Well, unfortunatelly my motor has seen it's last day. After a recent tune where I pulled 327hp, I blew an apex seal. I don't blame the tuner simply because I have 60k on this motor and I had a feeling it was coming anyway.
However, I have decided to go ahead and drop a few bucks this time and do it up like I want to.
I was thinking of going with Pineapple racing for a new streetported motor with 3mm seals as well as a lot of their other options to get a motor that can handle the higher hp more reliably.
I want to know what everyone elses opinions are currently about the various engine builders out there right now.

Thanks,

Brian

 

Pineapple racing seems to be an awesome company

 

Id go with Arizona Rotary Rockets, they have been putting out some awesome performance engine's.

 

I was under the impression that going 3mm seals was only really needed for high boost applications, and event then not a neccessity. Are you still running stock twins?

 

Currently I have the stock twins, but I'm looking at either the BNR stage 3 or possibly going single. I haven't decided on which yet. Any recommendations there would also be appreciated, but I really like having the twins. I am not looking to have 500+ hp or anything, but I would like to have a somewhat reliable 400hp or even slightly less.

 

2 other good options - RX7.com aka Rotary Performance and Gotham Racing both in Texas build some good motors. RP has been at it for decades.

 

Thank you for your recommendations, but I would really like to hear from people who have first hand experience with these builders, as I'm sure you can understand. If I'm going to shell out $3500 - $5000 for a motor, I would like to hear from people who have purchased engines from these different builders and are happy, or unhappy with their end result.

 

I was just reading about Atkins rotary. Anyone out there used them for a new engine?
Their site claims that they use 3mm seals on all of their motors and they have a 2 year 24k mile warrenty on all of their motors. Also they say that one of their customers who uses their seals on their race car only uses Atkins Apex seals and runs at 45 psi. This "sounds" pretty good, but I will only believe so much without others who are willing to back their claims.

 

Here is a link to one of AZRR engines in a 1Oth AE. https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...highlight=azrr

 

ehh..

 

I would go with Kevin at Rotary Resurrection. I have heard nothing but good things about his work, and his prices are great.

 

A friend of mine had a Pineapple motor built, similar to what you are thinking of building (3mm seals, the works). The car was tuned by Steve Kan. After about year, it blew a seal. The car made about 370rwhp with the older style BNR Stage 3's (upgraded fuel system, PFC, etc).

I have another friend who has been beating on a Pettit Racing motor now for over 5 years (3mm ceramic seals). He made 360rwhp using the Pettit ECU and stock twins. He road races the car several times a year as well as usually a few runs down the strip (he has a 11.77 run).

If you want an engine to run on a road racing course, go with Pettit Racing. If you want a drag racing motor, go with RX7.com or Gotham Racing. Personally, I would go with Kevin at Rotary Resurrection and just not necessarily go all out on a motor. Unless you are using the car for competition, these high priced motors can be a waste of money.

 

Wherever you go for the build, for a street car I'd recommend oem mazda 2mm apex seals. Ihor and I install them in all our builds, they're a proven commodity. Why gamble with your engine internals? 3mm seals are not necessary for your application.

 

Thanks guys, that is some good advice from some well respected members. I appreciate you taking the time to reply to a question I'm sure you hear a lot.
What I'm looking for is pretty much what everyone wants, but I also realize it is not necessarily something that exists... A high hp motor that is almost bulletproof.
I am more realistic than that though. Logically it would seem that a 3mm seal would be stronger than a 2mm seal but it seems that the data says otherwise.
Thanks again.

 

AM I WRONG TO THINK that 60k mile motor shouldnt blow on dyno
i dnt think it was the motors fault why motor blew

 

Why does everyone think 3mm do so much damage? If this were the case the 13b in the GSL-SE wouldn't be lasting anywhere near 200,000 miles. I don't see anyone trying to put those kinds of miles on their rebuilds. Cohbra you will be pefectly fine with these 3mm's.

 

Nothing inside a 60k rotary is worn enough to just simply fail however, you do have the stock 3 piece apex seals that have become the weak link. The top piece gets brittle with age. So it's more easily broken under detonation and not wear. For this reason is why I can't stand the older 3 piece design and a major source of failer. Two piece designs have more structural integrity due to more metal. Think of breaking 1 tooth pick vs 2. Stock 3 piece seals are **** when it comes to durability. Any hi strung 13b needs more detonation resistant apex seals if you want longer term reliability. My personal Fd engine lasted 108k till I blew it from over boost.

 

If you want seals that will take a beating then go with Aviation. All of the high HP motors we have done use those with no problems.

 

Where did I state that they did 'so much damage'?

I said they weren't necessary, and they aren't. Why go to the cost and hassle of having the rotors milled, when (a) the rotors can be damaged in the mail, and (b) the milling can be done improperly, effectively screwing your motor.

People have made big power on oem 2 piece 2mm seals, and they've been proven to have the kind of longevity you'd want in a streetcar.

I don't think that 3mm seals are useless, but in this case I don't see the point.

 

+1 ^ i remeber a thread about this topic awhile back.. do a search and maybe you'll find it

 

Point is a more durable seal wouldn't have let go so easily. I know the original engine had a few miles but what do you think is going to happen again if he rebuilds with stock 2mm and doesn't figure out the true cause of the failure? There's a fine line between big power and having the engine last. Stock 2mm are too temperamental. They also have never been durable under detonation and require too many things to be nearly perfect for them to perform. This is the exact reason my original engine lasted 108k up until I over boosted it. I know that's my fault but imagine had my engine had more durable seals to start with. A perfect tune will then go much farther plus you will have a better safety cushion with a more durable seal if something out of the ordinary happens. A reliable street car needs as much leeway as possible if your going to modify it. The cost of milling is nothing compared to the cost, time, and labor associated with the replacement of damaged parts (rotors, housings, turbo's) when stock 2mm's blow. Now on the other hand, I would just go with the RA seals. They have most definitely proven themselves recently.

 

I pretty much view 3mm seals as a bandaid for bad tuning. Why not water injection instead, if you're concerned about detonating? I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree

 

The problem is there are other parts to the system that can cause a motor to detonate other than the tune. Injectors, fuel pump, filter, crap intercooler, boost creep etc... can all cause detonation and a blown motor. Doesnt matter how good the tune is. Mazda seals dont hold up to any detonation. If you are planning on upping the boost and going for more power then I wouldnt do mazda seals. I dont care who tunes the car, its not worth the risk. We have seen many motors where the customer said so and so tuned it 3k miles ago and it blew up. Come to find out it chipped a seal.

 

I have around 35,000 miles on the 2mm RA seals with a good bit of abuse tuned at 11.5 at 17psi on pump with a T-66 .98ar. The next time I build a motor I will use them again.

 

Exactly! A perfect tune is a great start but there are too many other variables to worry about.