Need New Engine... Whats the best and whats the cheapest route to go?
12-13-01, 07:36 AM
#26
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I recently got a reman and did some thorough research off this forum before making that decision. I was looking for a rebuilt stock port motor so there would be no question about passing california emissions. After doing my research I decided to save a bit of money going the Mazda reman route. As for those of you pompous enough to classify me into that "NOW" generation bullshit for going this route - I guess the "NOW" generation is just a lot smarter than yours. I consider myself quite wealthy and got here through hardwork and being smart about how I spend my money.
As with ALL rotary engine rebuilds from anywhere (Hayes, KD, etc..) you're basically gambling on the fact that you get a quality rebuild. Everyone has their horror stories about Mazda remans AND motors rebuilt at any reputable shop. These are all human (re)built motors so if whoever is doing your rebuild is having an off day, forgets a bolt, is in a rush, leaves tools inside, etc... you're fucked even if you do go to a reputable rotary rebuilder. As a comparison I'd say that I'm pretty damn good at my profession, but I still make mistakes all the time. The same applies to any job that requires man labor whether it be in wrenching and grinding or sitting behind a desk.
So with that out of the way here were my findings from two, unbiased, independent engine installers I spoke to in the area. For those in the Bay Area, many of you know who Ivan is and Mostly Auto Service.
Ivan will install any 13B-REW you deliver to him. He doesn't have much of an incentive to sell me anything because he has to do the same amount of labor regardless. Out of the motors he's installed, he's had the least amount of problems (proportionate) with the remans coming back if maintained properly. I was told that it's no longer uncommon for Mazda remans to last past 50k and that in his two latest teardowns of uninstalled remans, the motors were practically brand new. He did inform me of a period that remans were complete **** but as of late they seem to have cleaned up their act quite a bit.
Mostly Auto Service told me more or less the same thing. I was told they have customers running around with remans that have put more than 70k running around with compression in the 8's.
I hope this was somewhat informative.
As with ALL rotary engine rebuilds from anywhere (Hayes, KD, etc..) you're basically gambling on the fact that you get a quality rebuild. Everyone has their horror stories about Mazda remans AND motors rebuilt at any reputable shop. These are all human (re)built motors so if whoever is doing your rebuild is having an off day, forgets a bolt, is in a rush, leaves tools inside, etc... you're fucked even if you do go to a reputable rotary rebuilder. As a comparison I'd say that I'm pretty damn good at my profession, but I still make mistakes all the time. The same applies to any job that requires man labor whether it be in wrenching and grinding or sitting behind a desk.
So with that out of the way here were my findings from two, unbiased, independent engine installers I spoke to in the area. For those in the Bay Area, many of you know who Ivan is and Mostly Auto Service.
Ivan will install any 13B-REW you deliver to him. He doesn't have much of an incentive to sell me anything because he has to do the same amount of labor regardless. Out of the motors he's installed, he's had the least amount of problems (proportionate) with the remans coming back if maintained properly. I was told that it's no longer uncommon for Mazda remans to last past 50k and that in his two latest teardowns of uninstalled remans, the motors were practically brand new. He did inform me of a period that remans were complete **** but as of late they seem to have cleaned up their act quite a bit.
Mostly Auto Service told me more or less the same thing. I was told they have customers running around with remans that have put more than 70k running around with compression in the 8's.
I hope this was somewhat informative.
12-13-01, 07:43 AM
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I hate to say this, but you sound like a bitter old man. Yes I'm young. No I'm finished with school and I command a 6 figure salary. But I still want the BEST and CHEAPEST route. That's just called being smart. If I can get the BEST route for my money then I have stretched my dollar. I think that's a lot better than getting a mediocre route for a lot of money.
Originally posted by cewrx7r1
DHALL,
Just for you.
The "NOW" generation is a very accurate discription of many of the young owners on this forum and the list. You all want it now even if you are not mature enough, lack experience, still in school, and have lower incomes.
