Prototype high flow belly pan finished and tested
#1
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Prototype high flow belly pan finished and tested
Here it is.
If you have looked at the stock belly pan here are the modifications:
1. The lower lip is extented by 2" and angled more aggressively to scoop up more air.
2. The upper panel is angled to create a larger front opening and to increase the airflow speed via ramming effect.
3. There are now 2 rows of upper panel vents instead of 1. 3 sets of 2 1" vent openings have been extended to 2 sets of 6", 5", 6" vents (more than 5x the original flow x-section). The vent angles are also modified to be near perpendicular to the radiator (increase the flow effectiveness)
The aerodynamics have been tested up to 150 mph. At highway running speeds the average water temp is 8-12 deg F lower. (depending on speed and ambient temp).
If you have looked at the stock belly pan here are the modifications:
1. The lower lip is extented by 2" and angled more aggressively to scoop up more air.
2. The upper panel is angled to create a larger front opening and to increase the airflow speed via ramming effect.
3. There are now 2 rows of upper panel vents instead of 1. 3 sets of 2 1" vent openings have been extended to 2 sets of 6", 5", 6" vents (more than 5x the original flow x-section). The vent angles are also modified to be near perpendicular to the radiator (increase the flow effectiveness)
The aerodynamics have been tested up to 150 mph. At highway running speeds the average water temp is 8-12 deg F lower. (depending on speed and ambient temp).
#3
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would you be able to extend the sides so that it reaches behind the wheel? i don't know what that might do and how it affects it , but most japanese companys that sell the undersweep have it this way.
luigi
luigi
#6
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would you be able to extend the sides so that it reaches behind the wheel? i don't know what that might do and how it affects it , but most japanese companys that sell the undersweep have it this way.
I did the redesign, and a friend (familiar with fg work) did the mold work.
Depending on the amount of interest out there, we will probably run a set of 20 the first go around. The finished product will be shipped fully assembled.
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#9
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The price should be $120.00 to $160.00 plus shipping depending on the quantity of each run. The time should be around 10 working days from the first determined production.
Just a point of interest. For those who are interested in show car items, we are going to have a carbon fiber (clear epoxy resin finish) version for $250.00
Just a point of interest. For those who are interested in show car items, we are going to have a carbon fiber (clear epoxy resin finish) version for $250.00
#10
are you able to make one for people with FMIC's etc? or would that be a huge pain considering having to make the another mold. I ask because normall the radiator is in a different position from stock.
Danny
Danny
#12
Blow up or win
HAHAHAHHA! What a piece of ****!
It sure is great to know there are some novice engineers (or should I say Profiteers?) that are ready to selll anything to anybody in the name of performance.
I guess Trex, this guy, is smarter than the Mazda engineers..........with their wind tunnels and cad cam stuff - even in 1990. Jeez, Mr. Chin, you really should check this out!
Tested to 150 mph? In your dreams.
If ANY of you guys buy this **** you
deserved to be raped!
HAHAHAHA! Talk about "cobbled"! Best laugh I've had in months!!!
It sure is great to know there are some novice engineers (or should I say Profiteers?) that are ready to selll anything to anybody in the name of performance.
I guess Trex, this guy, is smarter than the Mazda engineers..........with their wind tunnels and cad cam stuff - even in 1990. Jeez, Mr. Chin, you really should check this out!
Tested to 150 mph? In your dreams.
If ANY of you guys buy this **** you
deserved to be raped!
HAHAHAHA! Talk about "cobbled"! Best laugh I've had in months!!!
Last edited by RonKMiller; 11-06-02 at 10:57 PM.
#15
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Ron, I thought you were all about some ghetto mods.
Trex, I can't see that lasting very long. As many times as I've heard something smack or scrape the bottom of my car, that fiberglass will just shatter.
Trex, I can't see that lasting very long. As many times as I've heard something smack or scrape the bottom of my car, that fiberglass will just shatter.
#16
Blow up or win
Originally posted by P'cola FD
Ron, I thought you were all about some ghetto mods.
Trex, I can't see that lasting very long. As many times as I've heard something smack or scrape the bottom of my car, that fiberglass will just shatter.
Ron, I thought you were all about some ghetto mods.
