My Emissions Story
02-14-12, 02:19 PM
#1
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My Emissions Story
So friday after going collecting warranty on my new Optima I went to go have the car tested before I plated the car. Now the whole drive there consisted of fun and spirited drifting a in the snow followed by a having to drive slower than grandma with bad the weather got. No I was sitting at perfect temperature the whole night before and the whole time before I got to the emissions test sight.
Got there, and after the inspection they began to put it on the dyno. Okay, two reasons I already automatically had a bad feeling: 1) Every time the guy wanted to move the car forward, he revved it to about 5k and slowly let off the clutch. 2) He put the FRONT wheels on the dyno. I have never had anyone do that before. So next up after he did the same super-rev;barely-move, he began the test. Now I noticed a little amount of smoke coming from the front of the car, but I just figured it was from the snow and ice melting off the car. Then I noticed LOTS of smoke billowing from the hood and out from under the car. I run out of the watching room and wave my hand across my neck signalling for him to turn it off, but he never did! He kept doing the test for a few seconds, then proceeded to get out of the car with it still running and walk to the side. As I got into the car, he proceeded to tell me "You've got a low coolant warning going off."
My face at that moment O_O
I turn the car off as soon as I sat in the car and instantly looked at the water temp: pegged at the top. I was so angry I immediately got out of the car and refrained from punching anyone in the face. I went to open the hood and the same guy said "don't open that inside, you might set off the fire alarm." I then looked under the car and saw a waterfall of coolant everywhere. After getting the car outside and looking under the hood, I couldnt find one hose that was ruptured, broken, or off. So I just had to push it into a parking space and leave it there until later. I am really afraid that the engine was overheating for too long and melted a coolant seal and possibly warped something inside the engine itself. The coolant was boiling in the overflow tank by the way.
So we will see in the next few days here if after I fix the hose (I found yesterday that it was the hose that moves across the big vacuum line on the intake plenum/TB. It was severely swelled up on the passenger side, had a hole just before it swelled, and the hose clamp was off of the hose. Nothing was like that when I put it all back together.)
So that is what has happened, and we will see how things work out.
Anyone else have input on what happened? Or anyone that has something like this happen before?
Got there, and after the inspection they began to put it on the dyno. Okay, two reasons I already automatically had a bad feeling: 1) Every time the guy wanted to move the car forward, he revved it to about 5k and slowly let off the clutch. 2) He put the FRONT wheels on the dyno. I have never had anyone do that before. So next up after he did the same super-rev;barely-move, he began the test. Now I noticed a little amount of smoke coming from the front of the car, but I just figured it was from the snow and ice melting off the car. Then I noticed LOTS of smoke billowing from the hood and out from under the car. I run out of the watching room and wave my hand across my neck signalling for him to turn it off, but he never did! He kept doing the test for a few seconds, then proceeded to get out of the car with it still running and walk to the side. As I got into the car, he proceeded to tell me "You've got a low coolant warning going off."
My face at that moment O_O
I turn the car off as soon as I sat in the car and instantly looked at the water temp: pegged at the top. I was so angry I immediately got out of the car and refrained from punching anyone in the face. I went to open the hood and the same guy said "don't open that inside, you might set off the fire alarm." I then looked under the car and saw a waterfall of coolant everywhere. After getting the car outside and looking under the hood, I couldnt find one hose that was ruptured, broken, or off. So I just had to push it into a parking space and leave it there until later. I am really afraid that the engine was overheating for too long and melted a coolant seal and possibly warped something inside the engine itself. The coolant was boiling in the overflow tank by the way.
So we will see in the next few days here if after I fix the hose (I found yesterday that it was the hose that moves across the big vacuum line on the intake plenum/TB. It was severely swelled up on the passenger side, had a hole just before it swelled, and the hose clamp was off of the hose. Nothing was like that when I put it all back together.)
So that is what has happened, and we will see how things work out.
Anyone else have input on what happened? Or anyone that has something like this happen before?
02-14-12, 02:28 PM
#3
Did you sign anything before/during/after the test? If not, then they are liable for damages.
Clearly the guy couldn't drive manual if he reved it to 5k just to move it. Generally as part of the inspection, the computer system tells the operator that the car is FWD/RWD/AWD which tells them how to put the vehicle on the dyno properly. Sounds like incompetence and/or poorly trained to me.