You all want the BEST and CHEAPEST answer to everything. Many do not even own or study the manuals for their cars. They ask questions which the manual can so easily answer.
I can go on, but will stop here. If this offends you, go cry to your mother!
DHALL,
Just for you.
The "NOW" generation is a very accurate discription of many of the young owners on this forum and the list. You all want it now even if you are not mature enough, lack experience, still in school, and have lower incomes.
You all want the BEST and CHEAPEST answer to everything. Many do not even own or study the manuals for their cars. They ask questions which the manual can so easily answer.
I can go on, but will stop here. If this offends you, go cry to your mother!
12-13-01, 07:54 AM
#28
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Originally posted by cewrx7r1
DHALL,
Just for you.
The "NOW" generation is a very accurate discription of many of the young owners on this forum and the list. You all want it now even if you are not mature enough, lack experience, still in school, and have lower incomes.
You all want the BEST and CHEAPEST answer to everything. Many do not even own or study the manuals for their cars. They ask questions which the manual can so easily answer.
I can go on, but will stop here. If this offends you, go cry to your mother!
DHALL,
Just for you.
The "NOW" generation is a very accurate discription of many of the young owners on this forum and the list. You all want it now even if you are not mature enough, lack experience, still in school, and have lower incomes.
You all want the BEST and CHEAPEST answer to everything. Many do not even own or study the manuals for their cars. They ask questions which the manual can so easily answer.
I can go on, but will stop here. If this offends you, go cry to your mother!
Why don't you listen to the guys on the forum, then give them advice instead of slamming them? If they choose to use your advice cool, if not, that is cool too. Maybe they will actually find something new out for themselves. Just like you did... People are going to make mistakes, and they will learn from them. Just because they want to try something doesn't make the stupid.
Also, this "NOW" generation stuff is dumb. Why wouldn't you try to get the best price and the best quality. In the engineering world...I deal with this everyday. It is all balance. You ever heard the saying...price, quality, speed....you can pick any two? This is usually a very true statement....
I thought that was what the forums were about...learning, sharing knowledge, and just talking about cars.
Later,
Patrick (Member of the NOW generation...I guess)
12-13-01, 09:38 AM
#29
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Yea I'm 20, I'm in school, and part of the "now generation," but don't lump everyone into one group of lazy, mindless dumbasses. There is nothing wrong with wanting to get the most bang for your buck. If efficiency is a flaw of the younger generation...then I'd like to remain young forever.
Hey, and more power to those with the "Geo Metro budgets," that are getting by!
Hey, and more power to those with the "Geo Metro budgets," that are getting by!
12-13-01, 09:50 AM
#30
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Patrick,
Just for you.
How many engines have you rebuilt? Have you ever removed you engine and turbos by yourself and rebuilt them?
I am not the most experienced hobbiest mechanic, but I have done it once with my 1st gen, and twice with my FD. My FD engine failed due to a Mazda manufactoring error. Unfornunately I installed a Hayes rebuilt which I paid almost $4000 for. It had extras besides the normal rebuild. It was a piece of **** and had major oil usage problems. It was scraped after 2 years. That is when I learned how to build an engine. I rebuilt my own which runs great. Since then, a friend and I work together doing RX7 modifications here in Houston. It is our hobby, not a business. He use to actually own a RX7 shop in San Antonio. In the last two years we have built about 6 ported engines. Some from the orignial engine parts and some from Mazda rebuilds. We also do suspension mods.
What are your qualifications?
Just for you.
How many engines have you rebuilt? Have you ever removed you engine and turbos by yourself and rebuilt them?
