yeah yeah im sure someone will say "DO A SEARCH" maybe they dont realize all the returns you get that has the words break-in, rebuild it in. nonetheless im rebuilding a blown coolant seal engine.. my first rebuild. so the question arises..how long must i "behave" with my rotaryresources/rotaryaviation seals... i have read anything from 500miles to 4000 miles in few i could find... ha and last not least.. kinda funny but does idling break in a engine? so uhhhhh? 4000 miles will make me buy a jspec.... am not gonna spend months breaking in.. cuz thats what it would take for me to get 4000 miles. thanks everyone later

 

when you first break it in, let it run for at least an hour, and set the idle to 1500 rpms using the idle air screw on top of the throttle body. check for leaks while it's running. you'll need a friend to hold the gas pedal for you. then, i just suggest dont go above 4k rpms for the first 1000 miles. break it in right.

 

http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/break-in.html This is Kevin Lander's break in procedure, He's pretty well known around here, and his method appears to be the standard for everyone around here... To qoute the key points:

So, essentially: keep it below 4K rpms until about 1250~1500 miles, then slowly work towards redline until 2000, then you should be good to go.

 

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK!!!! its going to take me at least a month to generate 2000 miles.......ooh the pain.. also during that first 2000 miles how reliable is it.. when can i take road trips?

 

I just went through the breakin process. If its built right it will be reliable from the first moment its running if everything is in correct order. The only problem you may have is with hot starts but that will gradually go away as you put on the milage and build compression.

 

Road trips are fine.

The rotaryaviation seals are hard seals, and thus harder to break in on used housings. I would recommend a softer seal like atkins. I had bad results with a couple of used housing rebuilds with RA seals...break in is said to be 3000+ miles with those.

 

but will they last longer once broken in? Is there any advantage to the RA seals? They claimed rediculous strength when they first came out and I thought about buying some, but I really didn't have a use for them. How did those motors turn out? Do they make more compression once they are broken in on used housings?

 

I have a question for break-in period. If I'm premixing, should I stop during the breakin period, or keep doing it?

 

supposedly, yes.

cost and supposed resistance to breakage.

Never got to know. I had to take them out and back apart, they wouldn't seal well enough to run. IT was ALL I could do to get the cars to even start once...no idle below 2000, no power. Compression check showed 50-60psi. No way I could send a car down the road like that, to even try to break it in. Had to pull them and re-rebuild them with atkins seals. I did used the RA seals in 2 new housing motors, which turned out okay, not yet broken in. THey showed 90-100psi...a bit low for new housings and new seals, but driveable and should break in better.

ITs open to debate, no hard data either way. I personally dont premix during breakin on premix motors. Others say they wouldn't do without it. DO whatever makes you happy.

 

Unfortunatly one of the motors Kevin is referering to is mine. But being the good guy Kevin is he is handling the problem. Just a matter of time before I am back on the street stomping the *** off his 3rd gen.
One way to look at it is that now I don't have to do a 3k breakin.

 

My Rotary resurrection rebuild is in and I just have some other parts to get tossed in over the next few days. When I get the car back, I think I'll let it idle the entire day while I do a major cleaning - I'm sure the car is gonna be filthy. Then, it's lots of driving around Oyster bay and the LI sound every weekend for break-in. I'm gonna hold off on making my TID until it's broken in this way it's not as easy to get into boost.

Offtopic, thats a huge gamble with a lot of shops/engine builders. You get them the parts you want (that they don't specifically recommend) and they put it together - often times if it doesn't run right thats your responsibility. Rotary resurrection = customer service and I love hearing the many instances where he goes out of his way for his customers.

 

when did you get the seals?

The early seals had problems. I think if you got them after Dec 03 they should have been the "new and improved version"

Basically when they machined them they got too hot.

c_mart_28 has a set of them after Dec 03

 

So if you rebuild a premix motor and are not premixing for the break-in period, is it still the same procedure and amount of miles?

 

IN theory, since premix prevents apex seal wear, and breakin is basically seal wear, no premix promotes breakin. So you'd have less of a breakin, in my mind.

 

This all makes sense to me and sounds good. So when you rebuild a premix engine and tell them to not run premix during breakin, do you still tell them to do the normal breakin of 2000 miles, or do you say 1500 instead or something? Also, you said the RA seals are harder and take longer to breakin than something like the atkins seals. Say I rebuild my motor with the RA seals on a premix motor and do NOT premix during breakin, would the normal 2000 miles be adequate for those seals at that point? Because I know you said those can take 3000+ to breakin. Thanks for answering all my questions, this is very interesting.

 

I just rebuilt with the RA seals 'bout 1000 miles ago now...Used new rotor housings, though, so I wouldn't have to deal with all the horror stories about breakin...She started right up, only had a "lumpy" idle for the first 100 miles...It seems I could actually feel the compression/ power building in the first 200-300 miles, now I'm romping on it all the time, no problems...The BIG determining factor for breakin miles are those rotor housings...

 

You bought new rotor housings? Aren't new ones pretty expensive?

 

Wayne, you're banzaitoyota reincarnated about those damn rotorhousings...



We all know new rotorhousings make a killer engine, but not everybody wants to/can drop a cool grand on top of other rebuild expenses. Word has it rotorhousings are hard to get right now, anyway, as well as remans.

 

If you want a rebuild to last for another 100,000 or so, you HAVE to have new housings...This, of course, is my personal opinion, and you are more than welcome to flame (even you, Kevin!)...Besides, my housings already had 186,000 miles on 'em, there wasn't much life left in 'em...

 

I know where you're coming from, Kevin- you obviously do a damn good job with the used housings, and yes, they're expensive as hell...It's just my personal standards for a rebuilt rotary, that's all...

 

I really wish Mazda would just lower the price on all this stuff and mass produce more rotary powered vehicles. I love my rotary engine and I wish I could just rebuild on a whim with a spare $500 or so instead of like $2500. I don't see what is so expensive and complicated in the engine anyway. The have been using the hardening process on the irons for 20 years or more right? The rotor housings are just chrome plated on the inside right? Are the parts really that expensive to manufacture, or does Mazda just like to gouge?

 

I really wish Mazda would just lower the price on all this stuff and mass produce more rotary powered vehicles. I love my rotary engine and I wish I could just rebuild on a whim with a spare $500 or so instead of like $2500. I don't see what is so expensive and complicated in the engine anyway. The have been using the hardening process on the irons for 20 years or more right? The rotor housings are just chrome plated on the inside right? Are the parts really that expensive to manufacture, or does Mazda just like to gouge?

 

Good thread, does anyone use ceramic seals for a non-race application. I assume these are the softest and easiest to break in. The down side is they only last about 30k miles from what I have read. The up side is when they go they don't scare up the housings.

I am going to be rebuilding the T2 in a couple months, and it is going to be a track car (just gotta do a couple more things to the Z to make is a daily driver) so I was considering using ceramics.

 

have you checked the prices on ceramic seals? you probably wont see much of a gain bellow.... say...5,000 RPM with ceramics and also the car wont idle below like 2500 rpm...they don't seal at low RPM.

 

According to this article, you all are over doing it?
http://www.mazdamotorsports.com/weba...1&subject=misc