FD Pricing Database
01-23-18, 08:34 AM
#1
FD Pricing Database
Hey guys, I posted this a few days ago in a different section where I thought it “should go” but got no responses, so I figured I’d put it here where it will be seen by the most people whom it aims to effect.
Your thoughts?
Nick
There is so much mystery surrounding the value of our cars. NADA, BlueBook, Auto Trader, they’re all wrong. The forum seems to be the most accurate reflection of the true values of our cars, yet we rarely know what they sell for, only what was being asked.
I think the forum could take on the challenge of asking people who sell their cars on the forum to anonymously submit details of the sale of their car. We can come up with some basic criteria and classify them in some basic categories. Stock, Semi-Stock, Modified - as an example.
By doing this we can provide a vital tool for the entire RX-7 community which will help us all gauge the value of our cars instead of guessing and either pricing it too low and basically giving the car away, or over pricing it and sitting on the car for ages.
Can we do this?
I think the forum could take on the challenge of asking people who sell their cars on the forum to anonymously submit details of the sale of their car. We can come up with some basic criteria and classify them in some basic categories. Stock, Semi-Stock, Modified - as an example.
By doing this we can provide a vital tool for the entire RX-7 community which will help us all gauge the value of our cars instead of guessing and either pricing it too low and basically giving the car away, or over pricing it and sitting on the car for ages.
Can we do this?
Nick
01-24-18, 09:39 AM
#3
I personally think creating a log of actual selling prices is a brilliant idea. People tend to overvalue their cars; and even when the market declines, asking prices generally stay the same. So the real market value lies within the selling price (which is seldom disclosed to the public). I've attached a short article detailing the psychology behind sellers and asking prices relative to true market values. Certainly an interesting read for those interested.
https://www.ferraris-online.com/page...=FZA_201702_MU
https://www.ferraris-online.com/page...=FZA_201702_MU
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Fritz Flynn (02-04-18)
01-24-18, 09:46 AM
#4
I personally think creating a log of actual selling prices is a brilliant idea. People tend to overvalue their cars; and even when the market declines, asking prices generally stay the same. So the real market value lies within the selling price (which is seldom disclosed to the public). I've attached a short article detailing the psychology behind sellers and asking prices relative to true market values. Certainly an interesting read for those interested.
https://www.ferraris-online.com/page...=FZA_201702_MU
https://www.ferraris-online.com/page...=FZA_201702_MU
100% agree, which is why I posted this up. I know I didn’t pay the asking price for my FD. If you go by that, I bought a car that was selling for $23k. That was two years ago and so I should be able to sell my car for maybe $25k now, right? Maybe not...I’d be happy to spearhead this if the moderators are willing. I could produce a simple survey and email it out to all users who have a “Sold” thread, who were opted in to receiving emails from moderators. I can then compile that data in a simple spreadsheet and come up with low, median and high price ranges based on our criteria for condition and mileage. This is what companies like Hagerty do for this very same reason. It’s nearly impossible to have accurate pricing information with virtually all transactions are made “in the shadows”, so to speak. Nick
01-24-18, 10:04 AM
#5
All out Track Freak!
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While that would be awesome, I am skeptical that an insurance company would accept such a thing for a declared value. We could try though!
100% agree, which is why I posted this up. I know I didn’t pay the asking price for my FD. If you go by that, I bought a car that was selling for $23k. That was two years ago and so I should be able to sell my car for maybe $25k now, right? Maybe not...I’d be happy to spearhead this if the moderators are willing. I could produce a simple survey and email it out to all users who have a “Sold” thread, who were opted in to receiving emails from moderators. I can then compile that data in a simple spreadsheet and come up with low, median and high price ranges based on our criteria for condition and mileage. This is what companies like Hagerty do for this very same reason. It’s nearly impossible to have accurate pricing information with virtually all transactions are made “in the shadows”, so to speak. Nick
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Crynyd (08-21-19)
Trending Topics
01-24-18, 08:29 PM
#8
Data Logs
How about a source that shows the sales value of 5-10 FD every week?
The auction data for RHD FD in Japan is easily accessible on line. It gives the price in yen that auction cars sold at and also the VIN number. Add $2000~5000 and you have the North American price for RHD. Add $5~10,000 and you have the LHD price.
Of course it is not that simple.
But overtime an accumulated data-base could provide more quantifiable correlation trends.
1993 RHD FD are now eligible for US import. This will add to the data available from the batch of 1992 that already have moved over.
