KDR anti-det device, just spark plug ion sensing ign. and strobe unit?
10-09-03, 01:47 PM
#26
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Originally posted by t-von
Well since we now know what it is, how does it affect future tuning? Would any shop that tunes aftermarket ecu's be able to tune with this device already installed if a person decided to further upgrade their 7? Or does it have to go back and be tuned at the shop that installed the anti-det device?
Edit: Batman, do you possibly know how reliable this thing is.
Well since we now know what it is, how does it affect future tuning? Would any shop that tunes aftermarket ecu's be able to tune with this device already installed if a person decided to further upgrade their 7? Or does it have to go back and be tuned at the shop that installed the anti-det device?
Edit: Batman, do you possibly know how reliable this thing is.
KDR is working (between their regular duties of working on rx7s) with various shops across the USA to train them.
I do know that they have a bunch of anti-kaboom parts fabricated in the hundreds for near-future deployment.
10-09-03, 03:08 PM
#30
KDR is working (between their regular duties of working on rx7s) with various shops across the USA to train them.
Awsome, I hope KDR is able to follow all the way through w/ this project (full closed loop).
It is great when little performance companies get a major break- like AEM showing Honda the hybrid way!
Has KDR approached Mazda?
I believe AEM now has awsome contracts w/ Honda. They can sell their aftermarket parts installed w/ full Honda warranty among other things...
-edit- can't type well on work keyboar (spelling)
Awsome, I hope KDR is able to follow all the way through w/ this project (full closed loop).
It is great when little performance companies get a major break- like AEM showing Honda the hybrid way!
Has KDR approached Mazda?
I believe AEM now has awsome contracts w/ Honda. They can sell their aftermarket parts installed w/ full Honda warranty among other things...
-edit- can't type well on work keyboar (spelling)
10-09-03, 10:11 PM
#32
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Mercedes used the ionic measurements on their V12 between 2001-2002 to detect detonation. It basically fired the plug to ignite the mixture, then fired it a second time a few milliseconds later at a much lower voltage to get its data. Seemed to work O.K. but why did it only last for 2 years? Kinda makes you wonder...
10-09-03, 10:37 PM
#34
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Ionic Sensing?????... Geezus..., do you have any idea what you guys sound like???? Take off the Spock ears and get out of your mothers basements. Installation IS the most important thing, you screw that up and you will nuke you car instantly, thats what i was told and I belive it, just let KDR do it and be happy that it works. Ionic Sensing.. next your gonna tell me that they are building TIE Fighters on the back loading dock at KDR where that peice of junk widebody first gen used to sit.
10-09-03, 10:47 PM
#35
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"next your gonna tell me that they are building TIE Fighters on the back loading dock at KDR where that peice of junk widebody first gen used to sit."
Really? I want one! Let those Supra guys top that! :P
Really? I want one! Let those Supra guys top that! :P
10-09-03, 11:31 PM
#37
fart on a friends head!!!
are you saying that ionic sensing isnt real?. . . its only an assumption that this may be what it is. geeks, we may be. . . but at least we like to know what our car DOES.
paul
paul
10-10-03, 02:01 AM
#38
just because you're too stupid and ignorant to take part in a intelligent conversation doesnt mean you have to bash it, **** i can barely understand any of this, which is why im not making any comments, just reading.
Well, until you made an *** out of yourself.
Well, until you made an *** out of yourself.
10-10-03, 04:02 AM
#39
Mercedes used the ionic measurements on their V12 between 2001-2002 to detect detonation. It basically fired the plug to ignite the mixture, then fired it a second time a few milliseconds later at a much lower voltage to get its data. Seemed to work O.K. but why did it only last for 2 years? Kinda makes you wonder...
Yes, this is the most basic form of ionic sensing used so they can run the engine very lean under light load w/ out detonation (which a mere driveability issue at these low loads)
In such a system one sense pulse is used after the ignition event. If detonation is detected it cuts spark.
That simple system is what shortens catalytics life and causes Mercedes to buy Americans new cats as they are federally mandated to warranty cats for 10 years. (3rd time stating something is the charm, right?) That is why they disappeared from the US market.
Now, w/ the recently patented strobe delay circuit- cat's life is not shortened as the charge is ignited before it hits the cat.
_____________________________________________
All that is moot for us since w/ trailing spark available on our rotaries stock we don't need the strobe delay to save a cat.
Which is where a small shop like KDR fits into the small rotary development market like dust in a crack.
Ionic Sensing.. next your gonna tell me that they are building TIE Fighters on the back loading dock at KDR where that peice of junk widebody first gen used to sit.