Not sure if this will make you feel better, but I'll leave it here for a laugh. I went with a friend to the DMV before we went to lunch so that he could renew his trailer registration. The DMV worker refused to allow him to renew without an emissions test. Of the trailer. We laugh about it now, but at the time, we were both dumbstruck and just asked for a supervisor.
Clearly the guy couldn't drive manual if he reved it to 5k just to move it. Generally as part of the inspection, the computer system tells the operator that the car is FWD/RWD/AWD which tells them how to put the vehicle on the dyno properly. Sounds like incompetence and/or poorly trained to me.
Not sure if this will make you feel better, but I'll leave it here for a laugh. I went with a friend to the DMV before we went to lunch so that he could renew his trailer registration. The DMV worker refused to allow him to renew without an emissions test. Of the trailer. We laugh about it now, but at the time, we were both dumbstruck and just asked for a supervisor.
02-14-12, 03:13 PM
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Did you sign anything before/during/after the test? If not, then they are liable for damages.
Clearly the guy couldn't drive manual if he reved it to 5k just to move it. Generally as part of the inspection, the computer system tells the operator that the car is FWD/RWD/AWD which tells them how to put the vehicle on the dyno properly. Sounds like incompetence and/or poorly trained to me.
Not sure if this will make you feel better, but I'll leave it here for a laugh. I went with a friend to the DMV before we went to lunch so that he could renew his trailer registration. The DMV worker refused to allow him to renew without an emissions test. Of the trailer. We laugh about it now, but at the time, we were both dumbstruck and just asked for a supervisor.
Clearly the guy couldn't drive manual if he reved it to 5k just to move it. Generally as part of the inspection, the computer system tells the operator that the car is FWD/RWD/AWD which tells them how to put the vehicle on the dyno properly. Sounds like incompetence and/or poorly trained to me.
Not sure if this will make you feel better, but I'll leave it here for a laugh. I went with a friend to the DMV before we went to lunch so that he could renew his trailer registration. The DMV worker refused to allow him to renew without an emissions test. Of the trailer. We laugh about it now, but at the time, we were both dumbstruck and just asked for a supervisor.
.Fancy Goddamn computers,Cell phones that can tell ya how to Cook French cuisine..BUT all operated by people who don't know how to to Tie their own shoe!
THIS is a recipe for Front wheel drive Rx7's and Trailers with engines!.
I think Felix Wankel Made the Rotary to Screw with people like this!!!!!!..SEEE?..a spinning triangle!..Duh!
02-14-12, 03:32 PM
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The guy should have stopped as soon as he saw smoke. They overheated the car dud to their negligence. I'd demand they replace your engine or rebuild it since they let it overheat. The idiot should have seen the gauge creeping up.
Go talk to the owner of the service station, consent a lawyer if you want first. They should be held responsible for poor service/techs. Like I said earlier, he should have turned off the car as soon as it was smoking. They should have also done a visual underhood inspection before hand
Go talk to the owner of the service station, consent a lawyer if you want first. They should be held responsible for poor service/techs. Like I said earlier, he should have turned off the car as soon as it was smoking. They should have also done a visual underhood inspection before hand
02-14-12, 06:52 PM
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The optima is front wheel drive, isn't it? So the front wheels should be on the dyno as mentioned before. I agree with Molotovman, they should rebuild or replace your engine. It's up to you whether or not you contact a lawyer, but being as your in the states and you can sue for your coffee being to hot, I'm sure the owner of the garage will just replace the engine without dealing with lawyers. And I think it goes without mentioning, but you want a different shop to install it, and don't want to go back to that shop again.
Did it pass??
Did it pass??
Last edited by djphonics; 02-14-12 at 06:57 PM. Reason: had to add a sentence or two
02-14-12, 07:21 PM
#7
The optima is front wheel drive, isn't it? So the front wheels should be on the dyno as mentioned before. I agree with Molotovman, they should rebuild or replace your engine. It's up to you whether or not you contact a lawyer, but being as your in the states and you can sue for your coffee being to hot, I'm sure the owner of the garage will just replace the engine without dealing with lawyers. And I think it goes without mentioning, but you want a different shop to install it, and don't want to go back to that shop again.
Did it pass??
Did it pass??