I am not the most experienced hobbiest mechanic, but I have done it once with my 1st gen, and twice with my FD. My FD engine failed due to a Mazda manufactoring error. Unfornunately I installed a Hayes rebuilt which I paid almost $4000 for. It had extras besides the normal rebuild. It was a piece of **** and had major oil usage problems. It was scraped after 2 years. That is when I learned how to build an engine. I rebuilt my own which runs great. Since then, a friend and I work together doing RX7 modifications here in Houston. It is our hobby, not a business. He use to actually own a RX7 shop in San Antonio. In the last two years we have built about 6 ported engines. Some from the orignial engine parts and some from Mazda rebuilds. We also do suspension mods.
What are your qualifications?
12-13-01, 10:02 AM
#31
OG
wow fun thread...turned into old vs young thing
Ok i guess I'm ancient at age 32...and maybe Chuck is stereotyping a little bit, but 80% of what he is saying is correct..
I dont have endless money and all that, but I'm not about looking for the cheapest crap to go on my FD either...and when Chuck said "the now generation wants the best and cheapest answer to everything" I DONT think he is off base. Some if not most of it is TRUE...
Ok i guess I'm ancient at age 32...and maybe Chuck is stereotyping a little bit, but 80% of what he is saying is correct..
I dont have endless money and all that, but I'm not about looking for the cheapest crap to go on my FD either...and when Chuck said "the now generation wants the best and cheapest answer to everything" I DONT think he is off base. Some if not most of it is TRUE...
12-13-01, 10:05 AM
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Originally posted by cewrx7r1
Patrick,
Just for you.
How many engines have you rebuilt? Have you ever removed you engine and turbos by yourself and rebuilt them?
I am not the most experienced hobbiest mechanic, but I have done it once with my 1st gen, and twice with my FD. My FD engine failed due to a Mazda manufactoring error. Unfornunately I installed a Hayes rebuilt which I paid almost $4000 for. It had extras besides the normal rebuild. It was a piece of **** and had major oil usage problems. It was scraped after 2 years. That is when I learned how to build an engine. I rebuilt my own which runs great. Since then, a friend and I work together doing RX7 modifications here in Houston. It is our hobby, not a business. He use to actually own a RX7 shop in San Antonio. In the last two years we have built about 6 ported engines. Some from the orignial engine parts and some from Mazda rebuilds. We also do suspension mods.
What are your qualifications?
Patrick,
Just for you.
How many engines have you rebuilt? Have you ever removed you engine and turbos by yourself and rebuilt them?
I am not the most experienced hobbiest mechanic, but I have done it once with my 1st gen, and twice with my FD. My FD engine failed due to a Mazda manufactoring error. Unfornunately I installed a Hayes rebuilt which I paid almost $4000 for. It had extras besides the normal rebuild. It was a piece of **** and had major oil usage problems. It was scraped after 2 years. That is when I learned how to build an engine. I rebuilt my own which runs great. Since then, a friend and I work together doing RX7 modifications here in Houston. It is our hobby, not a business. He use to actually own a RX7 shop in San Antonio. In the last two years we have built about 6 ported engines. Some from the orignial engine parts and some from Mazda rebuilds. We also do suspension mods.
What are your qualifications?
I never, EVER questioned your qualifications. All I questioned was the FACTS. I wondered how you knew this about reman engines. That is all. If you would have said this up front, I wouldn't even have asked. It sounds like you know what you are doing.
I never made any statements that I knew first hand about these reman engines. I was just pointing out some places to buy them, and prices for them. I also said that I wouldn't be making claims if I didn't know for a fact they were true. I guess you do know from experience. That is all you had to say.
But, like I said in a previous post...there will be bad engines from every shop/company. That doesn't mean they are all bad. It is just statistics.
With all your qualifications, it still doesn't mean you should be rude to the young guys. Period.
I have not rebuilt an engine yet, or even pulled one out of my FD...but I am sure I will. I have done everything to my FD myself....but that still doesn't qualify me to be rude to people on the forum, and act like I know everything about everything....
I am done with this thread. It has been informative. I have gathered that there are some quality issues with Mazda reman engines, and Hanyes...and for that matter probably everyone else. It still doesn't change my mind...
