neofreak

So when you're bored at work and do a little poking around, you hear things.. so a little birdy mentioned to me that there is a new set of suspension bushings that are going to be avaliable soon!

Apparently, they already have a prototype set on SP Engineering's Supra7, and production is supposed to ramp up very soon.. this new set is supposed to offer three levels of firmness and is customer tunable. =)

I can't wait... Now that I decided to keep my FD..

RX Steve

Yea,


And osama body ben lyin to you.

jimlab

So where did you hear this from?

Flybye

Jim's already getting jelous :p

jimlab

No, just curious... there have already been reports of "unobtainum" products (like the rumored titanium axles) on the "Supra7". I think it's a publicity stunt, but there's no harm in that.

Customer tunable? At the point of purchase, perhaps. There is no possible way to "tune" a bushing on the car. You can make your material (firmness) selection up front, but this isn't a Reebok you can pump up, or a Penske shock system that you can dial adjust...

3 levels of firmness? Apparently they've yet to figure out that bushings don't make the ride any stiffer. The shocks and springs control the ride quality primarily, and the choice of sidewall height secondarily. Obviously a P225/20-26 (yes, this does exist... one was on display at SEMA, I believe) is going to ride a hell of a lot harsher than a P225/50-16 because there's no sidewall to absorb impact. A stiff spring or shock will do the same, the bushing is merely a pivot point. They're made of rubber for noise isolation, not for ride quality...

So bottom line, when you have three material choices (let's say rubber, polyurethane and nylon) what you're choosing is not the quality of the ride, but actually the level of deflection of the suspension under load, compromised by isolation from road noise. The stiffer your bushing, the more road you're going to hear, but the better the car will handle and react. The sloppier your bushing, the quieter your ride, but the handling and road feel will be compromised.

Just curious what they came up with and what stories they're telling.

Red95T-Rex

I need a set of bushings soon and was wondering if anyone has aset of the unobtaium bushings for sale or any other performance bushings. Would new stock R1 bushings be enough. NOw my 1995 VR PEP RX-7 rides way too smooth(like a lexus). I really need to replace my bushings and need to do it while it is at Rotary Performance for a pot job. E-mail me if you have bushing sets for sale. THANKS
- Kevin (KEMRX7@aol.com)

neofreak

Since you guys seemed very skeptical, I decided to give SP a call, I have confirmed with them that they do indeed exist, and their car is currently outfitted with them.

Jim, you were right, Customer tunable at point of purchase (which is what I meant in my first post) The three levels of firmness I refered to meant int he firmness of the bushing, not ride stiffness.

Anyways, they mentioned to me that if I wanted to get a group buy going they'd be more than happy to make a few sets before they officially market the product (in order to get some feedback, etc)

2-5 sets $650 each
5-10 sets $625 each
10-15 sets $600 each

This is for their Nylon set, self lubricating, and all that good stuff.

I've already got a couple people locally interested, so we're well on our way. If you're interested let me know and I'll try to take care of everything. email me at justin@prettycoolstuff.com if you're interested. =)

Johnny

I've had my bushing since the first run...and yes they have been uninstalled....early in the process I was offered $200 if they could be "borrowed" nothing really wrong with that...I'm sure they just wanted to take the measurements since everything is out of the car and it would be very easy at the point...I declined... but they wouldn't be that hard to copy...so I can see it happening.

RotaryKnight

Talked to Alex today and asked him about the bushing set.

It will be a complete set which includes diff bushings. Projected release is going to be around the 2nd week of the new year. The bushings are PolyUrethane...he didn't specify stiffness.

It has been used on two other FD besides the supra7, or at least some of the bushings have.

Retail will be less than originally posted. I asked him what "normal" retail would be and he said that they are trying to make the kit affordable in the mid $400.

neofreak

You scared me there for a second RotaryKnight, I thought we were getting ripped off, so I called again, Alex confirmed that the Nylon bushings would retail at $750, and $400 is a target price for polyurethane, but nothing has been set in stone.