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02-14-12, 10:05 PM
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Lol yes it was an optima battery, the car was the 7, hence me posting in the 2nd gen forum :P and the "garage" is a government owned clean air test facility (big ole fancy name for emissions site) so it's not my choice whether or not I take it there: it's state law for my county.
02-15-12, 06:04 AM
#11
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Lol yes it was an optima battery, the car was the 7, hence me posting in the 2nd gen forum :P and the "garage" is a government owned clean air test facility (big ole fancy name for emissions site) so it's not my choice whether or not I take it there: it's state law for my county.
I would escalate this issue if I was you. Consult a lawyer, it might be worth paying one a few hundred if they say they can make the shop get you a new engine. Government service centers will pay most of the time.
02-15-12, 07:06 AM
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sorry to hear dood. thats fucked up, he should have stopped when he saw the smoke but what gets me is that he didnt stop when you started waving your hands at him. what an *******. good luck you better get a rebuild for that.
02-15-12, 08:22 AM
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Thanks for all the support guys, I plan on going there after school today so I can work something out of them. My plan is to get them to pay for my tow and have them pay for a rebuild. Will have Banzai do the rebuild if things do go my way, which they will if it's the last thing I do. Hell, I should have them pay for a pretty much brand new engine, because since it was overheated, I suspect housings and irons could very likely be warped.
02-15-12, 10:01 AM
#15
so glad IL does not have emissions for older than 1996. I would fight it and get a new motor out of it.
points to bring up to your lawyer;
1) visual inspection before dyno should have stopped him from doing test
2) abuse to car from tech reving car to 5,000 rpm when inching car up
3) smoke BELLOWING from car he does nothing
points to bring up to your lawyer;
1) visual inspection before dyno should have stopped him from doing test
2) abuse to car from tech reving car to 5,000 rpm when inching car up
3) smoke BELLOWING from car he does nothing
02-15-12, 10:11 AM
#16
+1... until everyone moves here and causes the air quality to drop into the emission testing zone... then again, we don't have mountains trapping the smog, and here in mobile we get more rainfall(natural pollution cleaning device)then most other states!
02-15-12, 10:19 AM
#17
Thanks for all the support guys, I plan on going there after school today so I can work something out of them. My plan is to get them to pay for my tow and have them pay for a rebuild. Will have Banzai do the rebuild if things do go my way, which they will if it's the last thing I do. Hell, I should have them pay for a pretty much brand new engine, because since it was overheated, I suspect housings and irons could very likely be warped.
My guess is that you'll get bupkis, those guys are indemnified out the ying-yang.
02-15-12, 10:19 AM
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+2 lol god i love it here
02-15-12, 10:25 AM
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so glad IL does not have emissions for older than 1996. I would fight it and get a new motor out of it.
points to bring up to your lawyer;
1) visual inspection before dyno should have stopped him from doing test
2) abuse to car from tech reving car to 5,000 rpm when inching car up
3) smoke BELLOWING from car he does nothing
points to bring up to your lawyer;
1) visual inspection before dyno should have stopped him from doing test
2) abuse to car from tech reving car to 5,000 rpm when inching car up
3) smoke BELLOWING from car he does nothing
Originally Posted by http://cleanaircarcheck.com/about_emissions_testing.php
“For model year vehicles 1981 - 1995, the emissions check has three steps. During the first step, an inspector will complete a basic visual inspection for leaking fluids and conditions that may present a safety problem. The inspector will verify the Vehicle Identification Number (VIN) and the Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) for trucks or vans. The lane inspector will then inspect for the presence of a catalytic converter and conduct a gas cap pressure check. The motorist will be asked to exit the vehicle and proceed to an enclosed, climate-controlled waiting area.
During the second step, the vehicle is placed on the dynamometer, a treadmill-like device, and secured in place. The lane inspector will enter the vehicle and "drive" the vehicle, following a drive trace projected on a screen in front of the vehicle. "Driving" the vehicle on the dynamometer simulates normal driving situations, including accelerating, decelerating, braking, and stopping. The vehicle is operated between speeds of 0 - 33 mph. Emissions are collected as the vehicle is driven. If a vehicle does not pass the emission test during the first testing cycle, a second-chance test is automatically given. When the test is completed, the lane inspector exits the vehicle. (NOTE: During the second step, a well-maintained vehicle may be able to "fast pass" after the first 30 seconds of the emissions test.)