I am buying mine from Pineapple racing....and I am a member of the NOW generation because I want the best quality and lowest price!!
And Chuck if you want to know about me...look at my Profile.
Later,
Patrick
12-13-01, 10:14 AM
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Hey Chuck,
I am from the "Now Genration" and I think you are a jackass. I don't know what Generation you are from but I am not going to say anything bad about your generation because I am sure that you are the exeption of them. Your coments are very ignorant, and you have absolutely no reason behind them. Do you ever remember being young and excited about doing stuff to your car? As far as the money issue you should watch what you say about that. I am still in college and bust my *** to pay for my cars. But I don't have to, I chose to. My family is worth more than you will ever be, so if you think about it that means that I have money also. But did you ever like to think that educating yourself on your investments is the smarter route to go? Maybe the "Now Generation" is smarter than you think you jackass. Oh yeah and by the way, me and the "Now Generation" are going to run your world eventually, what you going to do then?
I am from the "Now Genration" and I think you are a jackass. I don't know what Generation you are from but I am not going to say anything bad about your generation because I am sure that you are the exeption of them. Your coments are very ignorant, and you have absolutely no reason behind them. Do you ever remember being young and excited about doing stuff to your car? As far as the money issue you should watch what you say about that. I am still in college and bust my *** to pay for my cars. But I don't have to, I chose to. My family is worth more than you will ever be, so if you think about it that means that I have money also. But did you ever like to think that educating yourself on your investments is the smarter route to go? Maybe the "Now Generation" is smarter than you think you jackass. Oh yeah and by the way, me and the "Now Generation" are going to run your world eventually, what you going to do then?
12-13-01, 10:28 AM
#34
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Sorry Johnny, as part of "generation now" 
I just have to say you are wrong about the "cheapest crap" thing. Sure we (including u older folks) ALL want the best stuff for the least amount of money, but there is no way in hell I'd put some Ricky Ricardo brand stuff on my car. I've held out numerous times to accumulate more funds just to get the better part. I dont make a 6-figure salary, but I do pretty damn well for a "kid" in school, and I'm proud of it.
All these assumptions are off base, if you want to stereotype you guys should be doing it elsewhere. Maybe you old farts (I say that jokingly) just dont enjoy the fact that younger people are driving around the same thing you are (and in your minds didnt work for it), but that's another subject. BTW, I work damn hard to own this car, that's why I find this type of generalization offensive.
I just have to say you are wrong about the "cheapest crap" thing. Sure we (including u older folks) ALL want the best stuff for the least amount of money, but there is no way in hell I'd put some Ricky Ricardo brand stuff on my car. I've held out numerous times to accumulate more funds just to get the better part. I dont make a 6-figure salary, but I do pretty damn well for a "kid" in school, and I'm proud of it.All these assumptions are off base, if you want to stereotype you guys should be doing it elsewhere. Maybe you old farts (I say that jokingly) just dont enjoy the fact that younger people are driving around the same thing you are (and in your minds didnt work for it), but that's another subject. BTW, I work damn hard to own this car, that's why I find this type of generalization offensive.
12-13-01, 10:54 AM
#35
no,no,no. the "now generation" is actually part of what you all are talking about. tolerances. we try to squeeze every dollar until it squeals. engineering. tightest tolerancem, best safety factor, lowest cost. everyone take off the jackets and colored bandannas. put away the knives and lets see if its just flooded.
12-13-01, 11:02 AM
#36
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Also a memeber of the "nOW" gen
I just wanted to say that I'm A member of the "Now" gen, and the old dude needs to chill out -- we're all on this forum to get some help and some infomation about our nice ride we have ---- no need for the youngster jokes -- I'm 21 and dont like what I'm hearing!
12-13-01, 11:31 AM
#37
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You guys are ridiculous. This "now" Sh*t is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. If you guys wanna f*ck around then head on over to the lounge where it's appropriate. This is not the "cheap ***" section, but the 3rd gen section. Just sell the 7 cause you're only going to give it a bad rep.
