I have done the search and there is tons of information on this subject however i dont feel that I found my pure answer. Im deciding between the two. I love the way the sequential twins feel its a very smooth delivery of power, and i love the low end boost, but i love the idea of a easier 400+hp is pretty attractive. Right now im kind of leaning toward the GT35 kit just for the fact that it seems more reliable switching to a single turbo with (to me) more potential. I plan on using this car as a weekend car and when complete doing some Autocross with it. Just want some opinions on what you would personally go with. a simple BNR's or GT35R would be sufficient and some reasons would be amazing. Once again i know this has been beaten but im sitting on the fence right now and my ***** are killing me.

 

Based on what your post I'd recommend the BNR stage 3s setup up sequentially.

 

Just realize going single is going to be more expensive then going with the BNR's, there are a lot of hidden costs going single turbo that people don't realize. On that note, if you can afford it, I would go with the gt35r. I am/was in the same boat going back and forth between the BNR's and single turbo, I decided to go single turbo in the next couple of months (full HKS t04z kit).

 

lol purerx7 thanks..... I dont know what theese hidden costs are... Before i switch out the original twins ill have just about every mod for the car done everything from full exhaust, to fuel kit, intercooler just about everything. I think within a year it will be ready for the finale which is the turbos on a streetport. What are these hidden costs i may not have gotten myself ready for?

 

If you already have all the supporting mods there really aren't too many as long as you buy a good kit. There will be things like turbo blankets, ceramic coatings and things of that nature but that's up to you. It can get as expensive as you want. lol

 

Well i dont want it to get expensive. The bnr's just match straight up like the twins correct? I shouldnt have to get a different down pipe or any other kinds of lines or anything like that?

 

I purchased the GT35R Kit from A-Spec a few months ago. I also replaced the engine at the same time but will try to list what was extra. My kit was ceramic coated( manifold, turbine housing, and down pipe) polished compressor housing. This was basically the most expensive GT35R kit minus bungs for EGT sensors. Cost was just over $4000. I also spent
1. $150 on a cast 90 elbow and mandrel bent IC piping and couplers for the compressor side of the IC.
2.$200 on thermal sleeves and sheets for the fender well.
3.$125 on a turbo blanket.
4.$300 for Innovate LC1 Wideband
5.$150 for Blitz Boost controller used
6.$300 Coolingmist Water injection
The last 3 could go either way as I think they are not specific to a single.
Like you, I already had the other mods ( Fuel, IC, Ignition, etc.) so it really didn't cost much more than the kit.
You will also need to factor in build time if you go with the A-Spec Kit. I dont know the wait time for the BNR's but I know my kit has been on order for a few months.

 

On this one I agree with GoodFella. With you wanting to autocross the car the sequential BNR's are going to provide much more usable power. They will spool up early providing good boost at lower rpm than the single turbo. Yes, the GT35R spools pretty quickly, but not as fast as sequential twins.

The GT35R will most definately yeild a bit higher numbers ultimately than the BNR's, but even it will not provide much power above running 17-20 psi. It runs out of its efficiency range then. The GT35R will also be a much simpler setup than the twins, also reducing under hood temps. A 400+ hp FD is something else to really handle. I have driven many 500+ vettes and such and my FD that sits just over 400rwhp is more of a handlfull. Not to mention I do not think you will really have much opportunity to use such power on an autocross track, the power just comes on a little too late. The BNR car would be much quicker, even with less hp.

I LOVE my single turbo setup, but I would also not autocross my car. GREAT time trial/attack car, but not so good autocross car.

 

GT35R, I like simplicity.

 

i would say BNR...i dont have either yet, but ive been doing alot of research aswell...single turbos can make more power, and are better in the cooling department..but your never going to get the reaction time the twins have

its what my friend with the gt35 turbo always says about the twins, "its like power on demand, theres no waiting for it to spool up" or someting along those lines

but the BNR's can hold a good amount of power...but its really preference

will you regret not having that quick spool at lower rpms? i currently have stockers and i love the fact that i start spooling up at 2500 rpms

its all up to what your willing to sacrifice

 

I'll be going with BNR stage 3... picking up the New Stage 3 in next couple of weeks..

To be honest, I'm not looking for simple.... I've dealt with sequential set up for the past 10 years and when you get it going, there is nothing better.

 

since you're going to autoX definitely go BNR Stage 3's.

 

BNR stage 3... sequential or non sequential ? ppl

?

 

Im running a GT35R with the 0.64 AR exhaust housing.

Relatively, that's a really small housing for an FD, but it's really good for autoX which is what I use the car mainly for. I had non-seq stock twins before, ported WG, ceramic coated, full ex., big SMIC, etc etc, and I WAY prefer the GT35R with the 0.64 AR ex. housing.

The spool is quicker than the twins and comes in much smoother.

And simplicity with dual ball bearings FTMFW! You'll also love the induction noise from a single.

 

I've never autocrossed but I'd image it would be similiar to what some small tracks I go to are like. With that in mind, I'd recommend the BNR's over the GT35R.

