I saw an S5 NA with over 300k on the clock .... regularly maintained by Michael's Mazda Performance....never saw a rebuild or nothing. this was about 3 years ago and it's still ticking....

 

Curious... what kind of seals are you using and how much compression, if you've done a test?

--Gary

 

300ZX,
How long have you had the engine up and runing? What did you use for the rebuild? How has it performed so far?
I just got my engine back from JHB (irons & rotor housings). Mark is great to work with and his sugestions/input have helped me tremendously.
Its to bad so many people think that by waiting around for things to happen is the best way for progress. For me it was an easy decision. My rotor housings were no good and new ones cost $500.00 a piece. In the process of cermet coating the crome is removed(and thus, the scoring/damage) and then the cermet is putt on and machined down to spec. Marc is very particular in the clearancing process.

Lets do some math...
New factory housings cost............... aprox $500.00

Cost of cermate B coating of
rotor housing $408.81 -$100.00 core ref = $308.81

The money you SAVE by having your
damaged/worn housings cemet B coated...$191.18

As you can see, it costs less than getting new housings.
I sprang and had all my housings done for $1750.00 after refunds/before shipping.(shipping got me into $2000.00)

After talking with one of the guys at http://www.hayesrotary.com/ about my engine having cermet housings, in simple terms, he told me the engine would most likely outlast the car. Hmmm... ... I always wanted to build a fast boat. Maybe after the next decade I'll have an engine for it.

Edit: I don't want to make you guys/gals think I'm JHB's salesman. I'm not. Just a happy customer trying to give a fair and honest opinion of what I think will make the rotary last longer. I would be very happy to hear of any other companies doing the cermet coatings on the rotary and beleive they would do just as good a job if they are willing/able to produce them in large quantities to the general public.

At this very moment, professional rotary engine builders throughout the U.S. are sampling, testing, using, and abusing the cermet coatings. I would'nt be suprised to see custom buit cermet engines being sold to the gen pub in the near future.

 

Put a 13B sticker on a 12A and drop that in?

 

Yeah I follow pretty close to that except:
Replace coolant...(every) 30K or 2 years (which ever comes first)
Replace main battery...4 yrs
Replace alternator...100K
Replace spark plugs...10K
Replace fuel filter...30K or 2 years (which ever comes first)
Replace tranny and diff fluids...30K Or 2 years
Replace Pulsation Dampener 100K or 10 years (which ever comes first)
Replace belts 60K miles or 5 years
Replace oil 3K miles for Turbos, 5K miles for non turbos, or if flooded any time.

 

i realy like that list, but some parts are not going to hurt the engine if you just wait for them to die (battery, starter, alternator) even the cooling stuff can be pushed out untill it looks crummy (assuming you always keep an eye on temp gauge to make sure you dont over heat in the event of a leak).

sure this approach is perhaps a little more likely to leave you stranded on the side of the road, but you also have to consider that you run a little risk of messing something else up every time you tear into the car to replace a part.

besides im cheap, and dont like the idea of replacing a "hard part" unless im 100% sure it is no good. replacing all that stuff early is sure to be more expensive if the parts being removed are still good.

if you like replacing stuff before it breaks, thats great. i just put more faith in my car to stay healthy on its own than i put in my ability to fix it without running into other problems along the way (filters and fluids aside).

 

All of the parts I change "early" can cause the car to die in the middle of nowhere, except for maybe the starter.

And, all of the parts WILL die sooner or later, so you'll be spending the money anyway. Besides, I have known good parts for troubleshooting should the need ever arise...

And if you'll notice, the components/ fluids that are in the same systems are all on specific intervals (30K, etc), so that when the (say) water pump is changed, the coolant is also due for a change, and perhaps the thermostat. This allows the minimal amount of maintenance to be done in a particular system of the car.

Just the way I like to do things, that's all; if it helps somebody, so much the better

 

Wayne's maintenance schedule is tuned for his specific use - a "commuter" vehicle to work. If it stops working, he gets to work late or not at all. Given that I suspect with his line of work, even a brand new alternator is under a day's wages, it's a good idea.

If you're not relying on the vehicle as much, some stuff can be left till it fails, but if you require it to be functioning to get you from point A to point B on a regular basis, it's a good idea to preemptively replace parts.

-=Russ=-

 

Speaking of brand new alternator, I was going to go through Mazdaformance and get a reman starter, but I noticed that their site is closed down. I'll just have to go to the Mazda dealer, I guess, unless somebody knows a good place to get an OEM reman...

Next on my list is new OEM injectors for the primary positions- and those are going to be more than a day's wage, lol...

 

Out of all the problems I see on this board, bad starters is defenitly not one of them. The point im trying to make is that you should just buy a used one wayne, I heard some real horror stories with remanufactured ones on here one time. I can't remember if it was reman. ones in general, or if it was like autozone or a particular company that offered them that they always failed.
Either way, indyparts is a good guy to deal with, im sure he has one.

 

No used parts go on my car (I told you I was ****, lol)...

New or OEM reman all the way...

Gonna get kind of expensive when I need an AFM

 

That's true, or a fan clutch- go to dealer, bend over, say "thank you , sir, may I have another"

 

maybe wayne doesn't care for this but advanced auto parts has remaned starters for about $80. Mine has been problem free since I installed it a year ago.

 

I'd also like to point out that in the year or so I've been here, I have yet to see Wayne post a thread going "Um... guys? My car's broken, and I don't know why. HELP!"