The auction data for RHD FD in Japan is easily accessible on line. It gives the price in yen that auction cars sold at and also the VIN number. Add $2000~5000 and you have the North American price for RHD. Add $5~10,000 and you have the LHD price.
Of course it is not that simple.
But overtime an accumulated data-base could provide more quantifiable correlation trends.
1993 RHD FD are now eligible for US import. This will add to the data available from the batch of 1992 that already have moved over.
Last edited by Redbul; 01-24-18 at 08:33 PM.
01-24-18, 09:39 PM
#10
How about a source that shows the sales value of 5-10 FD every week?
The auction data for RHD FD in Japan is easily accessible on line. It gives the price in yen that auction cars sold at and also the VIN number. Add $2000~5000 and you have the North American price for RHD. Add $5~10,000 and you have the LHD price.
Of course it is not that simple.
But overtime an accumulated data-base could provide more quantifiable correlation trends.
1993 RHD FD are now eligible for US import. This will add to the data available from the batch of 1992 that already have moved over.
The auction data for RHD FD in Japan is easily accessible on line. It gives the price in yen that auction cars sold at and also the VIN number. Add $2000~5000 and you have the North American price for RHD. Add $5~10,000 and you have the LHD price.
Of course it is not that simple.
But overtime an accumulated data-base could provide more quantifiable correlation trends.
1993 RHD FD are now eligible for US import. This will add to the data available from the batch of 1992 that already have moved over.
It’s not about inflating FD prices. It’s about informing buyers so they make the right decisions. The likelihood is that the true sale prices will be lower than the asking prices, obviously. But, it will help a seller one day who has had his FD for sale for three months and is starting to get desperate or wondering if the car is just listed too high. The reality may be that he’s right on the money but enough tire kickers and low ballers have him questioning it. He may cave in and sell the car for $2k under real world value for a car with similar mods and condition. Having accurate numbers also provides the sellers with concrete data so they can get their full asking price, if they’ve done their homework. So, it works both ways. Nick
01-24-18, 11:13 PM
#11
There is no way to validate the sales. I could say I sold mine for $5k less than I did to manipulate the database. No insurance company would ever use it and it will not influence sales prices. Sales are low volume and car conditions and attributes vary widely. Rollers can go from $3k to $10k+. A database like this will not do much for serious buyers and sellers. It's for watchers to have fun watching and estimating.
01-25-18, 02:31 AM
#12
Crapping out
Certainly the Japanese auctions can be a crap shoot. But the selling is based on standardized grading procedures (trustworthy or not) under which thousands of cars change hands through fairly sophisticated national networks,. For the FD, you can get many data points and, with sufficient data, you can weed out the outliers. In Vancouver we have very many RHD and it is a game of cat and mouse with the insurance company. They certainly will give you a chance to bring in local ads. Hopefully, in time, they will take the Japanese data into consideration as well, because our ready access to that market certainly sets the pricing tone here.
Last edited by Redbul; 01-25-18 at 02:34 AM. Reason: spellcheck, added text
01-25-18, 08:55 AM
#13
There is no way to validate the sales. I could say I sold mine for $5k less than I did to manipulate the database. No insurance company would ever use it and it will not influence sales prices. Sales are low volume and car conditions and attributes vary widely. Rollers can go from $3k to $10k+. A database like this will not do much for serious buyers and sellers. It's for watchers to have fun watching and estimating.
Your point is valid but why would someone lie about what they sold their car for? They don’t stand to gain anything. Perhaps if they habitually buy and sell FD’s like say Fritz or Snook, they may stand to gain by lying and lowering the overall value slightly so they can buy them for less but then they’d also sell them for less wouldn’t they? I don’t see any true advantage. Not to mention I don’t think Fritz would do something like that. Nick
01-25-18, 11:10 AM
#15
Ban Peak
iTrader: (49)
I put together a quick google form, Give it a look over and if any of you want to take it over to edit it please let me know.
Link: https://goo.gl/forms/Y89gIyIYIWHM9tR53
Link: https://goo.gl/forms/Y89gIyIYIWHM9tR53
Last edited by Molotovman; 01-25-18 at 11:14 AM.
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jakewah (01-25-18)
01-25-18, 11:16 AM
#16
Fantastic form, thank you sir! Just completed.
Side note: Are there any sale websites that I can search past confirmed sale prices (like bringatrailer.com)? I just got safeco insurance which allowed me to set an agreed value with unlimited miles but they will fact check the similar values at time of a claim.