12-13-01, 12:54 PM
#39
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Damn Mach2 what is your problem now. This post is about helping out someone who needs advice on getting a new motor. Then someone had to go and start this "Now Generation" bs with me, and now the people who want the most out of their dollar should sell their FD cause we are going to give it a bad name. You know what I think their was a good point brought up that you "Then Generation" are just pissed that we drive the same cars that you do. I can't believe that you believe that about the younger generation. Maybe I was just brought up differently but I always have assumed that shopping around for a product, whether it be cheaper or MORE EXSPENSIVE is a dollar well spent. Geez this guy just wanted some opinions on the more conservative way to go about getting a motor, he said nothing about he wanted a damn pos that was going to break down, he just wanted our opinions and so you labled him. Maybe you should sell your freakin FD cause you are the type of person that I hate to see at a show acting like your **** doesn't stink. And now you want to go and label us "Cheap asses" for wanting the most bang for the buck, well I am not one to label like you do must if we are "Cheap asses" then I guess maybe you are just "Dumb asses" for not wanting the most out of your dollar. Sorry to have to be so petty here, but these low blows are really pissing me off. Have you noticed that you and Chuck are the only two that feel this way, maybe that should tell you something.
12-13-01, 01:28 PM
#41
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Originally posted by DHALL
... But man do whatever you gotta do, and hey if you save money on a reman motor, that just means more money for mods! Good luck man.
... But man do whatever you gotta do, and hey if you save money on a reman motor, that just means more money for mods! Good luck man.
see ya,
car 53
12-13-01, 01:34 PM
#42
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Since when is wanting the "best and cheapest" option a bad thing? When did "wasting" money become a virtue? You guys(Mach2, cewrx7r1) are crazy. No one ever said that they wanted to put cheap, POS parts in their car. They just wanted to find out what the best option was. If you have one option that will cost $4000 and one that will cost $2000 it only makes sennse to research them. If you find out that the $2000 option is a cheap POS then you don't buy it, but if you hear good things about it then you should go for it. Expensive things are not always better, I could name a bunch of cheap items that are better than there more expensive counterparts. I am guessing that you guys never buy on sale, or when you are at the grocery store you will always buy the item that is most expensive. I bet that you change your oil with Royal Purple every 200 miles becaue any other way and you would be a cheapskate. If not, you are being a hypocrite. And give me a break about this NOW crap, every generation wants the "best and cheapest" right now. Maybe our generation is just hard working and smart enough to actually get it. 
Just kidding, I have respect for all other generations, unlike you(cewrx7r1).
PS: What is your generations philosophy: "We want the worst and most expensive option......in a couple weeks"
By your generation I mean just You because I have a lot of friends that are older and all of them have similar philosophys to the so called "NOW" generation.
Just kidding, I have respect for all other generations, unlike you(cewrx7r1).PS: What is your generations philosophy: "We want the worst and most expensive option......in a couple weeks"
By your generation I mean just You because I have a lot of friends that are older and all of them have similar philosophys to the so called "NOW" generation.
12-13-01, 04:54 PM
#43
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Everyone go to their corners and chill out a little bit. You guys are ruining a good thread. You want to argue about the now generation, go start another thread in the lounge please.
Petros
Petros
12-13-01, 06:18 PM
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Originally posted by petrosc
Everyone go to their corners and chill out a little bit. You guys are ruining a good thread. You want to argue about the now generation, go start another thread in the lounge please.
Petros
Everyone go to their corners and chill out a little bit. You guys are ruining a good thread. You want to argue about the now generation, go start another thread in the lounge please.
Petros
lol, lol, lol,
12-13-01, 08:33 PM
#46
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Originally posted by r_ed_line53
the now, the wow, the pow wow, bottom line is everyone wants their RX7 running.
see ya,
car 53
the now, the wow, the pow wow, bottom line is everyone wants their RX7 running.
see ya,
car 53
If we could just run our cars as hard as we wanted, and not worry about the health of the engine....ahhh what a great dream!
