ah so I happen to have a car with no relay. Why would mazda do this on some models? Last time this happened to my car I just replaced the relay and it would start. Hmm.

 

the only thing we have is that little blue connector... in the pic above.

 

All series four and series five came with a MAIN RELAY. The MAIN RELAY has two connectors on its pigtail harness.

Who owned this car before you? Ask him why he removed it.

 

If your car has no relay it's because someone other than the manufacturer removed it. There is only one 40 amp fuse in your engine bay fuse box and there should be a B/G wire coming from that fuse which is part of the front harness. There is a W/L wire which comes from the same fuse box as well except it is connected to a 30 amp fuse. This wire is also part of the front harness. If these wires exist at the fuse box and lead into the front harness then these wires would lead towards the firewall where the main relay should be located and would be connected to a 4 wire plug. There is a B/W wire which comes out of the fuse box inside the car and comes from the engine fuse within this fuse box. This B/W wire should go through the firewall and lead towards your main relay and be a part of a 2 wire plug.

 

is the main relay the one that is bronze in color and metal? I am talking about the one next to it attached to the bracket that holds the trailing coil. That looks like from what you are saying something that is not necessary and only part of the security system, and maybe why one is not there.

 

Ok. starter cut relay is what is missing. I jumpered the black white wire from the positive terminal and it clicked loud like it was going to try to turn over and nothing after that.....

 

ok went ahead and changed the main fuse just in case. Nothing. Also when i take a screw driver to the starter solenoid across the line where the big wire is, i get sarks but no engage, on both starters i tried. when i have the starters out i run a neg and pos wire to them they click and engage, so i know they work.

 

Makes one wonder if you can turn the engien by hand or not.

If you can........then make sure the positive cable is the one on the solenoid and make sure the battery pos and neg cables are on good. Also make sure the neg cable is connected to the long bolt on the transmission or one of the engine/transmission bolts.

Odd. you have the BLUE jumer connector..............but from what I read you also have the Theft relay. Can't have both imho. On cars without the Theft and theft relay, the blue jumper is mated to that relays elect plug on the harness. On cars with theft and by default have the starter cut relay.........the blue jumper is not installed and the plug the blue connector would connect to is now attached to the starter cut relay (theft relay).

An engine frozen up would cause just sparks and no rotation. A starter solenoid with the cables attached wrong might cause the hot neg terminal and other problems.

Got me.

 

no, I can turn the motor by hand no problem.

what I meant was that I dont have a start cut relay, instead i have the blue connector. I was confused because i have never seen a car without the starter cut relay so i thought it was missing. i also thought the starter cut relay was the main relay.

so we got both of those out of the way...

but the starter wont even click to engage. if the motor was locked up it would at least engage and then try to turn.

 

ok, took the starter to have it bench tested, it was fine. then took a multimeter to the main wire on the starter and it gets 12.6 volts all the time. then took it to the small prong on the solenoid and it was zero, but when the ignition switch was turned it went to about 9 volts as the key was on, back to zero when it was off. wtf?

see the car was turning over after we did the swap but the neg cable was getting hot. something has to be grounding out somewhere.

 

The B/W wire which leads to the starter should not have voltage to the starter with the key to "on." It should have power with the key to "start," and at start the voltage should drop from 12 volts to ten or less.

 

the little wire that plugs on the terminal or the big *** wire? the little wire has no power unless you turn the key to actually start it, then it gets 9v or it is zero when the key is not turned.

 

also something to keep in mind when we were cranking before it stopped cranking all together it turned over slow as hell like there was some serious pull on the system and the battery was dying. we switched to a different battery we knew was good and same thing. \the engine while in the other car turned over like a champ, even in this car when we initially put it in and tried cranking it for ***** and giggles.

something has to be grounding out somewhere r shorting, causing all of this, maybe a loose stereo wire or something...

 

I was speaking of the little wire which is supposed to trigger the starter into start mode when the key is turned to "start," so your smaller B/W wire is behaving properly. The small wire does as you say for it should not have voltage with the key to on since if it did, the starter would turn with the key to on which is not proper.

 

Describe once again where you have the negative battery terminal connected. I don't mean at the battery negative post, but the OTHER end of that cable.

Describe where the battery positive cable is connected. Not the end at the battery positive post, but the other end of that cable.

I'm predjudiced into thinking the cables are attached wrong.

 

negative end of cable is grounded to the tranny now. \i even added a ground from the top of the intake manifold to the neg terminal.

the pos wire runs to to the starter and is on the drivers side lead terminal on the starter. it has 12 volts to it.

 

funny thing is every time we take the starter out and put it back in an connect everything is wants to click the first time around like it is engaging and then it stops after that and wont do it again.

 

One thing you could do is check the voltage at small B/W wire at the blue plug near the main relay when the key is put to start but do it more than once. Try this a series of times and check if you have the proper voltage each and every time. If the wire doesn't show proper voltage each time then your problem is more than onefold.

 

ok at start it is only at .08 volts over and over again.. when you turn it off it goes back to zero

 

I'm sure it was just a typo but you meant 8 volts. Correct?

 

nope. .08 volts on start

 

also with no keys in the car \i can hear one of the relays behind the pass headlight clicking. this may have to do with me disconnecting the harness connectors up in the kick panel because i got tired of looking at the temp gauge being sky high....

 

"the little wire that plugs on the terminal or the big *** wire? the little wire has no power unless you turn the key to actually start it, then it gets 9v or it is zero when the key is not turned."

The little wire is B/W and it is the same wire at the blue plug. Before you mentioned it was 9 volts, now it's .08 volts?

EDIT: I am going to assume when you repeatedly tried to read the voltage at the blue plug you were not depressing the clutch when you turned the key to start. Is this accurate?

 

car is an 86. it has no clutch switch, never did. of course this was with me disconnecting the blue harness and checking voltage. lemme try it with the plug in. duh.

 

ok it got 10.4