So heres the story just had my engine rebuilt(13b ep). Got it all back together and everythings pluged in, i think. Anyway the cars been sitting for just over a year and i went to start after it all went back together an no luck. Turns over fine, plenty of fuel pressure(brand new bosch 023), not so sure about the spark side of things. how do you yesy for this type of thing and also injector pulse etc?

 

Check thee ground on engine, fuses..

 

You might wanna go over everything. I missed a plug over in the airbox area when I was trying to start my rebuild that caused the car not to start, had me baffled for a while.

 

Did you get through the break-in period before it sat?

 

he didnt start it at all.

 

Ack, good point.

I've read, and been told, that one sometimes has to tow start a rebuild to get it going...

 

if its a rebuild using old rotor housings with new apex seals, then yes, insanely hard to start. if its got new rotor housings and new apex seals and stuff, no. fires right up with some to very little trouble.

 

Yes i have used old housing but very very good condition ones and new seals. any pointers on how to start this setup guys? had the engine in three months and no luck so far.

 

Is fuel actually getting to the chambers at all? Have you checked your plugs after you haved tried to turn the engine over? You may have to replace them if they are soaked and burned out.

Maybe you're flooding since new rebuilds with used housings typically do so easily. Try this out, but do it at your own risk. There is a dispute on this board whether or not to do so, but I have personally done it to more than one engine and everything is still fine today.

Deflood your engine following the procedure you normally would. Pull EGI, crank engine..Blah blah blah. Now remove all spark plugs from the engine and set them aside. Crank engine again. The engine might smoke up a bit, but will be releasing the final gas that is left in the housing at this point and leave it dry. Take ONE Tsp of automatic transmission fluid to both chambers of the rotor housing. Either hole, leading or trailing works. Doesn't matter. Put spark plugs back in and try to start the car.

 

engines dont require much to run. you need to check fuel is actually entering the combustion chambers. then you need to make sure the spark plugs are firing. unplug one plug wire and lay it on the top of the fender and crank. if it sparks then spark should be good.
next is to check timing. put engine on tdc and pull cas cover. if i remember right, one of the teeth should be sitting right in front of one of the magnet pickups.

if you do all this and it all checks out then you need to pull start it.

put it in 2nd gear and tow it behind another vehicle going about 20mph? with the clutch out and key on. it should fire up with in 50' of you moving.

let us know what you find

 

dont use auto tranny fluid.

if you can, pull, or push start the car with another car. make sure all the wireing is in fact good, fuel pressure is good, the harness is in tact at all connectors, and you are getting ignition. then, and only then try and start it. pull or push start.

 

how new is your gas? Old gas floods an engine easily just because of the fact it makes it harder to start. Hopefully your gas has not been sitting for over a year as well

 

Like they said, go through the deflood procedure. At least pulling the plugs will tell you if your getting fuel. You can also test for fire by letting the plugs lay on the shock tower and still plugged up to the plug wires. Then spin it over and see if they fire. I have had some rebuilds be a witch to start. I use about 8oz of motor oil and pour it in the intake before trying to start. The oil will help build compression.

 

+1. I got the engine that came in my base to start that way. It had an obliterated rear rotor (all 3 apex seals gone, gouged to hell), a chipped apex seal in the front rotor, and severely overheated with all coolant seals looking like little more than dust.

A little oil in the combustion chambers should start a rebuild no problem . Be prepared for a smoke show though. If the car is in a garage, push it outside first, and make sure your neighbors won't call the fire department/police.

 

Whats a good way to test the fuel is getting to the chambers, i know fuel is at the rail adn the pressure is there just cant figure it out!!! will test plugs etc today and get back to yas.

Thanks

Conrad

 

Is your timing set up right? make sure your crank angle sensor is put in there correctly and all that good stuff. Mine would not start till I got the timing set up.

 

If the tach needle bumps up/down when the engine is turned over, then most likely there is spark.

Or have someone spin the engine while you hold one of the lead sparkplug wires just about a 1/8" outside its bore in the lead coil assy. Spark should be seen.