During the third step, the motorist returns to the vehicle. At this time, the inspector presents the vehicle emission test results.”
During the second step, the vehicle is placed on the dynamometer, a treadmill-like device, and secured in place. The lane inspector will enter the vehicle and "drive" the vehicle, following a drive trace projected on a screen in front of the vehicle. "Driving" the vehicle on the dynamometer simulates normal driving situations, including accelerating, decelerating, braking, and stopping. The vehicle is operated between speeds of 0 - 33 mph. Emissions are collected as the vehicle is driven. If a vehicle does not pass the emission test during the first testing cycle, a second-chance test is automatically given. When the test is completed, the lane inspector exits the vehicle. (NOTE: During the second step, a well-maintained vehicle may be able to "fast pass" after the first 30 seconds of the emissions test.)
During the third step, the motorist returns to the vehicle. At this time, the inspector presents the vehicle emission test results.”
So this should be going pretty well in my favor so far. If they protest I will ask to see the video from that day, and I can prove it that way.
02-15-12, 12:19 PM
#20
I will admit, ive had 3 cars overheat on me, none of which showed the slightest inclination of overheating, until it was too late. and they were all pre 95 euros......
88 merz blew the radiator up and shot coolant 15 feet in every single direction, but the temp gauge read in the middle, same with the 95 audi a6.
but, i immediately turned them off the second i saw steam/smoke.
well, idk about indiana laws, but emissions stations are not liable for damages such as overheating and all that, unless clear abuse is shown, which, unless a lawyer was there......good luck
anyways, hope things work out, hate hearing about 7's being touched by morons
seems like every single time someone else touches my car, they **** **** up
Lloyd
88 merz blew the radiator up and shot coolant 15 feet in every single direction, but the temp gauge read in the middle, same with the 95 audi a6.
but, i immediately turned them off the second i saw steam/smoke.
well, idk about indiana laws, but emissions stations are not liable for damages such as overheating and all that, unless clear abuse is shown, which, unless a lawyer was there......good luck
anyways, hope things work out, hate hearing about 7's being touched by morons
seems like every single time someone else touches my car, they **** **** up
Lloyd
02-15-12, 01:50 PM
#21
1. Is the car spewing smoke now?
2. Why should he have to rebuild/replace your engine with a new one? God knows how many miles were on that one...
3. Why the hell was the clamp off of that hose? THAT isn't the mechanic's fault.
4. 5K seems a little excessive for a guesstimate... can you prove it?
5. I hope I'm misreading this:
How'd you know it had a hole before it popped? Knowing that it had a hole BEFORE it swelled, and subsequently pop, kinda sounds like you knew something was up already.
6. Be cordial with them, and offer to cough up half for a rebuild... or replacement USED engine if that one doesn't spec out.
Its going to be hard to prove that they owe you anything... all you can do is work with them. I'm not being an ***, just find it hard to imagine that you're completely blameless here. Heater hoses bust. Do regular inspections - and keep the damned oil away from them.
2. Why should he have to rebuild/replace your engine with a new one? God knows how many miles were on that one...
3. Why the hell was the clamp off of that hose? THAT isn't the mechanic's fault.
4. 5K seems a little excessive for a guesstimate... can you prove it?
5. I hope I'm misreading this:
6. Be cordial with them, and offer to cough up half for a rebuild... or replacement USED engine if that one doesn't spec out.
Its going to be hard to prove that they owe you anything... all you can do is work with them. I'm not being an ***, just find it hard to imagine that you're completely blameless here. Heater hoses bust. Do regular inspections - and keep the damned oil away from them.
02-15-12, 02:26 PM
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1. Don't know yet
2. Engine had a known 142k miles on it, so nothing for an NA.
3. Everything on the engine was clamped securely and triple checked before I drove it.
4. I know what my car sounds like at a certain rpm, it has a Corksport 80mm on it, so its not hard to tell what revs it was at.
5. You did mis-read it. That hole was not there before the test, and neither was the swollen hose.
2. Engine had a known 142k miles on it, so nothing for an NA.
3. Everything on the engine was clamped securely and triple checked before I drove it.
4. I know what my car sounds like at a certain rpm, it has a Corksport 80mm on it, so its not hard to tell what revs it was at.