Ok...back to reality.
Later,
Patrick
12-13-01, 09:43 PM
#47
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I LUV THIS FORUM
OH, THANKS FOR WAKING ME UP!!!!! U KNOW WHAT I'D LIKE TO SEE OR AT LEAST HEAR... IS FOR EVERYONE IN THIS FORUM, RIGHT NOW, GO OUT AND DISCONNECT YOUR EXHAUST SO THAT YOU'RE JUST RUNNING STRAIGHT FROM THE HEADERS OR TURBOS... MAN THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING... ALL THESE 7'S GOIN' PAAA PPPAAAA PAPAPAPPAPAPPAPAPAPAPAPAPPAPPAPAPAAAAAA PPPAAAAAAAAAAAA
PAA PAA PAA PAA PAA PAA, anyways u get the idea.... big sigh.
car 53
PAA PAA PAA PAA PAA PAA, anyways u get the idea.... big sigh.
car 53
12-14-01, 09:41 AM
#48
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Originally posted by cewrx7r1
DHALL,
Just for you.
The "NOW" generation is a very accurate discription of many of the young owners on this forum and the list. You all want it now even if you are not mature enough, lack experience, still in school, and have lower incomes.
You all want the BEST and CHEAPEST answer to everything. Many do not even own or study the manuals for their cars. They ask questions which the manual can so easily answer.
I can go on, but will stop here. If this offends you, go cry to your mother!
DHALL,
Just for you.
The "NOW" generation is a very accurate discription of many of the young owners on this forum and the list. You all want it now even if you are not mature enough, lack experience, still in school, and have lower incomes.
You all want the BEST and CHEAPEST answer to everything. Many do not even own or study the manuals for their cars. They ask questions which the manual can so easily answer.
I can go on, but will stop here. If this offends you, go cry to your mother!
SO right on. ROTFLMAO! The biggest problem is that half of 'em can't read in the first place! I'm just glad I am part of the "Me" generation. I'd take a 20 year old Farrah Fawcett over Brittney (sp?) Spears anyday, although she's looking pretty raggy at 50+.
12-14-01, 09:53 AM
#49
OG
Originally posted by DHALL
Also Mach2 why do you have the same signature as Johnny the Moderator? Are you the same person or are you just using his sig?
Also Mach2 why do you have the same signature as Johnny the Moderator? Are you the same person or are you just using his sig?
12-14-01, 10:39 AM
#50
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RonKMiller,
I don't like to disrespect my elders, but why are you such an a**hole. Why would you say something stupid like that, I understand you are just an old bitter man, but why be like that. Don't you have any children, or grandchildren in your case? If so are they unable to read and write also? I am not going to say everything to you that I would like to because I have charactar, and this is forum is for people who want to keep their cars running. But one last note, you are just another one of those ****** that people see driving an FD thinking that your **** doesn't stink giving people bad impressions of FD owners. Oh yeah don't be upset that you can't get the young girls like us, I am sure those wrinkled ladys you "Me Generation" guys get, there aint nothing better than fat roles and wrinkles, I am sure you can attest to that.
I don't like to disrespect my elders, but why are you such an a**hole. Why would you say something stupid like that, I understand you are just an old bitter man, but why be like that. Don't you have any children, or grandchildren in your case? If so are they unable to read and write also? I am not going to say everything to you that I would like to because I have charactar, and this is forum is for people who want to keep their cars running. But one last note, you are just another one of those ****** that people see driving an FD thinking that your **** doesn't stink giving people bad impressions of FD owners. Oh yeah don't be upset that you can't get the young girls like us, I am sure those wrinkled ladys you "Me Generation" guys get, there aint nothing better than fat roles and wrinkles, I am sure you can attest to that.