No Spark and Other Weirdness
08-03-02, 09:03 PM
#51
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Darn the bad luck. Frankly I think you should shelve the SAFC for say a week. That'll eliminate that as a problem child. I think you need to drive it as a normal car for a week to gain confidence that everything else is good, then go back to the SAFC.
Is it possible the SAFC flooded the car???? and its now flooded? Gotta watch that ignoring the wifey.
About the word CRANKING. I've a problem with that word. In my circle that means the starter is turning the engine over, but the engine is not firing. I saw another post where the guy said it was cranking, but you got the distinct impression the car was running due to some other things he said. I think you do mean its cranking as in the starter is engaged and then while doing so, it just stops cranking for no apparent reason. Soooooo, maybe its the ignition assy but hopefully not. There is a wire and connection that has come up on this forum as a problem child in situations like this. In the engine bay, just about six inches below the fuse box, there is a one wire connector. Black in color. That wire feeds the ignition i.e. key assy, and provides the power for the starter solenoid. I've had this outfit melt on my 87n/a a few years back. Never found the short. Just soldered the thing together and eliminated the connector.
Do you have to depress the clutch when starting the car??? Its a interlock device at the clutch pedal. Just a switch really. Maybe its going bad. But if you don't have to depress the clutch more or less forget that idea. I jumpered that sw on my cars because it was a pain. Ralph Nader, Joan Claybrook device.
Is it possible the SAFC flooded the car???? and its now flooded? Gotta watch that ignoring the wifey.
About the word CRANKING. I've a problem with that word. In my circle that means the starter is turning the engine over, but the engine is not firing. I saw another post where the guy said it was cranking, but you got the distinct impression the car was running due to some other things he said. I think you do mean its cranking as in the starter is engaged and then while doing so, it just stops cranking for no apparent reason. Soooooo, maybe its the ignition assy but hopefully not. There is a wire and connection that has come up on this forum as a problem child in situations like this. In the engine bay, just about six inches below the fuse box, there is a one wire connector. Black in color. That wire feeds the ignition i.e. key assy, and provides the power for the starter solenoid. I've had this outfit melt on my 87n/a a few years back. Never found the short. Just soldered the thing together and eliminated the connector.
Do you have to depress the clutch when starting the car??? Its a interlock device at the clutch pedal. Just a switch really. Maybe its going bad. But if you don't have to depress the clutch more or less forget that idea. I jumpered that sw on my cars because it was a pain. Ralph Nader, Joan Claybrook device.
Last edited by HAILERS; 08-03-02 at 09:06 PM.
08-03-02, 09:33 PM
#52
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Thread Starter
Told wifey I won't be touching the car tomorrow 
So, I ran out into the garage and got some numbers from the ECU—
Variable resistor: 33mv should be 4v (the screw is stripped and has no effect on idle mix.)
AFM: 4v GOOD
CAS .6v GOOD
VRef: 5v GOOD
TPS: 1v
Starter Switch: 23mv Not sure about this one, manual says <1v
I'll go run out and check that orphan connector.
B
So, I ran out into the garage and got some numbers from the ECU—Variable resistor: 33mv should be 4v (the screw is stripped and has no effect on idle mix.)
AFM: 4v GOOD
CAS .6v GOOD
VRef: 5v GOOD
TPS: 1v
Starter Switch: 23mv Not sure about this one, manual says <1v
I'll go run out and check that orphan connector.
B
08-03-02, 10:14 PM
#53
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Try disconnecting the variable resistor. It should default to some set value. Its not your problem but theres no sense leaving a broken piece of equipment in the system. I know its just for idle purposes, just don't like defective parts.
Yeah, give a good look at that black, single wire connector just below the engine fuse box.
Trying to help you has helped me. Near where that single connector is, I found a bare splice, about two inches long. Just sitting there bare wiring and all. Lucky I havn't touched that with a screwdriver or wrench. has 12v on it. About 12 gauge wire. Gotta heat shrink that puppy soon.
23mv is a lot less than one volt. Its good. Find the orphan..
Yeah, give a good look at that black, single wire connector just below the engine fuse box.
Trying to help you has helped me. Near where that single connector is, I found a bare splice, about two inches long. Just sitting there bare wiring and all. Lucky I havn't touched that with a screwdriver or wrench. has 12v on it. About 12 gauge wire. Gotta heat shrink that puppy soon.
23mv is a lot less than one volt. Its good. Find the orphan..
