S4 NA to S4 Turbo II Sprak problems
05-21-06, 08:32 PM
#26
Chad Carson
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Originally Posted by HAILERS
Darn. That's the METER fuse that blew. Hmm.
Try something if you have a spare fuse to put where the 7.5 METER fuse just blew. Pull the plug off the CPU, I said CPU not ECU. Then install the new fuse and see if it blows or not. I've a good hunch why it blew.
Meter fuse should not keep a car from running though. The engine fuse would. That fuse is next to the meter fuse. No engine fuse, no starty.
Look at the cover of the fuse box to verify what fuse blew. Look at the FAQ on this forum to verify that it was the METER fuse and not the ENGINE fuse. Please.
Try something if you have a spare fuse to put where the 7.5 METER fuse just blew. Pull the plug off the CPU, I said CPU not ECU. Then install the new fuse and see if it blows or not. I've a good hunch why it blew.
Meter fuse should not keep a car from running though. The engine fuse would. That fuse is next to the meter fuse. No engine fuse, no starty.
Look at the cover of the fuse box to verify what fuse blew. Look at the FAQ on this forum to verify that it was the METER fuse and not the ENGINE fuse. Please.
OK, first of all the fuse box cover is missing. The 7.5 amp fuse that blew took out the dash lights but the car will still turn over.
I don't have any 12v at the leading coil pack plug, the wire that was giving the 12vdc at the pressure sensor has been taped and no longer is showing 12vdc at that plug.
about the alt and water temp rewire I will look into that as soon as I figure out why there is no spark.
Is there anymore places to check for voltage to make sure the TII wiring harness is good? Or is it much hassel to run the NA harness since I know it is good? With all the emission crap gone swapping the harness is really easy.
Also I don't have the knock sensor that the TII's have. Not sure if that is needed or not but it is not on this setup.
Again, thanks for the help. If I seem excited or mad it is because this car has been here for 6 months now. A friend onws this car and was getting help from another friend but the car ended up here and well I have been doing most of the work with one of my friends and well might tow this over to his house and tell him to finish it as I am all most out of time. Homeowners assocation is getting on me about this freaking car.
BTW - it was the meter fuse.
Last edited by Fire85GSLSE; 05-21-06 at 08:37 PM.
05-21-06, 09:56 PM
#27
Rotartist
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The only reason the buzzer is going off is due to the fact that there is no coolant in the car yet... Uggg... Isn't most of the spark and what not run off the DRIVER's side harness not the passenger side emmision harness.? The CAS and what not comes off the harness that connects to the battery.. The fire was on the passenger side of the car. Let me do a little tracing and I'll call you tomorrow afternoon.
05-22-06, 06:04 AM
#28
Chad Carson
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Originally Posted by RRTEC
The only reason the buzzer is going off is due to the fact that there is no coolant in the car yet... Uggg... Isn't most of the spark and what not run off the DRIVER's side harness not the passenger side emmision harness.? The CAS and what not comes off the harness that connects to the battery.. The fire was on the passenger side of the car. Let me do a little tracing and I'll call you tomorrow afternoon.
As for the spark, yes all of that is run off the driver side but the pin config is a little bit different on the s4 TII to S4 NA from what I am gathering.
Well just a heads up, this car will be over sometime this week. We can go thru it with the help of hailers and maybe get it running.
I have 21 days to get the tile floor done and the living room painted before the wedding shower or I will be dead so the car might have to take a back burner for a bit. But I will bring the trailer and we can load the parts car to haul off.
Chad
05-22-06, 08:10 AM
#29
HAILERS
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Yes. That's what I'm saying. The wiring in the Turbo emissions harness is different that in the non turbo harness.
That's why you can't just put a Turbo engine in the car with a Turbo emissions harness and not make changes in the plugs.
As demonstrated with the brown/red wire to the boost sensor, you had 12vdc coming from the METER fuse feeding an output wire on the boost sensor and therefore going to the ECUpin 2B also. NOT good since the boost sensor output is usually lower than 4vdc under full boost.
