FEARED7

Hey everyone. I am wanting to get some opinions about what intercoolers everyone needs for their t2's. I want to design and manufacture i/c kits that fits the majority's needs. I am either looking at producing a front mount or a top mounted i/c.
The top mounted i/c would probably be the easiest (bolt on) upgrade that you can do. But the definate con to that is heatsoak at low vehicle speeds. A definate pro to this would be really short piping. That will definately be a plus for throttle response. I hope this will be 100% bolt up. No mods at all.
A front mounted i/c would definately be a good upgrade, but modifications to the body will have to be addressed (holes cut, ect.). It will look good, and actually not heat soak as bad sitting as the top mount. A con to this is acutally the i/c piping being so long. That will hurt throttle response, but then again it wont hurt top end performance.
Please give me some feedback, and help me out with my decision. I am almost done with a I/C kit for the 3rd gen, so the 2nd gen will be right after!
I am kind of leaning toward a top mounted intercooler, but I don't know what the critics want!

thanks a bunch.
Bryan

SpYdEr

I think I would prefer a top mount personally....sure FMIC's are cool looking, and you wouldn't have the heatsoak prob as much. But I like the response, and a easier bolt on makes me happy

ARD T2

iTrader: (22)

I will be needing an i/c within the next month or two. I'd prefer an upgraded top mount i/c. I'm assuming you're developing air to air i/c's, right? Would it be possible to mist the intake charge on this. My friend, Batman, was telling me how he's interested in a top mount FD i/c upgrade that takes misting off the A/C or something. Therefore, when sitting and possibly getting heatsoak, this will drop the temperature on the intake charge dramatically.

If you get this going soon, I'd be happy to distribute these on the West Coast for you through my company. Have you got a business license or anything yet. Or are you just looking to do this on the side.

What kind of price ranges are we looking at? E-mail autornd@hotmail.com

Thanks, Rishie

88GTU

I'm interested in the top mount if you can make it a noticable improvement over stock. My worry with the FMIC is air flow to the radiator on a road course and being able to fit the piping with a larger than stock radiator. For the top mount to be feasable it would need to support 300 rwhp in hot road course conditions.
-Matt

TII_Boy

Feard7,

I think the TMIC would have more appeal because they will be easier to install w/o major renovation to the car. Most people will only want to modify their car so much, and the FMIC is too much of a hastle.

If you can make a TMIC that supports up to 300-350 HP at the flywheel and market it for around $800-$1000, I think you have a serious product. Let me know once you complete it cuz I want one...

TII_Boy

Rx_treme

yes i would definatly be interested in a top mount. something that could support at least 350ish at the motor.. please keep in touch with us so we know how it goes. Do you have a business or just on the side.
Jason Kennedy
LSJ² Motorworks
Boise, Idaho

FEARED7

No Front mounts??? Wow, I am suprised! Top mount it is! It shouldn't be a problem getting 350 out of it. I will get things going on it as soon as the Supercooler for the 3rd gen comes out!
thanks,
Bryan

P.S. Rishie, I called you the other night about the turbo upgrade for the car. Remember??? And yes I do this for my business. It is called BNR Supercars. I am getting a dummy t2 car today to actually work on the TMIC!

BogusFile

Well heat soak isn't the only problem with the top mount. The location of the hood scoop is another problem. It doesn't exactly force the air in as good as you might think. At speed alot of the air that should be forced into it just flows over it. A front mount is the best option, unless you want to make it an Air/Water IC like Brian D Cain did.

ARD T2

iTrader: (22)

Awesome, I was hoping that was you. I didn't think you'd get it rolling so quickly. I knew the TMIC would be poppin for FC's. If you get this done and we decide on a turbo, I'll get both from you quite soon and use them to beta test.

I'm am going to leave it in your hands to decide what would be the most complimentary upgraded turbo for the TMIC that you'll be using.

What is the most power that a TMIC can handle, theoretically? What should we do, turbo-wise, to accomplish this. Assume that I'll have a mild street port with all the goodies, inc. the seals you mentioned.

Perfect timing to, because I blew up my radiator and water neck the other day. hehe. I figured I'll do it all at once now. Engine, turbo, i/c, hopefully get a haltech sometime.

Thanks, Rishie
ARD

fc3s_gtr

in my opinion, FMIC is the way to go...i've got so much heat soak going on under the hood that i believe pros of FMIC outweighs the issue of long plumbing.... how much of throttle response would you really lose through FMIC? just my 2 cents~~

Eddie

FEARED7

Thanks for the replies fellas. The longer pipes will delay spoolup about 300 rpm, that is quite a bit for autocrossers. Drag? yeah, FMIC would be alright. They are both going to work about the same at higher speeds. heat soaking will effect the TMIC just cruising around, but once you get a supply of air through that core, the temp will drop. Aluminum doesn't take very long to heat up or cool down. I love the FMIC. But for the hassle of putting it on, and butchering up your car, it isn't worth it. Alot of people on the forum love their cars and hate to cut and drill on their cars. But some don't care. I have cut and butchured my t2, and I wish I hadn't. But let me tell you this, I had the biggest, badest, freakin intercooler in that car and people just staired at it. Even I stared at it. But that is in my 1st gen now, and I had to patch up all the holes and cuts I made to it, to get it back to presentable condition. That is my 2 cents.