I have used the BNR's for a whole season and now have a single turbo (A-Spec 500R-SP) so I have personal experience with both (including stock twins which feel identical to BNR's minus power difference). The BNR's were a lot easier to drive on small courses then my single is. A single has a much bigger snap effect coming out of really tight corners. Now on big tracks, this isn't really a problem and I love the power a decent single brings. With the BNR's, it was very easy to power out of the apex. Not just because there wasn't as much power there, but also because you can control how much boost they put out with the throttle and make a very clean transition to WOT.

I recommend to most people to go single since it simplifies everything greatly, declutters your engine bay, and provides much needed cooling to our overheated turbo rotaries. But if you have autocross in mind or even small tracks, you'll be happier with the BNR's for fun, competition, and consistency. This is my opinion, use it for what its worth.

Just make sure you got dual oil coolers

Note: I ran the BNR's sequentially @ 15-18 PSi (kept uping the boost until I grenaded the motor )

thewird

 

I'm running BNR's in sequential mode atm.

400whp is def attainable with these twins. I believe Rich made 421 @ 17.5psi on his, I myself made 391-401whp (340rwhp in England on a DynoDynamics Dyno, add 15-18% for American equiv) at the same boost.

A couple things to keep in mind with the BNR's... Your Solenoids will probably fail, try to get replacements that can withstand the higher pressure!!! Water/Meth Injection is critical!

When you say you've already done "just about every mod for the car" what do you mean? You can easily spend 6k on supporting mods if you're looking for high, reliable, power out of BNRs. Don't forget the little things, they can/will make or break your quest for big power on sequential twins.

Basic things I did before going with my BNRs (BEYOND the basic mods), just to give you an idea:

Clutch kit
3bar MAP sensor
Big Brake kit/rotors
Ignition Amp
A/I system
Rad/AST/IC (later upgraded with a V-Mount)
BOV (I broke two stock ones when running 15-16psi)
Hosing/check valves
Boost Controller
Fuel Pump (rewired)
FPR
Injectors
WBO2 - LC1
Bracing (Diff/Tranny brace)

That's just what I can think of off the top of my head... all are pretty much critical imo to run any serious power for any length of time (I've DD'd my FD for about two years now with no *major* problems).


BNR's are awesome! My only complaint so far is the inadequacy of the stock Boost Solenoids when it comes to higher pressure.

 

So After reading everything that you guys have said, Im really leaning toward the BNR stage 3's. Now what i need to know is where to go to obtain theese. I have read other threads that said something about a older model being built different and that the newer models are more reliable... Can anyone shed some light on that for me? And whats the best place to order them from? I have seen the name Bryan mentioned several times when talking about BNR's. Appreciate all the help fellas.

 

http://bnrturbos.com/3rdGen.htm

thewird

 

Did you have Rob Bailey's solenoids with your setup? If so, can I buy them off you??? Rob's gone MIA as far as I can tell

 

which exact GT35 we you planning on? There are like 8 specs of them.

 

I was at the same crossroad. I ended up purchasing the GT3574r bb turbo kit from A-spec. supposedly spools faster than the standard 35r, but won't peak out as high.

I will know once i get the car running if it was a good decision or not.

 

I autocrossed seriously the last 2 years on 99 twins and 14-15psi. Somewhere in the 320rwhp range. I'm a decent driver and even with 285 Hoosiers at all corners, the car was overpowered. Yes, the primary turbo is excellent for coming out of corners and such. But some of our courses had little straights in them in which, while being in sequential, there's that power delay before the 2ndary comes on. At my boost levels, it would come on like a freight train just before I had to break before a turn. That's one grip about a high powered stock turbo'd FD.
I'm also fairly convinced now that these last 2 years running every other weekend or so, contributed greatly to my coolant seal failure on my 94 at 55K miles. The heat that the twins produce coupled with the stock cast iron manifolds heat soaking properties makes me think twice about getting back to seriously autocrossing again. Autox is a high-load, low-speed environment. You come back after your run and the car sits for a couple of minutes. The fans don't help much either. I suppose AI would help alot more.
Just some longevity things to consider outside of the power ones.

 

I used to have temp issues on long periods of high boost. So I converted to Evans and since could not be happier with temps.

Look into sourcing some
http://www.evanscooling.com/main1.htm
but be cautious when or if converting ... you must remove ALL water based anti-freeze for this polymer to work properly. So in my case
1. I drained it all and used my compressor to blow out the left overs as much as possible.
2. filled up with evans let it run through the system and drained again
3. filled up for the final time and temps have been super stable since.

Note: There are 2 available NPG+ AND NPGR; the R has a higher b-temp and won't exit the system at a fast rate if there is a leak. It somehow stays in the system longer.
I had a leaking water pump and its thicker nature just didn't leak out but rather it slowly oozed out saving my car from over heating.

 

The stock 16 year old solenoids never failed me even when I was running 17 PSi. My car wasn't just a weekend warrior either. It's a daily driver and I went almost every weekend last year to the track and beat the crap out of it all day.

The only thing that every failed on me was the stock fuel pressure regulator which made me start leaning out. Thankfully I had a wideband and noticed it so no harm done.

Oil cooling is very important. If your tracking your car your car seriously, you NEED good dual oil coolers. Dual R1's sometimes might not be enough.

thewird

 

what will be the best idea with the BNR stage 3... sequential or non sequential???