The other wire giving you heartburn is the BrB wire on the Turbo emissions harness interfacing with the WB wire on the Front harness of the n/a harness. The BrB wire is a grojnd wire and is putting a ground on the Alt relay in the CPU making the idiot lights come on all the time along with the shift llght. Even if the car starts those lights will remain on. So the BrB wire has to be removed. ON a Turbo car that BrB is the gnd wire for the Boost GAUGE something you have not.
You've learned the same about the water temp sensor wire. It's Yellow White on both turbo and non turbo, BUT they go into different plugs on both models. You have to move the white/yellow from one plug to the other plug for the water temp gauge to work. From X-16 to X-15 (memory here).
YOu have no alt wires from the back of the alt, but can run two wires from there to the X-15 plug and mate them with the B/W and W/B wires shown in the Front harness of the n/a front harness (they'd be put in the mating half of the emissions harness to mate).
I use the terms EMISSIONS harness and FRONT harness............because that's what they are. See the plugs in the jpg's I attached. See the EM next to one half of the plug and F on the other half of the plug. They stand for just what you'd think, Emissions and Front.
I find it toooooo darn hard to call the emissions harness the engine harness when I KNOW the engine harness is on the left side of the car and feeds the coils. batt, fuse box etc,.
Can't call Bill Freddy or he won't answer.
Right now its a toss up whether to change back to the n/a emissions harness or to make the changes to the present turbo harness. I used the n/a in my car.
I really have no interest in making a turbo emissions harness work in a n/a car EXCEPT it got interesting on how many differences there are and wonderment on why and how others put this combination is a non turbo car and make it work out.
I"ve never done it myself and before anybody criticises me on that count (never been there, never done that) all you have to do is look at the pictures of the two plugs X-15 and X-16 and see the flaws in using this combination. Like, WHEE, driving with a car that is seeing the equivalent of 20psi at the ECU even at idle (made the 20psi figure up).
Anyway, no I don't think the non spark lies in the emissions harness. The CAS signal comes from the real engine harness to the Front harness plug that mates with the ECU, so there are no differences there.
The coils get their power from the EGI fuses in the engine bay and has nothing to do with the emissions harness, but the same power feeds the injectors themselves thru the interface b/t the front and emissions harness. That interface is the same on turbo and non turbo harness so that can't be the problem, if the plugs are connected. And I'm sure they are.
THe ENGINE fuse has to be good for the Main Relay to pull in for the paragraph above to work as described. The ENGINE fuse decides if the fuel pump gets power and if the main relay has power to get pulled in with the key to ON>
That's why you can't just put a Turbo engine in the car with a Turbo emissions harness and not make changes in the plugs.
As demonstrated with the brown/red wire to the boost sensor, you had 12vdc coming from the METER fuse feeding an output wire on the boost sensor and therefore going to the ECUpin 2B also. NOT good since the boost sensor output is usually lower than 4vdc under full boost.
The other wire giving you heartburn is the BrB wire on the Turbo emissions harness interfacing with the WB wire on the Front harness of the n/a harness. The BrB wire is a grojnd wire and is putting a ground on the Alt relay in the CPU making the idiot lights come on all the time along with the shift llght. Even if the car starts those lights will remain on. So the BrB wire has to be removed. ON a Turbo car that BrB is the gnd wire for the Boost GAUGE something you have not.
You've learned the same about the water temp sensor wire. It's Yellow White on both turbo and non turbo, BUT they go into different plugs on both models. You have to move the white/yellow from one plug to the other plug for the water temp gauge to work. From X-16 to X-15 (memory here).
YOu have no alt wires from the back of the alt, but can run two wires from there to the X-15 plug and mate them with the B/W and W/B wires shown in the Front harness of the n/a front harness (they'd be put in the mating half of the emissions harness to mate).
I use the terms EMISSIONS harness and FRONT harness............because that's what they are. See the plugs in the jpg's I attached. See the EM next to one half of the plug and F on the other half of the plug. They stand for just what you'd think, Emissions and Front.
I find it toooooo darn hard to call the emissions harness the engine harness when I KNOW the engine harness is on the left side of the car and feeds the coils. batt, fuse box etc,.
Can't call Bill Freddy or he won't answer.
Right now its a toss up whether to change back to the n/a emissions harness or to make the changes to the present turbo harness. I used the n/a in my car.
