mxrider914

iTrader: (3)

My 87 N/A won't go into gear. It has a new clutch master cylinder, slave cylinder, and steel braided line going to the slave. It also has plenty of fluid in the resivior.

About a week ago I noticed an odd sound when stopped. Sounded like something bouncing around the transmission. Then I realized if I put it in neutral and released the clutch the sound stopped, which led me to beleive it was the throwout bearing.

Now when I try to put it in gear it just grinds and if I shut the car off and put it in first it lunges forward when I try to start it.

Does that sound like the throwout bearing to you guys? I want some other opinions before I pull the tranny off.

Thanks in advance for any help.

rx-7 obsessed

yes that or the pilot bearing and fyi its called a release bearing :P

mxrider914

iTrader: (3)

Yeah I knew there was another name but I couldn't think of it. I know where the release bearing is but where is the pilot bearing located?

marshall13B

iTrader: (5)

That happened to me too. To get to the release bearing, you need to remove the transmission (about 30 min - hour) and it's just behind the clutch-fork thing. I'm not remembering the proper name right now. But it comes right out. In your case it's probably already out. Now is a good time to replace this.

mxrider914

iTrader: (3)

Yeah I know where it's at. I had to put a new trans in my car, I should of replaced it then. I just need to to know where the pilot bearing is, I figure even if it's not bad I"ll still replace it since the trans is off anyway. Thanks for the help guys.

marshall13B

iTrader: (5)

Have you considered replacing the clutch? There is another bearing behind the flywheel, if you buy a clutch kit (I got my exeddy for a great deal, saw it on amazon too) comes with the clutch disc, pressure plate, and both bearings. Good stuff.

http://www.amazon.com/EXEDY-10806-Ra...0000925&sr=1-3

mxrider914

iTrader: (3)

I don't think it would be the clutch would it? I hope not cause I really don't have the money.

misterstyx69

iTrader: (142)

You are encountering a bad pilot bearing.
I can't stress how important it is to Change All bearings when doing a Clutch.
Yes.I did it too.,But it was the Throw out bearing.I was totally Pissed,Brand new clutchNew pilot bearing(which took like a Day to get out because I had no puller.)
I put the car into gear and then Neutral,WHHRRRR..Crap!.
I ended up pullin the trans,AGAIN!.
From Now on it is ALL bearings,not "hey there were fine before I pulled it" stuff!

mxrider914

iTrader: (3)

I plan on changing the pilot and release bearing. Are their any others? And do you guys think the clutch is bad? It doesn't seem to slip. According to my hayne's manuel it's looking like the pilot is in front of the flywheel?

john ward

iTrader: (7)

It is inserted in the back of e shaft. Take pp off and you will see it right in center of flywheel. Well you can see it with pressure plate on also but remove it to change

mxrider914

iTrader: (3)

Alright thanks. Is there a way to check how good/bad my clutch is by looking at it?

thejallenator

iTrader: (14)

yes. you can take a look at the clutch disc and see that it is wore. but really if you pull the tranny you might as well replace it all. no reason not to.

Roen

iTrader: (2)

The release bearing is the throwout bearing.

The pilot bearing is in the input shaft location from the engine to the tranny.

mxrider914

iTrader: (3)

I'd love to replace the clutch if I had the money. For now I'll just do the bearings.

john ward

iTrader: (7)

There are specifications usually from clutch surface area to rivet depth. Im sure its in fsm.

marshall13B

iTrader: (5)

Okay well just keep it in mind that you might want to change it soon anyways. Because I kept having clutch problem. I replaced both master and slave cylinders, then after a while it got way worse one day when I started it up. So I tried to drive it home and finally got it there. Took the clutch out, come to find out the springs in the disc busted out of the chambers. I heard of that happening once but never thought I could get 2/3 out lol. Still got it home - like a BOSS

boosted1205

iTrader: (9)

Borrow or whatever you gotta do.
You don't want to drop that trans again. A stock clutch isn't that much.
If you have a lot of miles, you'll be changing it soon.

sharingan 19

iTrader: (16)

I now see what I have to look forward to... I have that same stupid "whirrrrrr" whenever I put my car in neutral. The clutch was replaced shortly after I got the car w/ a "heavy duty" unit, and for a while it was nice, I could chirp second and sometimes thrid. Then one day I pulled out in traffic kinda quick and heard that "thunk" it wouldn't go into gear for a while, but i eventually worked it out, the "Whirrr-ing" has gotten worse since then (about 3 years ago).

I started to think my engine was dying because I couldn't break traction, and my acceleration was in the toilet, but I'm pretty sure I know what needs to be done I just wish there was some way to know what was in there before I take it apart so I'll know what I need to order clutch-wise (all bearings are a given)

toplessFC3Sman

iTrader: (1)

yea, pilot bearing... i had this fail on me 300 miles from home and had to drive back effectively with the trans input fused to the flywheel; the clutch did nothing.

Sharingan, you've been driving that way for 3 yrs? You need more than a pilot bearing at this point; most likely you've toasted the input shaft bearings in the transmission and probably have severely fatigued the input shaft itself, and accelerated wear on the gears that connect to it. Without the pilot bearing there, the end of the input shaft that has the clutch suspended on it will sag a little bit when the clutch is disengaged, and when it re-engages the input shaft won't be concentric with the flywheel, so for every revolution the shaft centerline will be tracing out a cone (instead of staying still) and putting a much higher cyclical force on the bearings and anything else that contacts the input shaft. You're most likely looking at a new transmission now. This will make the transmission much less efficient, and it can sap a lot of power, which in turn will heat up the trans much more and make it much more likely to cook the fluid and everything in it.

To pull the pilot bearing race, I had to make a little fingered tool that slides inside the race, then gets threaded into by the bolt-looking thing to expand the fingers. Then a slide-hammer (borrowed from auto-zone) is threaded into the nut welded onto the end of the bolt to pull the bearing race out.

mxrider914

iTrader: (3)

It was the pilot bearing. Once I got the tranny off I could see that the needle bearings were all out and just laying in there.

It took me 5 hours of destroying a rented bearing puller from advanced auto before I borrowed a dremel from a neighboor and cut a line through it and it just pulled out with my finger.

It was so hard because all that was left of the bearing was the race so the bearing puller would just pull through the lip of the race.

My last question is I guess there is a pilot bearing seal? I didn't notice one when I took it off but there was a black o ring on my floor. Where does the seal go? It fits over the tranny input shaft so I guess it's the right seal if thats where it goes.

farberio

iTrader: (7)

The pilot bearing seal gets placed in the same spot as the pilot bearing just in front (behind?) of it. So install the pilot bearing first with enough room to install the seal right after it.

Engine -> Pilot Bearing -> Seal

mxrider914

iTrader: (3)

Gotcha. Thats what I thought, but I figured I'd double check. Thanks for all the help guys.

jjwalker

The bearings on my intermediate shaft are bad and cause some whirring noise. When the engine was rebuilt a few months ago, I had the pilot bearing replaced as well. The whirring got better, but you can still hear the intermediate shaft bearings making noise, especially in 5th. It's lame, the transmission in my car was rebuilt 18k miles ago, and I have had this issue for a year now...crappy trans place apparently. People in town have told me their horror stories, and come to find out, the shop has 4...yes 4 pending lawsuits against them.

Rotary performance (who did the rebuild) told me that they replaced the clutch disc, but not the pressure plate and release bearing. I don't even want to know what the inside of my transmission looks like honestly. I just hope it lasts a bit longer whirring or not.