BogusFile

If you know how to keep your revs up turbo lag shouldn't be an issue even in an autocross situation. If you are really dead set on keeping the top mount intercooler you may want to consider modifying your hood scoop so that it can more effeciently direct the air to the intercooler. Good luck though.

Wankel7

I have always wanted to test the airflow coming in the hood scoop. Has anybody ever tried sticking some sort of wind meter in the hole and went driving? I suppose somebody with a FMIC would have the room to do that. Then we would really be able to see the flow. In terms of knots


James

FEARED7

Why would the air flow be slower than the car is going? It would have to go at the same rate as the car is going. Say the opening is 12 by 2. that is 24 square inches that air is coming through. how ever fast windspeed is going through the duct, determines how much volume goes in the duct. There is enough there to support a really nice sized core.
Bryan

SuperchargedRex

Have you thought about a top mount air to liquid intercooler? I'm trying to figure out how to squeeze one in my engine bay.

Rx_treme

Yeah thats what i want for the sleeper look. liq 2 air. Does anyone know how i can get a holdof brian cain??? thanks
Jason

rx7_ragtop

Yes, I know how to get ahold of him. I can also just tell you what he did, basically.

He had a "tank" welded around a stock TII intercooler. He then mounted a radiator from some small car (kia, isuzu, something...) in front of his radiator and ran a hose from the top-mount to there. He ran the hose from there to behind the drivers seat, and built a PVC pipe tank that he put ice water in. He ran a hose from that tank to an electric water pump, then on to the intercooler. Very stealthy- you cannot tell with the hood closed. ~ 425 hp to the wheels.

Please note, this is a good DRAG RACING setup... but an air-to-air is better for road racing- the water temps come up, and it becomes less efficient than it was when you had ice water in there...

Brian is now working on (I hope he doesn't get mad at me for telling this) a dual intercooler setup. He has the BIG Isuzu NPR truck front mount, and is planning later to add an air-to-liquid AFTER the front mount to further reduce temps, while getting the better all-around performance of the front mount, admittedly with a bit more lag. The air-to-liquid will mount near the stock battery location.

FEARED7

Air to liquid isn't the most efficient way to make streetable power. why not just use a 40 shot on it!!! That will cool temps down too. I am not a big fan of liquid to air. They aren't the best intercooler for driving on the street daily in warmer climate conditions. I think they are ugly too. Just my opinion. I have seen people using their a/c to cool the core, but when they cool it, they have a loss of power b/c their compressor is running. But sometimes you can actully have a throttle positions toggle switch that turns off the compressor while you are deep in the throttle

Evil Aviator

Hehehe, new to the FC, are we? The hood of the FC creates a vacuum at speed, which creates a stagnation point across the stock IC duct. Supposedly this accurs around 50-60mph (43-52 kts for Wankel7 ), although I have yet to test it myself. Rather than spending major $ on test equipment, you could simply tape colored yarn to the hood, and two of your buddies in a chase car (one driver, one observer) could tell you what the air is doing. I'm not sure if any testing is worth the trouble, though, as the hood is obviously a terrible place to mount an IC on this car, regardless of the speed at which the IC ceases to flow adequate cooling air.

Flamin' NOS

I've been working hard for about 3 weeks on my Volvo intercooler install. WHAT A BITCH!!! Oh my god. I had to cut everything out the area in front of the radiator, relocate all the electrical ****, the coolant overflow tank, cut all the extra sheetmetal from the underside of the hood, fabricate mounts, do more cutting, fabricate piping.
it's a PITA. All i have left is the piping. I didn't even have to cut the radiator support if it all works out. My call is still for a fmic though. Have a kit that fits with all the tubing done and no necessary cutting. That'd be great.

hIGGI

iTrader: (7)

is your Volvo IC install done ? any pictures/info ? thanks

iluvrx7z

I'd be interested in an upgraded top-mount too. Although I am definitely not an expert in anyway I think it could work. And I know that if a new one comes out that does the job I'll start saving for it right away.

Dan

fcturbo2

If you went thru all that trouble you should have went with an NPR front mount. The only bitc* about it was cutting some supports. But other than that it fits good!..

Jerk_Racer

I wish I had the picture that was from Mazda showing air pressure points around the T2. The picture shows high pressure from the nose to right before the end of the hood. The TMIC is useless. It doesn't get air through it. If it did, then where does it go? It'll smack the heat shield on the other side of it. Why did Mazda do it this way? I don't know. I'm sure they had their reasons and performance wasn't one of them. I just know it doesn't do much at all. Go FMIC and be happy.

jerk_racer@hotmail.com