I really have no interest in making a turbo emissions harness work in a n/a car EXCEPT it got interesting on how many differences there are and wonderment on why and how others put this combination is a non turbo car and make it work out.
I"ve never done it myself and before anybody criticises me on that count (never been there, never done that) all you have to do is look at the pictures of the two plugs X-15 and X-16 and see the flaws in using this combination. Like, WHEE, driving with a car that is seeing the equivalent of 20psi at the ECU even at idle (made the 20psi figure up).
Anyway, no I don't think the non spark lies in the emissions harness. The CAS signal comes from the real engine harness to the Front harness plug that mates with the ECU, so there are no differences there.
The coils get their power from the EGI fuses in the engine bay and has nothing to do with the emissions harness, but the same power feeds the injectors themselves thru the interface b/t the front and emissions harness. That interface is the same on turbo and non turbo harness so that can't be the problem, if the plugs are connected. And I'm sure they are.
THe ENGINE fuse has to be good for the Main Relay to pull in for the paragraph above to work as described. The ENGINE fuse decides if the fuel pump gets power and if the main relay has power to get pulled in with the key to ON>
05-22-06, 08:55 AM
#30
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Originally Posted by Fire85GSLSE
Well the buzzer is going off due to the temp guage reading max after it sits a minute with the key on. The small fire was on the passengerside.
As for the spark, yes all of that is run off the driver side but the pin config is a little bit different on the s4 TII to S4 NA from what I am gathering.
Well just a heads up, this car will be over sometime this week. We can go thru it with the help of hailers and maybe get it running.
I have 21 days to get the tile floor done and the living room painted before the wedding shower or I will be dead so the car might have to take a back burner for a bit. But I will bring the trailer and we can load the parts car to haul off.
Chad
As for the spark, yes all of that is run off the driver side but the pin config is a little bit different on the s4 TII to S4 NA from what I am gathering.
Well just a heads up, this car will be over sometime this week. We can go thru it with the help of hailers and maybe get it running.
I have 21 days to get the tile floor done and the living room painted before the wedding shower or I will be dead so the car might have to take a back burner for a bit. But I will bring the trailer and we can load the parts car to haul off.
Chad
Marcus' stop buzzing after he put coolant in.. The temp guage still skyrockets but the "add coolant" buzzer went off.. Thats's cool, it's not like Eli is ready to pay you for the work you've done yet anyways.... I am going to re-read this thread and catch myself up to where you and Hailers are.
05-22-06, 11:02 AM
#31
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Here are three jpg of the plugs. Remember, the wires with ( X) around are the wires in a turbo harness.
I lined out the n/a half of the plugs because you don't mess with that half of the plugs.
By the way, that LgB wire that is to be extracted and tied back goes to a pwr steering relay and I don't think that wire exists in a n/a. So tie back after extracting.
These changes are NOT the engine not starting problem, I'm pretty sure. They need to be changed in the long run though so you'll have no gnd going to the relay in the CPU constantly, will have water temperature, and the boost sensor will have the right signal.
I lined out the n/a half of the plugs because you don't mess with that half of the plugs.
By the way, that LgB wire that is to be extracted and tied back goes to a pwr steering relay and I don't think that wire exists in a n/a. So tie back after extracting.
These changes are NOT the engine not starting problem, I'm pretty sure. They need to be changed in the long run though so you'll have no gnd going to the relay in the CPU constantly, will have water temperature, and the boost sensor will have the right signal.
05-23-06, 08:55 PM
#33
Chad Carson
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Ok, so wait a minute. I have to ask one question. Is the Na harness and more or less work than the Turbo harness? I ask this incase we figure out the TII harness is bad then I will go back to the NA harness since I know it is good.
Trevor, let me know what you figure out. Maybe the three of us can get this figured out and fixed. I wanted to move the car today but did not have access to the 18ft trailer as it has junk on it. If I can get this over this week then the two of us should be able to get it straight and get it back to Eli to drive.
Chad
Trevor, let me know what you figure out. Maybe the three of us can get this figured out and fixed. I wanted to move the car today but did not have access to the 18ft trailer as it has junk on it. If I can get this over this week then the two of us should be able to get it straight and get it back to Eli to drive.
Chad
05-24-06, 07:14 AM
#34
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