And if you look at a Honda Insight hybrid IMA system you think
"Holy Jedi's wands, I should have forseen that when I saw that article in Turbo magazine 6 years ago that showed a DC motor and battery in a old Civic on a little So Cal shop's (AEM) dyno."
_____________________________________________
Yes, this is the most basic form of ionic sensing used so they can run the engine very lean under light load w/ out detonation (which a mere driveability issue at these low loads)
In such a system one sense pulse is used after the ignition event. If detonation is detected it cuts spark.
That simple system is what shortens catalytics life and causes Mercedes to buy Americans new cats as they are federally mandated to warranty cats for 10 years. (3rd time stating something is the charm, right?) That is why they disappeared from the US market.
Now, w/ the recently patented strobe delay circuit- cat's life is not shortened as the charge is ignited before it hits the cat.
_____________________________________________
All that is moot for us since w/ trailing spark available on our rotaries stock we don't need the strobe delay to save a cat.
Which is where a small shop like KDR fits into the small rotary development market like dust in a crack.
Ionic Sensing.. next your gonna tell me that they are building TIE Fighters on the back loading dock at KDR where that peice of junk widebody first gen used to sit.
And if you look at a Honda Insight hybrid IMA system you think
"Holy Jedi's wands, I should have forseen that when I saw that article in Turbo magazine 6 years ago that showed a DC motor and battery in a old Civic on a little So Cal shop's (AEM) dyno."
_____________________________________________
These are not the "cough" anti-det devices "cough" you are looking for.
10-10-03, 04:04 AM
#40
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Couple of points
1. The adrenaline research system is 24000
2. The SAAB trionic does not cut spark on knock detection, it retards and then inches back up to best timing
There is a market for a proper ion sensing subsystem for tuned rotaries, but I don't think anyone has anything suitable yet.
watch this space
Bill
1. The adrenaline research system is 24000
2. The SAAB trionic does not cut spark on knock detection, it retards and then inches back up to best timing
There is a market for a proper ion sensing subsystem for tuned rotaries, but I don't think anyone has anything suitable yet.
watch this space
Bill
10-10-03, 04:41 AM
#41
1. The adrenaline research system is 24000
Thats $24,000 for the Adrenaline Research ionic system for racing, for those of you who didn't get that.
Yes, its for racers- they have too much money. It set up to be universal and used for a tuning aid as they do not have it set-up for closed loop like (awsome) Saab Trionic. Racing may not allow for expensive closed loop ionic ignition, but have no rules against expensive tuning aids or "tools".
2. The SAAB trionic does not cut spark on knock detection, it retards and then inches back up to best timing
The Saab system is awsome, but probably patented- right. I don't see their simple variable displacement piston engine available either. They patent things and sit on them.
Thats $24,000 for the Adrenaline Research ionic system for racing, for those of you who didn't get that.
Yes, its for racers- they have too much money. It set up to be universal and used for a tuning aid as they do not have it set-up for closed loop like (awsome) Saab Trionic. Racing may not allow for expensive closed loop ionic ignition, but have no rules against expensive tuning aids or "tools".
2. The SAAB trionic does not cut spark on knock detection, it retards and then inches back up to best timing
The Saab system is awsome, but probably patented- right. I don't see their simple variable displacement piston engine available either. They patent things and sit on them.
10-10-03, 05:57 AM
#42
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As I said in my first post most of the SAAB patents have expired. Plus SAAB is now GM.
If you were reading the mag you said you were, that article was BY adrenaline about what their 24K system can do.
If you were reading the mag you said you were, that article was BY adrenaline about what their 24K system can do.
10-10-03, 07:17 AM
#43
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Originally posted by BLUE TII
Mercedes used the ionic measurements on their V12 between 2001-2002 to detect detonation. It basically fired the plug to ignite the mixture, then fired it a second time a few milliseconds later at a much lower voltage to get its data. Seemed to work O.K. but why did it only last for 2 years? Kinda makes you wonder...
Yes, this is the most basic form of ionic sensing used so they can run the engine very lean under light load w/ out detonation (which a mere driveability issue at these low loads)
In such a system one sense pulse is used after the ignition event. If detonation is detected it cuts spark.
That simple system is what shortens catalytics life and causes Mercedes to buy Americans new cats as they are federally mandated to warranty cats for 10 years. (3rd time stating something is the charm, right?) That is why they disappeared from the US market.
Now, w/ the recently patented strobe delay circuit- cat's life is not shortened as the charge is ignited before it hits the cat.
Mercedes used the ionic measurements on their V12 between 2001-2002 to detect detonation. It basically fired the plug to ignite the mixture, then fired it a second time a few milliseconds later at a much lower voltage to get its data. Seemed to work O.K. but why did it only last for 2 years? Kinda makes you wonder...