08-04-02, 12:43 PM
#55
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Follow your batt neg lead and positive leads to where they form a single harness. The connector is about two inches back towards the fuse box. Called x-23 on the jpg that is attached. YOu ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO WORK ON THE CAR ON SUNDAY, ACCORDING TO YOUR PROMISE TO YOUR WIFEY!
08-04-02, 03:31 PM
#57
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Thread Starter
Ya know, I think I did follow that one last night, but I think it led to the a/c compressor. Hmmm. Will check this week. Tomorrow I'm closing on the new house and will have no time.
08-04-02, 05:30 PM
#58
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About five wires come from the fuse box in the engine bay. They become a common harness about four inches from the fuse box. There is a single wire with a single connector on it that comes out of where those five become one harness. It comes out for about four inches in length. Its a black connector. The air compressors connector is white. Black to black, white to white. The connector for the a/c goes under the battery and goes fwd to a relay in front of the radiator.
08-05-02, 10:27 AM
#59
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Thread Starter
Ran out to check, found the connector, cleaned it, no difference. I turned on the ignition with a lead pulled and we have spark—at least on the trailing. I fully charged the battery over the weekend and I've noticed that it completely drains after 3–5 times trying to start. Would a bad alternator cause a car not to start if the battery is fully charged. Now I'm thinking that there's definitely a short somewhere in the system that is causing all of these secondary probs. Lemme know what you think. I think we're down to atlernator, starter and ignition.
B
B
Last edited by rxse7en; 08-05-02 at 10:31 AM.
08-05-02, 03:28 PM
#61
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Having about the same problem....sorry to hear your going through the same thing. It's a bitch I know. been without ours for 3 weeks now. We have a 88 turbo II and just wont start.
Was hoping that one of you might be able to tell me what's in line between the battery and the main relay that could go bad.
Our Main relay is good but, the round connector that you talked about is getting no power to it. 40amp Fuse is good. So is there something else we should be checking between those two.
Hope you get yours running soon, dont know about jacksonville but, down here the weather is perfect for a ride and if your like me you have that need to ride. Good luck to you.
Was hoping that one of you might be able to tell me what's in line between the battery and the main relay that could go bad.
Our Main relay is good but, the round connector that you talked about is getting no power to it. 40amp Fuse is good. So is there something else we should be checking between those two.
Hope you get yours running soon, dont know about jacksonville but, down here the weather is perfect for a ride and if your like me you have that need to ride. Good luck to you.
08-05-02, 03:53 PM
#62
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The round connector for the main relay gets its power from a 15amp fuse in the crew compartment. I think its on the third row from the bottom, second fuse over from the left. If not on that row, its near there.
Go back to the first page of this thread and you'll see where I attached a JPG of a wiring schematic. That fuse is identified as x-07. If that fuse is good, write back and maybe we can find the reason your not getting 12v on the round plug at the main fuse. This post was for TASHA.
Check all the fuses in the crew compartment. I'm not 100 percent sure of that location. Its on the third or forth row from the bottom.
Go back to the first page of this thread and you'll see where I attached a JPG of a wiring schematic. That fuse is identified as x-07. If that fuse is good, write back and maybe we can find the reason your not getting 12v on the round plug at the main fuse. This post was for TASHA.
Check all the fuses in the crew compartment. I'm not 100 percent sure of that location. Its on the third or forth row from the bottom.
08-05-02, 08:47 PM
#63
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Thread Starter
Hailers, Just because my fuel rail is pressurizing when jumpered doesn't mean my injectors are firing. I'll check to see that I get 12v to the solenoid resistor tomorrow to make sure. I'll also need to make sure the fuel pump is kicking in at ignition time. Any suggestions?
Tasha, I'm restoring this car...it's pretty rough right now and I don't plan on driving it until January. Although, I do have to get it running to move it to the new house and to get it painted.
B
Tasha, I'm restoring this car...it's pretty rough right now and I don't plan on driving it until January. Although, I do have to get it running to move it to the new house and to get it painted.
B
08-05-02, 10:31 PM
#64
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Hailers...thanks alot ...we had checked the fuses before but decided to check again.... sure enough 15 amp fuse bad. turnes out two wires melted a bit and shorted each other out. Best feeling was finaly seeing the fuel gauge move and being able to kick on the second fuel pump hit the road and blow some flames.
After all the upgardes and modifications done to this car that little fuse took me out. Put so much into the car you somtimes forget about the little things. My instinct said a fuse but was fooled ...it looked fine but wasnt.....always trust your instinct!!
rxse7en...good luck on the house and the car ....maybe i'll pass you on the road sometime in January.
