iannetti I-Seals and the same compression. i recently sent my block to Adam/REC and had him do his 16 1/2 inch studowels. i also added Pineapple solid one piece dowels. i just fired the motor a week ago to find my newish custom C&R radiator was leaking. i received a new Koyo yesterday and will be back on the road in a day or so.

i will say i had an experience w a customer motor and a Haltech 1500. experience as THREE broken front irons. i imagine you would expect i turned over every stone and consulted w just about everybody, including Jim Mederer.. nothing. and, no, it wasn't running too lean or too much IGL lead. the only change we made on motor four was an Elite 2500 and we had no further problems. prior to the Elite series Haltech had the E6 or whatever. that ECU seemed to correlate w a lot of broken FC rear irons. i don't know, but i do know that an errant spark can break an iron.

while we are on the subject of hardware... some of our suppliers have come forth with their own issue of build items. it makes sense and overall we are lucky to have interested parties. i have dealt w Atkins for 20+ years. quite a while ago they came out w their own Viton oil ring O rings... they work great and are cheaper than OE. Atkins also has made, for a long time, the outer coolant seal. they have gone thru various iterations... some were a bit too long, though not too long to be usable...a few months ago i was building a motor and after assembling it had a reason to disassemble it. (it had not run). upon disassembly as i separated the housings i notice the compression ring separated at the puzzle joint. What? i then took a much closer look at the compression ring and it became evident that it was not OE. it looked very close. no doubt Mazda spent zillions engineering this item. it is very complex and must stand up to combustion chamber pressure and heat. and be flexible. i called Atkins, verified it was their item and asked them to send me OE, which they did. i also asked to have them have Dave call me... no call.



maybe these are super duper, but until i have a lengthy talk w Dave i am not rolling the dice. so, no problem w Atkins, i just make sure i am getting what i want. same goes for the corner seal springs... stipulate FD inconel. i really like dealing w Josh and Atkins in general but it is important to know what you are getting.

while our cars are aged a bit, for me, there is always something new around the corner. i am going to do a piece on block integrity and just did a piece on spark plugs. spark plugs? thought that was all settled.

visit my site and the new section re plugs...

SPARK PLUGS



.

DaveW

That, IMO, is not a temperature or detonation issue. It looks to me almost certainly a result of corrosion.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

I'll probably never put refinished irons in a motor again. Once step wear is past its sell-by date I'm tossing them. I had an issue with a refinished set a few years ago that ended up eating the seals. Just bought new ones, and compared to the overall cost of doing a motor, its relatively minimal.

TomU

iTrader: (11)

My experience with RX Parts seals. PFC, Stock Twins, AI (50/50), OMP+Pre-Mix

ArmenMAxx

iTrader: (21)

Yikes! That looks terrible. My shop told me the housings looked new and well lubricated.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

That looks terrible, there had to be something wrong there.

TeamRX8

iTrader: (2)

guy on RX8Club just pulled his new but low compression REW apart to find the RA apex seals had warped on it, was only just starting to tune it for the 15 psi boost range, just prior it was testing low-upper 120-ish compression both rotors, knew he had a problem and found rotor 2 dropped to 20 psi on all three faces …

this was after the previous new motor that the builder hooked up the remote oil filter hoses backwards and took it out on startup.

life tests and pushes us to the limits occasionally…
.

ArmenMAxx

iTrader: (21)

I did have a few position sensor errors on the haltech specifically when shifting quickly into 4th. Wonder if the oem CAS wheel is bent.

Howard Coleman

iTrader: (6)

just my two cents but i think it is probable that changing to any other brand of apex seals will not solve your problem. i would be looking elsewhere.

billyboy

Back in the day, VR sensors used to give lots of aftermarket ecus headaches with their increasing voltage output with rpm/number of teeth. Would hope anything in the last couple of decades would be ok though!

