Tyler [S5 FC]

Can somebody tell me or link me somewhere that knows what the stock camber angle on the rear tires of my 89 GXL???

I just got some new tires for the rear, cause I ate thru the last ones super fast.
So I was discussing to a guy I work with how the insides were just startin to show the wires. To where he replies, didn't you spend $1400 on Tein Coilovers. I said yeah, but the rears didn't come with camber adjustment, so the lower I go, the more negative camber I get. (Not having real proof, cause I only set it once when I first put em on.) To where he then replied, but when you buy coilovers like that, when you lower it, it should lower it without adjusting the camber, one of the be Which makes sense, but then I look at my rear wheels, and it leaves me doin this...

Any info on why my rear is at like 3 degrees (just guessing) Its not super low (I have about a half inch from fender to the top of the tires. Can I have an allignment place adjust it, do I need to buy pillow mounts for the rear, or is there somethin else I can do before I eat through $300 of rear tires in 3.5 months???

87 t-66

iTrader: (133)

KhanArtisT

iTrader: (2)

lol...wow. Your friend is a retard, entertaining though.

Any change in ride height will change your alignment so it is completely normal to have that much negative camber in the rear after lowering the car. The stock camber is -0.5 to -1.5 or around there. If you get a rear camber adjuster in the pic above it allows you to bring it closer to those numbers.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

from the 1989 technical data document:

MaczPayne

iTrader: (5)

If you have solid diff or subframe bushings, that center adjustable link is practically useless. You would then have to go with AWR spherical bearing trailing arm bushings and their individual camber links.

Tyler [S5 FC]

^^^ Awesome, thankyou.


Of course, because if you don't know that, you must be retarded...

He's been building cars since he was fifteen, owns 17 VWs all under 1956. And about 90% of them are about three inches off the ground. So I would say he knows somewhat what he's talking about. And he never said he was 100%, his exact words were, "I'm not exactly sure how these jap cars work though, so you might wanna check it out." Which is why I came here...

KhanArtisT

iTrader: (2)

Yeah because Jap cars don't have springs, and struts, and control arms, and suspension geometry like those Euro cars... wow.

Hes obviously uneducated about suspension systems, and I'm not trying to be a dick. Also you thinking he knows his **** because he lowered his cars three inches off the ground is almost equally entertaining. Anyone that has even a basic understanding of suspensions usually knows that anything with IRS will gain negative camber as it compresses.

Experience doesn't mean **** if you don't have the research and knowledge behind it.

Tyler [S5 FC]

Stop being an *******. Seriously, what's the point. And hell yeah, I definitely ask his opinion, and most of the time its very useful. You're an idiot if you think that he's "retarded" cause he doesn't know everything. People like you are the reason I hate this forum, I come on here asking a question, if you don't have anything useful to say then just shut up, noone wants to hear your bullshit. Grow the **** up

RacerXtreme7

iTrader: (2)

Fat chicks are easier on the knuckles, so aim for those body shots.

LOL!!

breezetime

bravo tyler

KhanArtisT

iTrader: (2)

scathcart

Equal length dual wishbone suspension won't change camber through its entire suspension travel, so you're wrong on that one.

KhanArtisT

iTrader: (2)

Right, and name one sports car made after 1970 that has equal length control arms

scathcart

I can name a few other uncommon IRS systems that won't change camber throughout suspension travel. You made a false statement. Deal with it.

MaczPayne

iTrader: (5)

Tyler, are there any more questions you'd like answered?

Tyler [S5 FC]

Yeah, actually I do. First off, I know the anodized aluminum camber adjuster is pretty and all, but why would I spend $40 more for them over the regular ones?

And even with the regular ones, its gonna be around $250, is there a cheaper way to do this, I don't care about adjusting it once its set. I just want around 1.25-1.5 degree angle. Can't I have someone just cut and weld for alot cheaper? Thanks

Terrh

iTrader: (7)

Actually, you're an idiot.

Old VW's use an entirely different type of suspension. Think torsion bars.

No springs. No struts. Different type of control arms. ENITRELY different suspension geometry.

The front suspension in beetles is mac strut but the rear looks nothing like what an FC looks like.

alerx7

i just bought one of those anodized rear camber arm bars or link wat ever the f*&* u call em, my t2 never came with it wen i bought it and it made a loud clunk noise wen i drove it around the block, had it parked untill i did my research im noob at 7s and i really want to learn all this suspension **** so i dont fuc up anything or the car , i have no clue wen it comes to negative or positive camber or suspensions at that , anywho , what does that part do cuz it took me 3 freaking months to find out i needed that part and i still dont know how to adjust it mind u i still havent installed it cuz i want to do it right the first time so i dont have to go back and fix somethign for messing up the first time , thanks in advance guys ,

g14novak

iTrader: (1)

I'll try and help you out since it looks like this thread is about to turn into a lot of bs.

I've heard from several people that have put coils on their cars don't put the camber adjusters in. Instead, they measure it out and redrill the bottom hole on the coilover so it changes the camber. If you do some research about it, its actually VERY common. I personally would find it more stable than that little .5' thick rod holding my wheels together. If you raise the car back up, it'll have positive camber but why would you raise it?

HotRodMex

iTrader: (3)

It sounds like you are describing the front strut mounting, because the rear setup has no provision for redrilling.


Tyler: way back to your OP: Looking at the rear setup I can see why you and your friend might have not been able to see why there was crazy camber gain on lowering. but the camber gain comes from the Trailing arms, not from the damper assembly. If your friend is into old VWs, then he should've related it to the swingarm style suspension on old Bugs. It's not exactly the same, but you get the idea. You were correct in your original assesment of "the lower you go, the more camber you get." This style of suspension has insane camber gain on compression; part of the reason why we need very little static camber in the back (-1deg or so)

The camber adjuster pictured moves the position of the little "dogbone" links on the inside of the arm higher (by moving the entire subframe higher), making the trailing arm more parallel to the ground, adding positive camber. (I have to do some more research, but I believe this also raises the rear roll center.)

There are people that have cut and welded their way to less negative camber (there is a race car part-out that has some arms that were modified), but it is likely far less trouble to bolt in some pieces rather than re-enginner the system. $250 for the rear camber hardware is reasonable, considering front camber plates are usually in the $200 range, and our rear suspension are far less similiar to other cars than our front camber plates.


Also, FWIW to others in this thread, lowering a strut suspension (like the front of our cars) has very little impact on camber, and would likely make it less negative than more.

KhanArtisT

iTrader: (2)

lol @ think torsion bars Its called the swing axle suspension. Anyone that has read a book on suspension or done any considerable amount of research usually is familiar with them. Doesn't take away from his friend sounding like a retarded saying "I dunno dem Jap cars" when really he was referring to modern more developed suspension systems.

HotRodMex

iTrader: (3)

Well, the front of the VW uses torsion bar suspension. I think that's about the time in the convo everyone got confused on talking about the front suspension versus the rear suspension.

I'm pretty sure the OP was entirely referencing the rear suspension.

scathcart

Trailing arm suspension is modern, more developed suspension? lol Pretty flawed even compared to swing axles.

KhanArtisT

iTrader: (2)

Uh, compared to swing axle yes, it is night and day. But since you like to point out small **** I'm sure you'll enlighten me by giving reasons why they should be in the same category

Tyler [S5 FC]

HotRodMex, thank you!

KhanArtist or whatever your name is, gtfo of here! Seriously, whats the point of all this? You come on here and fill up this thread with a bunch of bullshit. Your not impressing anyone, nor are you helpful, funny or cool... I'm just sayin