-=Russ=-

 

I'm glad to hear someone is having a good experience with the cermet coatings. Not too many people on the board have posted about their experiences with this process, and the ones who have talked about problems with tolerances, etc. Its good to hear that people are having success. Like I said, I think that this will be the future of rotary engines and will hopefully greatly increase the amount of useable cores available (since even scored and "trashed" housings can be lapped and coated to a certain extent). I just didn't want to spend $2000 on housings that I haven't heard any feedback on. Thanks for the writeup.

 

Regular Maintenance

 

get the FD one from silverrotor
i m happy with mine

 

I'm getting ready to put it all back together in the coming month. I still havn't decided on what type of seals, springs, and such to get. Check out my post https://www.rx7club.com/2nd-generation-specific-1986-1992-17/my-first-thread-about-my-first-rebuild-428882/ to see what I'm doing maybe I could get some more sugestions/help with it.
Once its up and running, broken in and I've worked all the bugs out with the other stuff I'm doing on it, I'll be sure to post some more stuff about it.
I hope 300ZX gets back here soon. If he's had the cermet engine for some time, I would be very interested in what setup he has with it and how the power/efficiency are.

 

I know I'm not the first to think this way, but I dont think it has been posted on this thread yet.

What I would do, no limit on money, but still realistic.

I build a S5 TII engine capable of 550 rwhp.

Then take the turbo off, and convert to NA using NA intake manifolds, exhaust, and intake.

Detune to the factory bhp of 160.

Then follow the Mazda Maintainence Schedule, shortening all times/miles by half.

***FYI***

Problems like these will have fixes like this.

Leaking PD-------------->XS FPR w/built in PD
Leaking Fuel Lines----->All SS braided lines rated to 1000 psi
Clogging Precat-------->RB Headers to RB pre-silencer
Factory Harness------->Haltech E6K
Overheating------------>AWR Rad w/SS braided lines rated to 100 psi
Bushings---------------->All polyurethane bushing

There are more problems, but these are jsut a few common ones.



Cryo treatment, not limited to, but including,
both rotors,
rotor housings,
side housings,
e-shaft,
transmission gears,
and rear-end gears.

There must be more, but I think I've met the thread starters prerequisites.

[QUOTE=BlaCkPlaGUE]

1)Already existing materials that are available to the retail public. Heh.. no talking about how some new metal just was developed or new oil that has 0 resistance etc etc that you can use with this engine. It is not allowed. It has to be things that you can buy online or through mazda.

2)All stock components of the engine will be used, so in other words, all stock parts except those that can be improved, such as apex seals etc. This also isn't a 900hp engine we are trying to think up here either, this is any of the stock 13B's of the second gen series. You can interchange parts from any of the series, including the rx8's if it improves reliability. If the part improves reliability and horsepower, it will be allowed.

3)The power of the engine should not be increased substantially, nor should it be decreased to improve reliability. Remember, try and keep it as stock as possible except for #2

4)You don't have to plan it all out, just shout up ideas that hopefully no one has thought of already, any particular part, and a particular way you want to install it for increased reliability, just post it.
I think this could be fun, if you have any theorys on the life expectancy of the engine after we have a shitload of ideas, by all means post it.

QUOTE]

 

ok so who else thinks that maybe wherever these engines hit fuel cut, maybe they should have ignition cut as well or instead. i'm sure that would save alot of people's engines.

oh and i'll add FD corner seal springs to the mix of things to do.

a few FD guys have dropped down their "knock" ratings with ceramic coated or polished rotors as well.

 

I can speak for 300zx, since I am building his motor, it is a SE block with s4 na rotating assembly. It is cermet b housings and regular nitrited end plates, Mazda 2 piece 2mm apex, Mazda 2mm corner seals. The block has already been used before by JHB as their prototype, and had the crap kicked out of it with no oil, the housings are perfect, plates just needed lapping and it will run again.

I just today dissasembled a s5 13BT after running for over a year. It had Cermet A end and center plates. All 6 apex seals were broken due to someone mucking with the CAS(180 out) but the plates are still mint. Wouldnt have to anything but clean them to reuse them. I wil post pics in the engine building section in a couple days. But the cermet lasted and stayed nearly perfect.

azda published some SAE papers a few years back describing some of the different coatings they tried, even a few different chrome coatings, their own results prove that cermet is a better coating than chroem or nitriting.


As for my vote on the reliable motor, a gsl se block and rotating assembly. Housings and plates all cermet A, NRS Ceramic 2piece 3mm apex seals and cermet tipped springs, mazda side and corner seals and springs, and oil control rings. Viton oil control o rings, teflon dowel O rings. Mod the front cover oil to fit the s5 white bushing around the o ring. MFR stationary gears, thermal barriered rotors and exhaust sleeves. Coolant jacket grinding(racing beat mod around spark plugs), oil mods, 2 piece e shaft, MFR bearings, and run it with a carb, and premix, and or disconect MOP so you can run synthetic oil.

 

Most reliable.... For a turbo motor would be:
New stock but ported irons, rotors, housings, all mazda oem parts internally, stock 2mm 2 pc apex seals, no coatings, no aftermarket materials, just a plain jane stock 2mm motor with 8.5:1 rotors.
Spend the rest of the money on the ecu, and alot more time tuning..Max

 

12a w/ cermate housings and ceramic seals. tuned carb to have no detonation or even maybe a FI system, high flow cat with racing beat catback/headers hmmm of course a k/n intake, koyo rad w/ electic fan. stronger alternator and starter. msd ingition but de-tuned to give just abit stronger spark then stock. premix or royal purple synthetic (the only synthetic proven on rotary's?) weight reduction....

did i miss anything?

Danny
- Custom 86 GX

 

Anyone hear of cryo treating stationary gears and other internals?

 

by irons do you mean the cooling jackets? or the rotor housing?