ericgrau

iTrader: (1)

Which handling upgrades give the most bang for the buck? I.e., what should I do first?

I'm thinking of replacing the rear-wheel steering bushing (and arm, since they don't come seperate), replacing any other worn out bushings, upgrading the wheels and tires (simultaneously), adding strut braces (front and maybe back), sway bars and perhaps a better differential. Is there anything else? The last owner already stiffened the front springs, and I don't think I'll be doing anything to the back springs.

If any of the above items don't help much, I may nix them entirely from the list rather than doing them last. My goal is a moderately stiffer ride. Upgrades that improve handling without stiffening the ride should get bumped up the list a little.

From what I read I'll be partially upgrade the exhaust first, then focus entirely on handling, then go back to horsepower, then focus on weight. Sound good?

Brody8877

iTrader: (10)

What kind of handling are you looking for ?
I would say stiffen up the chassis first by adding F&R struct bar
Next Bang for the buck struct setup:
KYB AGX or Illuminas with Tanabe GF springs
sway bars and end links.
for bushing depend the condition of the car, but i would do it all of this at the same time.

synesthete

How many miles on the struts? Obviously its gonna depend on whats worn out or not. Tires are always good.

ericgrau

iTrader: (1)

107,500 miles on everything, I believe.

So so far it looks like (with all parts of each step done simultaneously):

1. "F&R struct bar"
2. "KYB AGX or Illuminas with Tanabe GF springs
Sway bars and end links."
Any bushings that need replacing.
3. Wheels & tires.

As for how much: I want to go pretty far on the handling, maybe spend $1,500+ to do everything over the next couple years. I'm even willing to make it pretty tight. But I don't want to break my back or my wallet on something too extreme, especially if the gains are only marginal over something cheaper. Oh, and I don't mind compromising my rear speakers. I'll likely be doing steps 1&3 myself, while handing the car to a mechanic for step 2. I want to try to get everything used except the bushings and tires.

I was looking at a differential. $900 for a torsen LSD from Mazdatrix. Looks like I'll be holding a long time on that one. Do differentials ever break under N/A horsepower? It'd give me an excuse if it did some day. On the flipside if they don't wear out I could look for one used.

bmwrx7man

iTrader: (2)

coilovers i would go with those if ur lookong for good handling and some chamber kits too

1SWEET7

iTrader: (1)

Well coilovers are gonna break his bank though. I have RS*R Race springs with Tokico Blues and the ride is amazing. I got both my springs and struts for around $500. Get some wide rims with good tires something like Toyo, or Falken, or Nitto. F&R strut tower bars help but not that much, but they are cheap can get em on Ebay for like $20. You will be amazed how good your car will handle with new springs and struts.

DarkKnightFC

Your car will handle significantly better with strut bars. I put mine on one at a time to feel the difference they actually made. The front was like night and day. The back wasn't as noticeable. And that was after I had AGX's and Tein Springs. And don't just go with someones opinion on shock and spring setup. You can take a look at spring rates to go with the best springs for your needs. And as far as shocks are concerned look at warranties and price range. I got the corksport front and rear strut bars. I wouldn't trust ebay ones. If you're driving hard and something snaps, it could throw you off the road.

Chris

ericgrau

iTrader: (1)

What about springs? Do they break easy or can I get them used? Are springs of equal spring rates basically the same, or are some better than others?

Here are my notes so far (all parts of each step done simultaneously):
Read next post and edited

1. "KYB AGX or Illuminas with Tanabe GF springs"
or "RS*R Race springs with Tokico Blues"
or "AGX's and Tein Springs"
or ?anything with proper stiffness?
"ADJUSTABLE shocks like KYB AGX or tokico shocks"
(used springs & struts, new shocks w/ warranty)
"Sway bars and end links." (used)
Any bushings that need replacing. (new)
Rear-wheel steering bushings & arms, if worn (new, don't come seperate)
Re-alignment (at an alignment shop)
2. "F&R struct bar"
or "corksport strut bars"
or ?will any old strut bar do the job?
(used, front & back)
3. Wheels & tires. (used wheels, new tires or both new)
"Toyo, Falken or Nitto", "wide rims"

That's $40 for step 2 and ~$950-1000 for step 1. Is $450 enough for step 3? I can go over some. Wide rims help handling but increase friction, I presume?

cdaleracer669

iTrader: (1)

i dont know if i would go with the front strut bar before shocks. if it makes it push, then its gonna be kinda scary to corner. I would get a set of lowering springs and ADJUSTABLE shocks like KYB AGX or tokico shocks. the shocks and springs will make it handle better, and stiffen it up for less body roll, and allows adjustments to the dampening. I would go with shock/spring combo first, then strut bars.

ericgrau

iTrader: (1)

Why adjustable? I mean, what if I want to run the same stiffness all the time?
This will be a daily driver so I can have fun all the time. I won't hunt for a windy road, get out to adjust the suspension, then go crazy on the road, then adjust it back. A continuous high, but not very high setting will be fine for me. Think of the hardest a manufacturer would dare set it, like the s2000 or 350Z before they softened them. But if there's another reason to go adjustable, say it.

cdaleracer669

iTrader: (1)

adjustable shocks let u tune the understeer/oversteer characterisitics. you can make it understeer a shitload or oversteer. this helps when u add strut bars and sway bars etc etc. i know a few 7's ive driven tend to understeer, and adjustable shocks allow u to get rid of understeer. Plus u can adjust how stiff or soft u want ur ride to be, and u can brag how u can adjust ur suspension and ur friend cant, etc etc. they can be had pretty cheap on ebay and are the same thing and brand new. under 400$ shipped

spot_skater

IMO, you don't need adjustable shocks if it's a street driven car, and you're not tracking it often. BUT, it is definitely a nice option to have...