Yes, this is the most basic form of ionic sensing used so they can run the engine very lean under light load w/ out detonation (which a mere driveability issue at these low loads)
In such a system one sense pulse is used after the ignition event. If detonation is detected it cuts spark.
That simple system is what shortens catalytics life and causes Mercedes to buy Americans new cats as they are federally mandated to warranty cats for 10 years. (3rd time stating something is the charm, right?) That is why they disappeared from the US market.
Now, w/ the recently patented strobe delay circuit- cat's life is not shortened as the charge is ignited before it hits the cat.
10-10-03, 09:41 AM
#45
Re: Re: KDR anti-det device, just spark plug ion sensing ign. and strobe unit?
Originally posted by Jason
BINGO We have a winner
BINGO We have a winner
Originally posted by BATMAN
Yep.
As mentioned, most of the work is in proper installation and tuning.
Do that wrong and u'll be in a world of hurt.
*puts BLUE TII on the smart guy list*
Yep.
As mentioned, most of the work is in proper installation and tuning.
Do that wrong and u'll be in a world of hurt.
*puts BLUE TII on the smart guy list*
Originally posted by BATMAN
BTW guys.
According to my reliable source this whole thread is NOT the KDR anti-detonation device.
Seriously...
BTW guys.
According to my reliable source this whole thread is NOT the KDR anti-detonation device.
Seriously...
10-10-03, 10:10 AM
#47
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Originally posted by LT1RX7
Batman changing his story again
Batman changing his story again
If it makes people feel better that it is the ION system so be it.
What I have been told from a reliable source is that this is not it.
However, ya'll may have stumble across something new to make the RX7 even more like the Supra...........
More power to us.
10-10-03, 11:47 AM
#48
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Batman
I was just wondering what the truth was because first you said the smart guy list then you said maybe then you said no.
If you do have some agreement where you cant say what it is then at least dont spread MISINFORMATION that is worse than none at all. It also makes people that are interested in the product more skeptical because you claim to be in some sort of dealing with KDR but then you spread misinformation.
Just my take
I was just wondering what the truth was because first you said the smart guy list then you said maybe then you said no.
If you do have some agreement where you cant say what it is then at least dont spread MISINFORMATION that is worse than none at all. It also makes people that are interested in the product more skeptical because you claim to be in some sort of dealing with KDR but then you spread misinformation.
Just my take
10-10-03, 11:54 AM
#49
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The author is a smart person.
That doesn't have to do with KDRs anti-kaboom device.
The author have stumbled across another "technology" that may have proper implementation for the RX7.
Please point out specific quotes of mine that I have spread misinformation and I shall address them as objective as I can.
That doesn't have to do with KDRs anti-kaboom device.
The author have stumbled across another "technology" that may have proper implementation for the RX7.
Please point out specific quotes of mine that I have spread misinformation and I shall address them as objective as I can.
10-10-03, 12:16 PM
#50
As I said in my first post most of the SAAB patents have expired. Plus SAAB is now GM.
Actually the cars mentioned do not have any problem with cats. I've never seen one go bad. They do have ignition problems though
As I stated I just skimmed the mag article in the store and then when some KDR affiliate mentioned exhaust backfires along w/ all the other ignition/ lean burn features
I thought- HMMM!
I am ignorant about these ionic systems, all the info here is all I have actually read. I did not stress this earlier since I wanted people to read and discuss w/ out tie fighter comments.
The author is a smart person.
Not really, but I am not afraid to TRY to think either.
It doesn't have to do with KDRs anti-kaboom device.
The author have stumbled across another "technology" that may have proper implementation for the RX7.
OK. I think it was really telling that the posted kdr dyno sheet did not even start rpm untill the benifits of system were all but tapered off. The low rpm torque increase is going to be incredible. That is what the driveability testimonials all but state as well.
Actually the cars mentioned do not have any problem with cats. I've never seen one go bad. They do have ignition problems though
As I stated I just skimmed the mag article in the store and then when some KDR affiliate mentioned exhaust backfires along w/ all the other ignition/ lean burn features
I thought- HMMM!
I am ignorant about these ionic systems, all the info here is all I have actually read. I did not stress this earlier since I wanted people to read and discuss w/ out tie fighter comments.
The author is a smart person.
Not really, but I am not afraid to TRY to think either.
It doesn't have to do with KDRs anti-kaboom device.
The author have stumbled across another "technology" that may have proper implementation for the RX7.
OK. I think it was really telling that the posted kdr dyno sheet did not even start rpm untill the benifits of system were all but tapered off. The low rpm torque increase is going to be incredible. That is what the driveability testimonials all but state as well.