After all the upgardes and modifications done to this car that little fuse took me out. Put so much into the car you somtimes forget about the little things. My instinct said a fuse but was fooled ...it looked fine but wasnt.....always trust your instinct!!
rxse7en...good luck on the house and the car ....maybe i'll pass you on the road sometime in January.
08-06-02, 01:22 PM
#67
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Thread Starter
Hailers, with ignition on I get ,1v at the fuel pump. When trying to start the car, the max voltage is only 3v. Isn't it supposed to be ~9v at startup? I get +10v with the fuel pump jumpered. Getting closer?
08-06-02, 02:23 PM
#68
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Thread Starter
LOL! I was checking for cont. along that black connect/lead to the ignition and found I was getting cont. to both + and - Terminals! So just for shîts and giggles I checked for con.t between just the terminals and sure as, er, heck I have a short somewhere on the main power cables.
08-06-02, 02:35 PM
#71
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rxse7en.....the solenoid resistor is feeding that 12v that you see at the ECU. It goes from the resistor, to the injectors, thru the injector coils, to the ECU, where when commanded, the ECU pulsates a ground on that wire which in turn opens and shuts the injectors.
The fuel pump: with the key on no or very small voltage. Once started should be 12v on a 87 n/a, I THINK. The 9v deal is just for the turbo for the 1987 model. I'll double check. OOps. They want me to work. Later.
Your welcome TASHA.
The fuel pump: with the key on no or very small voltage. Once started should be 12v on a 87 n/a, I THINK. The 9v deal is just for the turbo for the 1987 model. I'll double check. OOps. They want me to work. Later.
Your welcome TASHA.
08-06-02, 02:41 PM
#72
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Thread Starter
I really need to change that avitar. I sold the Sport and this car is an 87 TII. My bad.
Don't get fired over this stuff! I love the help, but would feel REALLY bad if you got busted on the job!
If you check my ramblings above, it might seem that I'm fighting what seems to be a major short somewhere. No wonder my battery keeps draining. I don't want to assume anything here. So I'll leave it at that for now.
B
Don't get fired over this stuff! I love the help, but would feel REALLY bad if you got busted on the job!
If you check my ramblings above, it might seem that I'm fighting what seems to be a major short somewhere. No wonder my battery keeps draining. I don't want to assume anything here. So I'll leave it at that for now.
B
08-06-02, 02:51 PM
#73
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Back. Oh, a turbo. I forgot. Yes about 9v at idle and 12 plus at hard boost.
On the six ohm deal. Its possible your just reading thru the filament on some bulbs etc.
Thats quite a voltage drop down to 3v when trying to start. What does it read when the car is idling? Oh, and where are you reading the voltage from??? I usually stick the positive lead in the back of the large blue wire at the fuel pump connector and find a good ground. Good grounds are hard to find in that area.
Nowhere close to being fired, driven off or chastised.
On the six ohm deal. Its possible your just reading thru the filament on some bulbs etc.
Thats quite a voltage drop down to 3v when trying to start. What does it read when the car is idling? Oh, and where are you reading the voltage from??? I usually stick the positive lead in the back of the large blue wire at the fuel pump connector and find a good ground. Good grounds are hard to find in that area.
Nowhere close to being fired, driven off or chastised.
08-06-02, 03:00 PM
#74
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Didn't know about the battery goin flat. At the end of the day, disconnect the large black feeder wire on the altenator. Read the batt voltage prior to doing this. And before you make that reading, wait until the car has not been running for a half hour or so. Next morning go out and see if the battery voltage has stayed the same or gone down.If its gone down connect everything up as normal and at the end of the next day, take your positive batt terminal off, read the voltage and wait until the next morning. REad the voltage again that morning. If the voltage has dropped a bunch, probably a bad battery.
If your convinced that the batt is being drawn down by something putting a draw on it you might try pulling fuses to find out what fused circuit is robbing the battery.
I'd try the wire off the alternator first. If a diode goes clump inside it, it can cause a drain of the battery.
If your convinced that the batt is being drawn down by something putting a draw on it you might try pulling fuses to find out what fused circuit is robbing the battery.
I'd try the wire off the alternator first. If a diode goes clump inside it, it can cause a drain of the battery.
08-06-02, 03:07 PM
#75
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Thread Starter
I was reading that 3v at the blue wire on the fuel pump when trying to start. The voltage at idle (not running) is 5mv. And my + terminal is getting hot.