First I'd go with a set of good lowering springs, and some nice stiff struts. The difference is night and day.

Then upgrade your bushings with the energy polyurethane set (or some other set...). Ride suffers a bit, but your car will overall be much stiffer. This is time consuming...

Wheels can be found on Ebay... I found mine for $400, shipping included, and they are stock TII size (16x7, +40mm offset). Tires were a different story, spent $300 on those...

Sway bars...grab some off a vert. Strut bars can't hurt and can be found cheap.

Also get a good alignment. Not an alignment from some chain place, a GOOD alignment.

Probably the most important part of your car's handling is the tires. That's the only part of the car that actually touches the road. If you've got **** tires, the rest of your setup isn't working to it's full potential...

EDIT: According to your sig, you've got an NA. Without porting or nitrous, you really won't get much power out of it, period. And with that being said, you won't need to upgrade your differential. If for some reason it starts to **** itself, you could find a clutch type from an S4 and rebuild it fairly easily.

And how are you running a TII clutch in your NA, unless you are also using a TII transmission?!

Jager

iTrader: (10)

http://fc3spro.com/TECH/FM2W/sus.htm

I'de say bushings and tires first. The rest will come into play.

1SWEET7

iTrader: (1)

I don't believe there is enough play in the chassis to actually make a strut tower bar snap so..... Those Corksport bars are $79 a piece......Ebay it is. How is he not going to go with someones opinion if he doesn't know anything about this stuff? Check Ebay for struts and Tokico has a lifetime warranty. I got mine for $370 shipped. If you want a stiff ride RS*R for the win. They are one of the stiffest progressive springs you can buy.

cdaleracer669

iTrader: (1)

tokico and KYB have lifetime warranty but they like to say u did something wrong if they blow. If the car is too low it voids it, so when u send the shock in they will say something like " upon internal inspection it seems you had your car lowered too much" and they will void the warranty. ive heard a lot of complaints about them being asses about the warranty. so dont buy them expecting the warranty. any"success" stories out there with the warranty?

ProjectR13B

iTrader: (1)

good tires and some coil overs will make a difference from what i understand. im still running stock suspension though =(

ericgrau

iTrader: (1)

My mistake on the clutch, I'll go edit it when I have the time tonight-ish. I have TII springs but a performance clutch, not a TII clutch. Shifts real nice and never grinds; even when I screw up my shifting it just bounces off the gear. The last owner did it. I remember even checking the tranny, and sure enough it's an N/A tranny.

I'll sort through all the recommendations when I have time tonightish. But so far it looks like:

1. (all done simultaneously at a mechanic)
polyurethane bushings (new) - just the pairs that need replacing (keeping it the same on both sides)
rear-wheel steering arm & bushing (new)
sway bars & end links (used or junkyard, from an RX-7 convertible)
Springs? (used, or new with shocks)
Adjustable Shocks (new)
A GOOD alignment from ??
2. (done by me)
strut braces, front & rear (used)
3. (tires put on wheels at a shop)
wheels & tires (used & new or both new)

The better torsen LSD would be for handling, not to handle horsepower. Maybe I can get one used then, since it's unlikely that my engine would break it. Or does it not help handling enough to be worth the cost?

I have enough problems with steep entrances/exits as it is, and won't be lowering my car much, if at all. Do springs & shocks come seperate or as a matched set?

bacek

tires?

RX_AV8TR

I've had two TII's and all I can say on the suspension is unless tke your car to the track strut bars should be the LAST item on your list.
I loved all suspension combination I ever had, Eibach Progressive springs with Tokiko Ilumina is an excelent combination, very forgiving ride and very decent performance. ST sport springs and Tokiko Blue is great too, stiffer than Eibach, much like a factory FD ride. Now I have Tein coilovers with camber plates ST sway bars and Cusco strut bars, harsh ride but once you get used to it and you take the car to the track and throw it around a couple of turns you'll know it's well worth it.

Bottom line start with moderate then work your way up.

BTW for the price Falken Azenis, if you want higher treadwear Kumho 712 are always a sure bet. If you have a little more money then there's quite a bit of research to do.

aznpoopy

+1 tires first

they are the only thing on your car that actually touch the ground.

snowball

id start off with tires and bushings
these cars are ~20 years old the bushings are going to be worn out.

ericgrau

iTrader: (1)

So there's no advantage to doing the bushings and other suspension components at the same time? I figure I'll save money at the mechanic since he'd be working on that area anyway. Which means it's either all suspension first or all wheel/tire first. Unless it wouldn't cost too much more to do the bushings and other suspension stuff seperately.

I put strut bars 2nd not because they're worthwhile, but because they're cheap. Come to think of it I'll bundle sway bars with the strut bars, since I'll likely be the one installing them and I'll want to do them on the same day (sway bars are just bolt-on, right?).

Many thanks to RX_AV8TR. He answered my question on ride comfort before I asked it. Got one more though: how much will polyurethane bushings affect the ride? And sway bars? RX_AV8TR, what kind of bushings, etc. were you using when you described ride harshness?

spot_skater

Your stock bushings are rubber bushings. Which can and will flex, making the ride as comfortable as it can get in such a rigid chassis. Polyurethane bushings, for example, are at least twice as hard, and will stiffen up the ride quite nicely. If you've got bumpy roads where you live, you will definitely notice a difference. But if you're more for all out performance, this shouldn't really matter to you

ericgrau

iTrader: (1)

Well, that's the thing. I'm not entirely for all out performance. I'm for as much performance as I can get with the ride comfort of, let's say for example, a stock FD.

So if I got "ST sport springs and Tokiko Blue" (RX_AV8TR's 2nd setup) with polyurethane bushings and sway bars, would the ride still be no worse or not much worse than a stock FD or would I find it surprisingly harsh?