RotaryMachineRx

That would be me, started my own thread with much more background. Long story short, put 1500kms of break in on this engine and measured 120+ cold compression tests. Started introducing boost and after about another 500 or so kms my idle turned real bad with low vacuum at idle. Comp tested again and saw exactly 21psi on all 3 faces of rotor 2 with 100+ psi on rotor 1 still. Here is the thread I started with more info so not to flood this one:

https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generati.../#post12545588

ArmenMAxx

iTrader: (21)

With EGTs, AFR's closely monitored I don't know where else to look besides mechanical. Plugs don't suggest lean/hot conditions. We saw no accelerated housing wear. I am open to detailed advise.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

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Neutron

iTrader: (10)

A little off topic! Just gave this a read. Really good stuff! Mind is a little blown. Wish I would have read this sooner. Going to the dyno soon and just ordered 4 backup Denso 5722 IRE01-34 just in case late last night. Wish I would have just ordered 2. I went ahead and ordered 2 NGK R6601-11 for the trailing.

TeamRX8

iTrader: (2)

I brought them up on RX8Club about 1.5 years ago. The issue is they only have a nickel electrode. Which is going to wear quickly with an IGN-1A high energy coil system. But they are available in -10 and -11.

the NGK R7420 has quite a bit thicker ground strap than the other rotary plugs though. Think I posted some pics on here in a sparkplug thread. I’d expect it to be less susceptible to glowing or falling off and likely wasn’t available way back when either.
.

Djseto

iTrader: (2)

I'm having PTSD from this thread except with I-Rotary and now RA Super Seals. My engine is going back to my builder for a third time next month to get to the bottom of this. Anyone who wants to know my full situation as Im too lazy to type it all out here can go find my build thread.

As it relates to Haltech, I thought maybe it could be them but I worked directly with their team and did a lot of logging and sent them a ton of data, and (of course), the data doesn't show the ECU is having issues. My tuner also sent Haltech my locked tables (another debate for another day) and Haltech confirmed that my tune is good and VERY conservative in terms of timing. My tuner, Nelson Siverio, also tunes probably 3-4 cars a week and my issues at least, have not been seen elsewhere so he doesn't think the ECU is the issue.

On my setup, I don't have EGTs so I'm blind there. I just know I warped a a set of iRotaries and am now getting bad compression on RA Super seals. I run no more than 14psi so I'm well within (if not below) what these seals supposedly can take.

MWillzz

iTrader: (4)

You all mentioning the I-Rotary/Haltech 1500 combo have me worried about this as I'm getting ready to fire it up next week for the first time................

TeamRX8

iTrader: (2)

make sure you don’t skip on the premix ratio per their guidelines, also don’t cut the injectors on decel as this cuts premix oil then as well

https://www.rx7club.com/rotary-car-p.../#post12518895

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Molotovman

iTrader: (49)

Verify all of your wiring connections ae good.

ArmenMAxx

iTrader: (21)

Its my second motor and I too have PTSD, cant imagine three in a row.
I've relayed everyone's points to my builder. At the same time I feel like I am chasing theories vs objective issues. I really hope this is the end of it.

Changes this build:
E&J apex seals
New FFE trigger wheel
New center iron
Emphasis on re-checking clearances as noted by Dave and others

Neutron

iTrader: (10)

I feel your pain. Just out of curiosity, did you check for exhaust leaks before the o2 to make 100% sure your ECU was getting an accurate reading?

I'm pretty positive I warped a set of RxParts seals due to pushing it with a fairly bad exhaust manifold leak.

ArmenMAxx

iTrader: (21)

Absolutely,

Pet peeve of mine is exhaust leaks. You can hear the injectors clicking.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

theory is that the after market seals vary in length, so some people are fine, and some people are not. Mazda calls the rotor housing width to apex seal length measurement Delta S,
when you don't have enough clearance the aftermarket seal has nowhere to go when it heats up. kind of like a piston ring

the thing is, Mazda doesn't have you measure this directly, in a multi piece seal engine, so we just don't.