Main pulley wobble / Eshaft wobble
07-06-12, 11:59 PM
#1
Main pulley wobble / Eshaft wobble
I bought my engine off the forum with 8000 miles on it. Ive driven about 600 or so miles and barely noticed the main pulley wobbling at idle. I checked end float and it is in spec at .002". I removed the main pulley and ran the car with the plate bolted on for the angle sensors only. I still see a wobble in the hub.
I called Mazdatrix and they said its impossible to have dropped a thrust bearing and still have the end float in spec. I called Pettit and they said it is possible. Anyone have any wisdom for me?? Engine runs amazing, very smooth. Oil looks good. No noise.
I called Mazdatrix and they said its impossible to have dropped a thrust bearing and still have the end float in spec. I called Pettit and they said it is possible. Anyone have any wisdom for me?? Engine runs amazing, very smooth. Oil looks good. No noise.
07-07-12, 12:31 AM
#2
I agree with Mazdatrix, if end play is measured correctly and is within factory spec I dont see how a thrust washer/bearing could be squeezed or dropped. Id say not to worry too much. Have a friend push the clutch in with the car running and inspect the pulley.
07-07-12, 01:03 AM
#3
What am I looking for with the clutch pushed in? I measured end play with a dial indicator by using a 36" pry bar between the water pump and main pulley. Gentle push made it Softly click and give me my reading. Removed inspection plate and pryed on flywheel, same reading.
07-08-12, 08:48 AM
#6
RX-7 Bad Ass
iTrader: (55)
If you are pulling the front cover, I'd go ahead and pull the engine out of the car. You'll be ahead of the game in the long run. You also have to unbolt the oil pan and reseal it as well as pulling the ac/ps bracket.
Dale
Dale
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07-08-12, 12:34 PM
#9
you're probably wasting your time. i agree, if endplay is in spec it is doubtful to be a front stack issue, as well a worn front stack won't cause a wobble, it will cause crank walk, grinding and engine failure due to the metal in the oil.
sounds like someone dropped the engine on the pulleys and bent them. that or your front main bearings are severely worn from someone overtightening the drive belts and running it like that for some time, if that's the case you would feel some lateral/vertical play in the e-shaft.
sounds like someone dropped the engine on the pulleys and bent them. that or your front main bearings are severely worn from someone overtightening the drive belts and running it like that for some time, if that's the case you would feel some lateral/vertical play in the e-shaft.
07-08-12, 04:12 PM
#10
The shavings were silver. It looked like a lot of fine particles with a few larger shavings.
I know I'm probably wasting my time with the front cover. I do remember removing the main bolt to remove the thermal pellet before the engine went in though. I figured might as well check.
I know I'm probably wasting my time with the front cover. I do remember removing the main bolt to remove the thermal pellet before the engine went in though. I figured might as well check.
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wankel88 (06-20-20)
07-09-12, 10:48 AM
#11
Front stationary gear bearing is worn in some spots showing copper.
Thrust plate has some cracking?
Front thrust bearing was slightly bent in one spot and worn on both sides.
Should I just replace all of these parts? Does the engine need to be torn down because of the bearing problem?
Thrust plate has some cracking?
Front thrust bearing was slightly bent in one spot and worn on both sides.
Should I just replace all of these parts? Does the engine need to be torn down because of the bearing problem?
07-10-12, 04:29 AM
#15
Actually about 1thou-4thou in the shaft runout. Removed all pinched bearings and still see a wobble. I think the E-shaft snout is bent. Time for a rebuild? This engine was put together very half a$$. They smeared sealant on the counterweight when installing the front cover.
Link to the video: E-shaft Wobble - YouTube
Link to the video: E-shaft Wobble - YouTube
07-10-12, 09:40 AM
#16
RX-7 Bad Ass
iTrader: (55)
Could be the e-shaft bent or something wrong with one of the bearings. Really, going through the engine is going to be the next step.
An incorrectly assembled front stack with a pinched needle bearing will give you a lot of front to back slop but you shouldn't have that wobble.
You can spec the e-shaft on the V-blocks with a dial indicator to check for straightness. If it is bent, good used e-shafts should be a dime a dozen.
Dale
An incorrectly assembled front stack with a pinched needle bearing will give you a lot of front to back slop but you shouldn't have that wobble.
You can spec the e-shaft on the V-blocks with a dial indicator to check for straightness. If it is bent, good used e-shafts should be a dime a dozen.