Side note: Are there any sale websites that I can search past confirmed sale prices (like bringatrailer.com)? I just got safeco insurance which allowed me to set an agreed value with unlimited miles but they will fact check the similar values at time of a claim.
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Molotovman (01-25-18)
01-25-18, 01:43 PM
#17
Ban Peak
iTrader: (49)
Hey Everyone,
I just added "State Where Vehicle was Sold" as an optional field and published the responses to the web, the published spreadsheet will auto-update with new responses as they are received- the link is below. I am open to suggestions or sharing this with others who are good with Google Docs.
Click here to see all the responses!
I just added "State Where Vehicle was Sold" as an optional field and published the responses to the web, the published spreadsheet will auto-update with new responses as they are received- the link is below. I am open to suggestions or sharing this with others who are good with Google Docs.
Click here to see all the responses!
01-25-18, 02:03 PM
#18
I personally think the forum is a terrible place to get the most for your car and hence determine a price point. From what I have seen prices are the lowest here. Granted it could be that I live in CA and things are generally more expensive over here..
Sorry that happened to you. But you are entitled to "fair market price" of your vehicle. What that means is that the insurance company provides you with enough $$ to replace your vehicle with another that is in similar condition, mileage, and trim. The way fair market price is determined is by examining current FOR SALE ads for what they are asking. Not what they sold for.
Agreed. Not only that, I believe it will provide a false sense of accuracy. For example something that sold 7 months ago is irrelevant today
Agreed. Not only that, I believe it will provide a false sense of accuracy. For example something that sold 7 months ago is irrelevant today
Last edited by Montego; 01-25-18 at 02:57 PM.
01-25-18, 02:20 PM
#19
Ban Peak
iTrader: (49)
Sorry that happened to you. But you are entitled to "fair market price" of your vehicle. What that means is that the insurance company provides you with enough $$ to replace your vehicle with another that is in similar condition, mileage, and trim. The way fair market price is determined is by examining current FOR SALE ads and what they are asking. Not what they sold for.
Agreed. Not only that, I think it will provide a false sense of accuracy. For example something that sold 7 months ago is irrelevant to today
01-25-18, 04:20 PM
#20
As an example
2002 Bathurst X, VIN 607264 (i.e within last 115 FD made) 38,500 km from new, Grade 4 - Went for Y3.2 million this week in Japan.
[Thumbnail is incorrect picture. Thumbnail is for a highly modify Bathurst with issues that did not sell at its asking Y2.8 million).
PLease refer to next post.
[Thumbnail is incorrect picture. Thumbnail is for a highly modify Bathurst with issues that did not sell at its asking Y2.8 million).
PLease refer to next post.
Last edited by Redbul; 01-25-18 at 04:32 PM. Reason: Correct wrong pic attachment.
01-25-18, 10:07 PM
#22
I put together a quick google form, Give it a look over and if any of you want to take it over to edit it please let me know.
Link: https://goo.gl/forms/Y89gIyIYIWHM9tR53
Link: https://goo.gl/forms/Y89gIyIYIWHM9tR53
Hey Everyone,
I just added "State Where Vehicle was Sold" as an optional field and published the responses to the web, the published spreadsheet will auto-update with new responses as they are received- the link is below. I am open to suggestions or sharing this with others who are good with Google Docs.
Click here to see all the responses!
I just added "State Where Vehicle was Sold" as an optional field and published the responses to the web, the published spreadsheet will auto-update with new responses as they are received- the link is below. I am open to suggestions or sharing this with others who are good with Google Docs.
Click here to see all the responses!
Now that’s what I’m talkin about!! Great job dude. I think it’s perfect. I’m going to fill it out right now and add the links to the original post, if I can edit it. Nick
01-26-18, 12:29 PM
#24
Edit- Anyway good luck and I do hope you get a decent list going as with anything, it will be very interesting to see non-the-less.
Last edited by Montego; 01-26-18 at 12:41 PM.
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Molotovman (01-26-18)
01-27-18, 03:38 PM
#25
We’re starting to get some responses! There are some really interesting cars that were sold and honestly the prices are slightly higher than I expected. Thank you to all who are participating!
Is there any way to modify the early entries? I wasn’t able to select transmission type as it was added retrospectively and would like to update that.
Nick
Is there any way to modify the early entries? I wasn’t able to select transmission type as it was added retrospectively and would like to update that.
Nick