5. You did mis-read it. That hole was not there before the test, and neither was the swollen hose.
02-15-12, 02:57 PM
#23
1. Don't know yet
2. Engine had a known 142k miles on it, so nothing for an NA.
3. Everything on the engine was clamped securely and triple checked before I drove it.
4. I know what my car sounds like at a certain rpm, it has a Corksport 80mm on it, so its not hard to tell what revs it was at.
5. You did mis-read it. That hole was not there before the test, and neither was the swollen hose.
2. Engine had a known 142k miles on it, so nothing for an NA.
3. Everything on the engine was clamped securely and triple checked before I drove it.
4. I know what my car sounds like at a certain rpm, it has a Corksport 80mm on it, so its not hard to tell what revs it was at.
5. You did mis-read it. That hole was not there before the test, and neither was the swollen hose.
02-15-12, 03:29 PM
#24
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The point is though, damage they caused was due to them not turning the engine off when it began to overheat. If they would have just turned it off at the first sign of smoke pouring out of the engine bay, or the low coolant buzzer that the person doing the test told me came on, or when the water temp gauge that went from very low to all the way hot, I would not have a reason to be mad like I am.
02-15-12, 03:53 PM
#25
Maybe I'm a Jerk
Mmkay. This is all just my opinion:
**** happens. Move on.
My Heater hose blew at 137,000 miles, in 2004. Hose was oil soaked, so I fixed the oil filter pedestal o-rings. It now does not leak. The new hose blew again anyway at 160,000 miles in 2011.
Heater hoses blow on 7's. Often. Other **** happens too.
I shredded the alternator belt on my 90 vert a 100+ degree day. I was driving 50 mph on the freeway. That 2 year old 10,000 mile alt belt took out the other belts and rendered my water pump non-op. I drove about a half mile and got off on an exit.
My 7 also overheated on the emission dyno last year. The efan to end all efans (Merc Villiager) didn't keep my engine cool on low speed due to pulling through the 3" core of my Griffin rad. I didn't run the A/C (which would have put the fan on high).
Each time the engine was alright because I use Evans Coolant. $50 per gallon and mine takes nearly 3 gallons due to the large radiator. Expensive? Yes, but it is the best buffer for overheating. It does not 'boil and puke' out of the radiator if you overheat. So the engine won't warp.
I'm sorry if your car is damaged, but life (and RX7's )comes with risk. YOU saw smoke or steam just before the technician overheated the car but YOU didn't speak up or act immediately:
You have on old, fragile car that is known for overheating vulnerabilities. Maybe the guy at the test station *is* a dick. Maybe he doesn't care as much about your car as you do. So what? He did NOT cause your hose to swell and burst. He did NOT cause your car to over-heat. He did NOT cause you to NOT react immediately. It is NOT his fault. It was YOUR swelled hose that burst on YOUR car.
You're wanting something for nothing. Life doesn't work that way.
Find something in your life to be grateful for and move on.
**** happens. Move on.
My Heater hose blew at 137,000 miles, in 2004. Hose was oil soaked, so I fixed the oil filter pedestal o-rings. It now does not leak. The new hose blew again anyway at 160,000 miles in 2011.
Heater hoses blow on 7's. Often. Other **** happens too.
I shredded the alternator belt on my 90 vert a 100+ degree day. I was driving 50 mph on the freeway. That 2 year old 10,000 mile alt belt took out the other belts and rendered my water pump non-op. I drove about a half mile and got off on an exit.
My 7 also overheated on the emission dyno last year. The efan to end all efans (Merc Villiager) didn't keep my engine cool on low speed due to pulling through the 3" core of my Griffin rad. I didn't run the A/C (which would have put the fan on high).
Each time the engine was alright because I use Evans Coolant. $50 per gallon and mine takes nearly 3 gallons due to the large radiator. Expensive? Yes, but it is the best buffer for overheating. It does not 'boil and puke' out of the radiator if you overheat. So the engine won't warp.
I'm sorry if your car is damaged, but life (and RX7's )comes with risk. YOU saw smoke or steam just before the technician overheated the car but YOU didn't speak up or act immediately:
You're wanting something for nothing. Life doesn't work that way.
Find something in your life to be grateful for and move on.