unfrgivn

I just spent the last 45 mins searching and came up with no definitive answers. I am trying to find just a harness bar for my 91 coupe and all I can find are vert roll bars and cages. I checked on these forums and mostly found FD bars. I also looked around at autopower and kirk racing's sites to name two and found nothing on just a harness bar. I want something easy and small for running non-competitive track days. I do not want to fabricate something myself and would prefer a simple bolt-in or weld-in solution.

Do they not make these for the FC or am I just a retard who doesn't know how to use google?

sunshine

iTrader: (3)

I've been around a while, and have not seen any harness bars sold retail as bolt ins.

Your choises are basically either make one custom, or go with a 4-point roll bar, with integrated harness bar. There is always the option to mount the harnesses without the use of a bar (i.e. to the floor).
-a

TitaniumTT

I have yet to see one either. If you don't want to fabricate one I'm sure a shop will. I worked a deal with Kirk Racing where they built the main hoop for me w/harness bar and I did the rear. They should still offer it. Beautiful bar and light too. I sported for the chromoly

Roen

iTrader: (2)

Or you can just go with Schroth harness that attach to factory mounting points..........thought I've still yet to figure out where the C-pillar is.........

Black91n/a

You need to look at it as a system, and it's not reccomended to use just harnesses without a roll bar and race seats with the proper holes for the harnesses.

First of all if you mount them to the floor then the belts will be too long and/or at too steep of an angle. This will lead to excessive stretching and/or spinal compression in an accident. Also, having harnesses without a roll bar could be bad in a roll over as the roof collapses and you're unable to slide sideways to avoid being crushed. Unless you have appropriate holes in the seats for the harnesses to pass through then they're likely to slip off in an accident leaving you unrestrained from the lap belt up. Also, a 5 point harness should be the minimum, as with a 4 point in an accident your torso moves forward, pulling the lap belt up into your stomach, causing internal injuries. Also, stock type seats are soft and squishy, this is bad, as it'll compress in an accident, loosening the belts, potentially allowing them to move around which could be bad.

So, if you want harnesses you really should have a roll bar and a race seat too.

Roen

iTrader: (2)

look up the schroth harnesses and you'll see what I mean. They actually gained DOT compliance.

Their 4-points use an anti-submarining technology which prevents the crushing of your stomach.

My only complaint is that the harnesses are too long, but I guess they were designed with that in mind. And that they're not SFI certified, but since they're meant to be harnesses for the street, they're pretty much restricted to use for autox's and lapping days, assuming that the club will let you use them.

RETed

Who makes just a bar to attach a racing harness to???

If it isn't obvious, the racing harness is a SAFETY item.
To install properly, the bar needs to be attached to the main roll hoop right behind the driver's seat.
So you need at least a roll bar to be installed in the vehicle.

Don't add a racing harness improperly to your vehicle just to be rice; you're insulting all serious racers.


-Ted

Black91n/a

Yea, the Schroth are better than the average 4 point belt, but I still don't like them so much, a 5+ point setup is far superior for holding you in place and will not just minimize the possibility of the lap belts coming up, it effectively eliminates it.

Roen

iTrader: (2)

it's a moot point for the FC, as they only offer a 3-point belt for our cars.

BFGRX7

iTrader: (2)

http://www.getnrg.com/

I would also go with a roll bar set up-but to answer your question, NRG Innovations sells the harness bar you're looking for. It's not on the website (at least the last time I checked) but they sell them. You'll have to call for details.

~M

RockLobster

iTrader: (7)

Using the schroth 4pt ASM belts with a harness bar only is fine. MANY MANY MANY drivers run this system and it has proven to provide decent protection. Certainly not for competition, but it does limit driver movment in most crashes and the main benefit is it keeps you in your seat while drivng hard. It is somewhat better than the stock 3 point belts except for 1 problem. Rollover. When the roof is coming down on you (due to no roll bar/cage) you need the ability to get out of the way, with harnesses you cant, and you are in a world of hurt. I'm not sure if the ASM system offers any additional benefit in this way...

There is a company that makes harness bars that suposidly fit our cars. I own one but have not tried to install it yet. Thus i cant say what it takes and how well it fits. It seems well manufactured though. I will be running it, but i do not attend tracks that have characteristics that tend to cause cars that go off track to roll over.