If anyone wants to get into the group buy, let me know. I plan to submit the order before the new year.

voodooracing

Put me down for a set!

I spoke to Alex too, he also told me the retail for the nylon bushings are going to be about 750, so best to get it from the group buy.

neofreak, i just emailed you.

DomFD3S

Are the SP Engineering Nylon bushings going to have a metal rod (similar to the Unobtainium...BTW, thanks Jim) that inserts into the center of the bushings OR are they just going to do away with that and make a completely solid bushing? I'm just curious.

neofreak

Yes, they do have the metal rod, and they also have a grease retaining groove which I believe the unobtainium bushings do not have. I was forwarded photos this morning, and will post them when I get home.

neofreak

Pic 1

neofreak

Pic 2

Johnny

Groove of not...they will eventually need to be greased...I would still recommend the grease fitting for the long haul

voodooracing

May be thats still better than the old design, no grease at all....

jr

How much do grease fittings cost, and what needs to be done to the bushing to install them?

neofreak

Anyways, we can debate this forever if we wanted to, I don't see you complaining about this in the other threads about Nylon bushings or when anyone else tries to get a group buy going.

If you want to impede this group buy for some reason, just come right out and say it. If you had trouble with a different set of bushings, how can you be sure this one will have the same issues as yours? With all the responses I've been getting I don't think I'm the only one anticipating a set, and I trust them to build a quality product.

In anycase, we need just one more order to get to $625, so if you haven't contacted me yet or have not mailed/paypaled your deposit, email me (justin@prettycoolstuff.com)

jimlab

So what did they do, copy my design exactly? How professional...

MPython

iTrader: (1)

Jim, if I may, now that I've been through this...

The grease fittings can be as cheap as less than $10 for all 16 bushings for the regular steel fittings. I got the 303 stainless ones, and they cost me close to $40 for the set. Add another $3-$5 for a bag of caps.

Jimlab has instructions on his site for installing the grease fittings. But basically, you drill a hole through your suspension component while the bushing is in place without the steel rod. The bushing shouldn't move while drilling. Then I think the hole is tapped for threads. Then you install the grease fitting. Then cap it.

Jeff

DomFD3S

That's exactly what I thought. Don't get me wrong, but they look exactly the same from those photos, complete w/ the lip that is to be found on one side of the bushing. They could have at least made some effort to make the bushing "look" different or at least colored it.

neofreak

Regardless if they copied it or not, you've said many times during your many group buys that each of them was going to be your last set, so if someone decides to tool up to produce something that will not be made any more? So you go back on your word and start making them again or go through another vendor to make them again. I only bought yours because during one of your earlier group buys you said it would be your last, knowing I wouldn't be installing them for years, after two more group buys I sold them since I wanted to cut my losses.

Anyway, I'm not defending anyone, I have no problem with you, or them, I just want to get the group buy done so I have nothing to do with this any more.

jimlab

No, actually I said that the first group purchase was to be the last, since my friend and I were dissolving both the business and our friendship and the manufacturer was a mutual friend. I came out the other side as the sole owner of the bushings, hence the subsequent group purchases which the buying public requested.

You were one of the ones who bought one of the hand made sets from the first group purchase and then complained about the price when they were available for a lower price later, both because of volume and because a less labor intensive manufacturing process was found. Buy a car on Monday and they have the same model for $1,000 off and 0.9% financing on the following Saturday... I told you that I sympathized, but that's life.

The last group purchase was *my* last group purchase, because I do not have time to deal with the retail end of the business. However, that does not mean that *my* design is suddenly public domain. I still hold proprietary rights to the bushing designs, and have been in negotiations with others to allow the bushings to continue to be sold. The design is still mine until I give away or sell the rights to it, neither of which has taken place yet.

So what is your stake in this group buy if you already had my bushings and had no plans to install them? Did you sell or loan them to SP Engineering to copy for some compensation to "cut your losses"?

jimlab

Precisely. That could have been one of my own photos. It doesn't look like they changed even so much as the pin sizing.

Guess it's time to give my lawyer a call.