Dale
07-10-12, 10:48 AM
#17
take this with a grain of salt as i can't make out much from the video but i don't see anything wrong with anything anywhere here.
i can't see significant runout in the video, the bearings look normal and unless the front cover was leaking or some other issue is present what is the problem exactly aside from a visual twitch? does the front cover leak oil? engine vibrate? clutch pedal feel wobbly/pulsate? if not, i think you're spinning your wheels. some copper on the stat bearing showing isn't a huge deal, nor is a slight scuff on the thrust bearings(they are never perfectly flat).
if it were me i'd just put it out of mind. even if it has a minimal amount of runout unless it is causing issues it isn't worth spending thousands to fix something that is just a minor visual nuisance.
yeah flame on, call me names and that this engine needs to be replaced immediately but all i will say is: this is no issue. the hub will have some runout once it is attached to the e-shaft. the reference in the video can easily give a false impression as you have the counterweight spinning giving the impression that the hub is moving, but i couldn't even see it nudge.
just don't crank it much more, without oil in the engine you will create an issue.
i can't see significant runout in the video, the bearings look normal and unless the front cover was leaking or some other issue is present what is the problem exactly aside from a visual twitch? does the front cover leak oil? engine vibrate? clutch pedal feel wobbly/pulsate? if not, i think you're spinning your wheels. some copper on the stat bearing showing isn't a huge deal, nor is a slight scuff on the thrust bearings(they are never perfectly flat).
if it were me i'd just put it out of mind. even if it has a minimal amount of runout unless it is causing issues it isn't worth spending thousands to fix something that is just a minor visual nuisance.
yeah flame on, call me names and that this engine needs to be replaced immediately but all i will say is: this is no issue. the hub will have some runout once it is attached to the e-shaft. the reference in the video can easily give a false impression as you have the counterweight spinning giving the impression that the hub is moving, but i couldn't even see it nudge.
just don't crank it much more, without oil in the engine you will create an issue.
Last edited by RotaryEvolution; 07-10-12 at 10:56 AM.
07-10-12, 02:55 PM
#18
With the pulleys bolted on you see a pretty bad wobble. Belts were brand new and after 600miles they looked pretty bad. Oil is new and after 600 miles decent amount of metal shavings. Pulled the front cover and the thrust bearing was pinched and bent. Thrust washer was cracking and so was the thrust plate.
I'm going to pull the engine tomorrow and check the rear stat bearing. If its not worn out I'll try a new front stat bearing and hub to see if the wobble gets corrected.
I'm going to pull the engine tomorrow and check the rear stat bearing. If its not worn out I'll try a new front stat bearing and hub to see if the wobble gets corrected.
07-11-12, 09:55 PM
#20
Rear stationary bearing looks pretty bad too. I'm tired of crossing my fingers and hoping this car works. My mistake was to buy a used engine without documentation. I am tearing the engine down to check the rotor bearings as well.
Karack I understand what you're saying and totally respect you. If something does go wrong though I can't afford a 4k rebuild with new rotor housings and the like.
Karack I understand what you're saying and totally respect you. If something does go wrong though I can't afford a 4k rebuild with new rotor housings and the like.
07-11-12, 10:19 PM
#21
The front bearing looked normal, but I would be concerned with the rear bearing now having seen that. Normally the wear on the rear bearing is consistent, this one looks to be wearing rather oddly. Could be a bent shaft. Like Dale said, get a different shaft. Might as well replace the bearing set while your at it.
I agree with Rotary Evolution that the video doesn't really show much wobble, but I am sure it is more noticeable in person. If this does turn out to be a bent shaft, pat yourself on the back for saving yourself headache down the road.
I agree with Rotary Evolution that the video doesn't really show much wobble, but I am sure it is more noticeable in person. If this does turn out to be a bent shaft, pat yourself on the back for saving yourself headache down the road.
07-15-12, 10:57 PM
#24
well i can admit when i'm wrong. it just didn't seem like a front thrust bearing issue.
the rotor housing i can't tell, could be flash from the camera or some odd wear patterns that i have never seen before.
the rotor is fine. and don't worry about the tension bolts, only 2 should go back to original positions which are the ones outside of the bellhousing.
the rotor housing i can't tell, could be flash from the camera or some odd wear patterns that i have never seen before.
the rotor is fine. and don't worry about the tension bolts, only 2 should go back to original positions which are the ones outside of the bellhousing.
07-15-12, 11:19 PM
#25
Im gonna take a stab in the dark and say these rotor housings are not useable? Haha this build just doubled in price. I was running 9 plugs all the way around with an hks ignition amp. I am running water but that was after I got tuned. Might be from the previous owner putting 8k on the engine.
I started cleaning the rotors and noticed the gold finish is worn off showing silver near all the corner seals. Useable?
Karack, the marks running up from the trailing plug are not from the flash.
I started cleaning the rotors and noticed the gold finish is worn off showing silver near all the corner seals. Useable?
Karack, the marks running up from the trailing plug are not from the flash.
Last edited by linnadawg; 07-15-12 at 11:21 PM.