Trex, I can't see that lasting very long. As many times as I've heard something smack or scrape the bottom of my car, that fiberglass will just shatter.
BTW, if you looked at my car, from ANY angle you would never know anything is Ghetto. (OK, maybe the exhaust if you crawled underneath)
I'm not trying to flame this guy, but you need to have somewhere for all of this "extra" air to go to make it work. Although my experience in aviation and laminar flow dynamics is rather limited to 22 years as an Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic and two plans built airplanes from scratch under my belt I still have a lot to learn.
Oh, what the hell. I am flaming him!
#17
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Originally posted by RonKMiller
HAHAHAHHA! What a piece of ****!
It sure it great to know there are some novice engineers (or should I say Profiteers?) that are ready to selll anything to anybody in the name of performance.
I guess Trex, this guy, is smarter than the Mazda engineers..........with their wind tunnels and cad cam stuff - even in 1990. Jeez, Mr. Chin, you really should check this out!
Tested to 150 mph? In your dreams.
If ANY of you guys buy this **** you
deserved to be raped!
HAHAHAHA! Talk about "cobbled"! Best laugh I've had in months!!!
HAHAHAHHA! What a piece of ****!
It sure it great to know there are some novice engineers (or should I say Profiteers?) that are ready to selll anything to anybody in the name of performance.
I guess Trex, this guy, is smarter than the Mazda engineers..........with their wind tunnels and cad cam stuff - even in 1990. Jeez, Mr. Chin, you really should check this out!
Tested to 150 mph? In your dreams.
If ANY of you guys buy this **** you
deserved to be raped!
HAHAHAHA! Talk about "cobbled"! Best laugh I've had in months!!!
The stock air channels in the belly pan was designed to provide sufficient airflow for STOCK configuration and nothing more. As anyone who have done the fmic mod will tell you, there is sufficient increase in the airpath resistence that the stock radiator position will no longer provide enough heat dissipation. Therefor, one common solution is to move the radiator to a vertical position, as required by all FMIC kit manufacturers (Apexi, Blitz, Greddy etc.) or are they all stupid as well, since they are tell you to move your radiator, contrary to where the Mazda engineers have placed them? For those people who prefer to leave the radiator in the stock position the reduced air flow is now a problem. The solution, increase airflow from below the radiator.
By the way, I hold a BE EE from MIT and MS comp sci from Princeton and currently working for Honeywell as a senior software control engineer, so don't tell me about "their wind tunnel and cad cam stuff", what is your almighty engineering background in making such a rude and crude rebuttal to the novice engineer?
I welcome any constructive criticism in my design modifications. That is how things get better, that is also why there is always an engineering team working on a design. Read through the original post and agree or disagree with each of the modification points, provide logical reasoning for the disagreement. But refrain from making juvenile comments on something you know nothing about.
Last edited by Trexthe3rd; 11-06-02 at 11:46 PM.
#18
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Originally posted by RonKMiller
Dood, I AM. But I don't try to pretend they work at 150 mph and then try to sell them to noobs. But hey, it's a free country and god bless all the hacks.
BTW, if you looked at my car, from ANY angle you would never know anything is Ghetto. (OK, maybe the exhaust if you crawled underneath)
I'm not trying to flame this guy, but you need to have somewhere for all of this "extra" air to go to make it work. Although my experience in aviation and laminar flow dynamics is rather limited to 22 years as an Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic and two plans built airplanes from scratch under my belt I still have a lot to learn.
Oh, what the hell. I am flaming him!
Dood, I AM. But I don't try to pretend they work at 150 mph and then try to sell them to noobs. But hey, it's a free country and god bless all the hacks.
BTW, if you looked at my car, from ANY angle you would never know anything is Ghetto. (OK, maybe the exhaust if you crawled underneath)
I'm not trying to flame this guy, but you need to have somewhere for all of this "extra" air to go to make it work. Although my experience in aviation and laminar flow dynamics is rather limited to 22 years as an Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic and two plans built airplanes from scratch under my belt I still have a lot to learn.
Oh, what the hell. I am flaming him!
Second. If you bothered to read through the original post (line item 3.), the larger opening that collects the "extra" air is redirected through the larger (and extra) vents which are 5x larger in surface area than the stock vents, toward the radiator (isn't that the whole point of the exercise?)