Roen

iTrader: (2)

what about using the schroth 3pt belts mounted to factory mounting points?

Valkyrie

They don't make 3-point harnesses... they make 4-points that are street legal (although technically only if you install it to an approved point).

I think you could install a harness to the bolt holes for the FC's rear seat's seatbelts, but you'd have to either get rear seats, or take out your storage bins, and the interior looks like crap if you do that (unless you can fab up your own carpet covers and stuff). But you have to have a seat that has a hole for the shoulder straps.

OTOH, you can install Scroth's racing harnesses to your hatch's floor, with the proper reinforceing hardware, but only with a pre-approved fixed-back racing seat ($$$$).

Or, if you're not actually road racing, you can just convert your mouse belts to manual ones, and get a CG lock. A CG lock and a fixed bucket seat will be enough at least for autocrossing, and safe to use without a roll bar/cage.

I would have to agree that Scroth's lifting for the ONE suitable mounting point on the FC is really vague. How about...you know, just asking them where it is?

Roen

iTrader: (2)

they do, hold on, I'll get a link

http://english.schroth.com/tuning/vrlue.php#down

If you use the vehicle reference list, and select mazda FC, you'll see that they reference the use of the Rallye 3/3J harness.

This is why I always ask, "WHERE THE HELL IS THE C-POINT ON OUR CARS?"

RockLobster

iTrader: (7)

Are you refering to the schroth system that essentially comes togeather behind the seat to one strap but is two as it runs over your shoulders?

I dunno about that one but i would guess the same thing applies, when the roof comes down it will prevent your torso from bending inboard to get under the colapsing roof.

I cant imagine attaching the sytem i am thinking of to the stock shoulder belt point. It is intended to go straight back to the upper part of the rear of the car just below the hatch, which also isnt a good idea due to the distance, the fact that it can stretch more, the more material there is.

Further, attatching anything to the floor of the cargo area is not a good idea as it creates restraint angles that cause spinal compression durring an impact. Worst kind of installation you can make, the very worst.

Valkyrie

That's a four-point harness with three mounting points.

Totally different animal

Black91n/a

Basically with an FC there's no safe way to mount a harness without a roll bar with intergral harness bar. You could set something up that'll hold you in better, but it'll be less safe than stock in an accident, and no matter how good of a driver you are you can't control everything.

Another thing you can do that works quite well is to either recline or move the seat back, unbuckle, tug on the belt and get it to engage the inertia lock and then buckle up and move the seat back into place, which tightens it up. Do it right and it can hold you in quite well.

Here's a little reference pic showing acceptable and not acceptable seats to use with harnesses.

Valkyrie

Mouse belts don't work that way. The shoulder belt is accel/decell activated, and the lap belt (which can't even be tightened slightly like can do with manual belts) is only activated by hard decel.

You can convert to manual ones... but to do it cleanly, you need to find a lot of S4 parts (although they might make interior paints that match FC interior blue)... (which are probably weather-rotten from being in a junk yard, unless you buy NEW parts for $350 per side). Then you have to deal with the seatbelt light.

RETed

Here's also another trick to use the stock manual belts to hold you in more securely.
We used to do this a lot when doing mounting driving - what you kids call toh-gey now...

Before locking the tab, twist the belt 3 or 4 times and then insert the tab.
This prevents the lower, lap length from adjusting through the slip slot.


-Ted

Roen

iTrader: (2)

Hmm...I guess, that's what I've always referred to as the three point harness, while the stock one, I just call, stock seatbelts.

Valkyrie

Stock = Three point harness

Although technically the mouse belts are not three point... since the lap and shoulder belts aren't connected (which is more trouble than it's worth).

Black91n/a

To me the points refer to the number of seperate straps that contact the body (well beyond 3 point anyway), and that is consistent with what the standard defenitions are (ie a 5 point is 2 lap, 2 shoulder and a sub strap). You can do a 6 or 7 point with the dual sub belt bolted to the lap belt points where you sit on it, so that's not necessarily 6 or 7 seperate mounting points.

J-man

I have a C-pillar bar in my Turbo II.

RETed

What happened to the OP?
They haven't said anything since the original question...


-Ted

Roen

iTrader: (2)

I'm still trying to think, where on the C can we bolt the Schroth Harness to?