As I have already stated, this is a PROTOTYPE, it has not been prettied up. There is such a thing called paint.
#20
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Originally posted by P'cola FD
Ron, I thought you were all about some ghetto mods.
Trex, I can't see that lasting very long. As many times as I've heard something smack or scrape the bottom of my car, that fiberglass will just shatter.
Ron, I thought you were all about some ghetto mods.
Trex, I can't see that lasting very long. As many times as I've heard something smack or scrape the bottom of my car, that fiberglass will just shatter.
#21
Originally posted by Trexthe3rd
I will answer your question. First, I had the car up to 150 mph, so has many others. I had to take the car up to that speed to make sure that there is no adverse lifting effect caused by pressure build up. And as you so fondly pointed out, I don't have a wind tunnel in my garage.
I will answer your question. First, I had the car up to 150 mph, so has many others. I had to take the car up to that speed to make sure that there is no adverse lifting effect caused by pressure build up. And as you so fondly pointed out, I don't have a wind tunnel in my garage.
Driving the car at 150 MPH and noticing no changes in the steering or handling may give the impression that the car is safe with the mod at speed but what would really convince me is if you had some numbers on lift. I do not believe to measure lift a wind tunnel is required but it would require a fifth wheel with a device which can measure downforce(I am not sure what the name of the device is or how much it would cost to rent or buy).
Last edited by Mr. Stock; 11-06-02 at 11:48 PM.
#22
Blow up or win
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Trexthe3rd
[B]
I will answer your question. First, I had the car up to 150 mph, so has many others. I had to take the car up to that speed to make sure that there is no adverse lifting effect caused by pressure build up. And as you so fondly pointed out, I don't have a wind tunnel in my garage.
Second. If you bothered to read through the original post (line item 3.), the larger opening that collects the "extra" air is redirected through the larger (and extra) vents which are 5x larger in surface area than the stock vents, toward the radiator (isn't that the whole point of the exercise?)
Look man, I don't begrudge anyone doing prototypes of anything - it's all good fun. But just exactly what is the exercise here, more cooling? You can only "ram" so much air through the radiator fins, and then they cavitate and become less efficient.
Flow dynamics is a tricky and strange science, even with a wind tunnel and super computers.
I guess my problem is that you are quoting prices for your finished "product" already, and you are sucking along lots of guys in the process who think this will make them go faster, run cooler and be cooler - for a price.
But, like I said, I've got a lot to learn.
[B]
I will answer your question. First, I had the car up to 150 mph, so has many others. I had to take the car up to that speed to make sure that there is no adverse lifting effect caused by pressure build up. And as you so fondly pointed out, I don't have a wind tunnel in my garage.
Second. If you bothered to read through the original post (line item 3.), the larger opening that collects the "extra" air is redirected through the larger (and extra) vents which are 5x larger in surface area than the stock vents, toward the radiator (isn't that the whole point of the exercise?)
Look man, I don't begrudge anyone doing prototypes of anything - it's all good fun. But just exactly what is the exercise here, more cooling? You can only "ram" so much air through the radiator fins, and then they cavitate and become less efficient.
Flow dynamics is a tricky and strange science, even with a wind tunnel and super computers.
I guess my problem is that you are quoting prices for your finished "product" already, and you are sucking along lots of guys in the process who think this will make them go faster, run cooler and be cooler - for a price.
But, like I said, I've got a lot to learn.
#23
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Originally posted by Trexthe3rd
Not sure what you run over.
Not sure what you run over.
#24
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I do not have the pressure roller for testing the down force differences between stock and my modifiec belly pan. I am also wary of the adverse effects on the aerodynamics of the car, that is why I could never agree with any of the other belly pan mods that have come along. I took the car up to 150, and felt no steering degradation. I have had slight wheel misalignments and caused the car to be wobbly at 120. This may not be the be all and end all prove, but for me (not planning on making too many 150+ runs down the interstate, not sure how many of you are?) it is sufficient.
#25
Originally posted by Trexthe3rd
(not planning on making too many 150+ runs down the interstate, not sure how many of you are?)
(not planning on making too many 150+ runs down the interstate, not sure how many of you are?)