Is it a lack of fuel or not? Unplug the fuel pump. Then spray starter fluid into the air filter assy for three seconds or Less. Try to start the engine. If it makes starting noises then it's a fuel problem. Most likely misrouting of the fuel lines at the engine. Remove the RETURN line from the engine and crank the engine for a couple of seconds. Fuel should flow from the engine side of the return connection. IF it does, then the lines on the engine are most likely routed right. IF no flow.......misrouted lines on the engine/at the engine.

I wouldn't spend any amount of time trying to start it unless you KNOW you have spark.

 

I put the timing light on each lead and it strobed on everyone is that telling me i have spark?

timing is correct i think, ive tryed retarding it 180 degrees becasue i thought it was out but seems to be ok

Gonna check fuel tonight i hope but not to sure how to do this!!!

 

When people bring me their projects that don't run after a meticulous rebuild, I can usually re-shoot the CAS and it fires right up. I don't know why, but lots of people get the timing wrong.

It sounds like you're not using a timing light. You can usually borrow one from an auto parts store, if not, they're cheap. It'll tell you if your timing is right.

If you have been messing with the timing without a timing light, I can almost guarantee you the timing is wrong.

Failing that, tow it around a parking lot.

I once had use of a trailer that only held the front wheels. I had to move a car with a totally blown engine for a friend of mine. The oil looked like mucus with mold in it. The engine was total trash with no compression that was left in the rain with the oil cap and hood off, and we were planning to replace it. I left the car in 5th gear and drove 30 or so miles to his home.

It fired right up and we drove right into his garage.

And the cloud of smoke was so thick I'm amazed no one called the fire station.

 

That's IMHO only used on old engines whose life is short already.
I would just put about an oz. of oil in each chamber, MMO works best with a tin can oil squirter. had to do it that WAY with an automatic that couldnt be push/pull started.

Make sure to rotate the engine over a few times with the spark plugs in and then take them out clean any oil on them off, put them in and crank. Make sure to open the thottle ALL THE WAY open BEFORE you start turning the key, instead of after the engine is already spinning, should fire right up and smoke alot, unless you've got something wrong. wires/vac leak.

 

1. make sure the cas was reinstalled properly (lining up with dot and yellow mark on pulley.. double check, i'm prolly wrong :P)

2. mostly likely will flood at first, so pull the fuel fuse (leave spark) and turn until it starts. may take a minute or so.

3. will run ruff for a bit. when it dies, plug fuel fuse back in and start it back up. Let it run, seals are breaking in. Will sound like a bridge initially :P Watch your water levels and have a garden hose ready with the rad cap open. as the water/coolant fills the motor air will escape so you want to keep it topped up so all the air gets out and ti doesn't overheat/hot spot on you.

Its full of assembly lube too, so don't start putting crap like ATF.

When we did my friends car we turned it over a few times for a minute with no spark/fuel to clear it up. cleaned the plugs a bit too, they where oily.

 

I haven't done it myself, but the idea is that after a rebuild some seals may be sticking. Tow starting spins the rotors at a high rpm and keeps it in a Start condition, as opposed to using a starter to do the same work which restricts you to brief cranking periods and tends to shorten the life of the unit.

 

So i towed it and still no luck.

Has spark(needle bounces when trying to start? think this is correct) but timing could be wrong. maybe i have put the crank pulley on wrong or is there only one way it can go?? Also yellow mark?? for setting up the timing, im think its the one with the dent(is there two marks?). Finally does anyone knoe how to check injector pulse

 

The needle bouncing means that the trailing coil is getting a signal. The simplest way to confirm spark on a coil is to remove a plug from the engine, put it back into its spark plug wire boot and then hold the body of the plug (not the tip) to metal (like the nice, big, shiny upper intake plenum.) Hold the plug by the rubber boot while doing this to avoid an unpleasant surprise. An assistant cranks the engine and you watch the end of the plug - if you see sparks then you know that the CAS is sending to the ECU, the ECU is sending to that coil and that coil is also receiving power from the main relay.


I have no experience with this.


Do you mean check that the injectors are receiving power, or check that they're actually discharging fuel? You'll have to remove the manifolds to do either.

 

check fuel by spraying a little starting fluid in the intake and crank it over and see if it sputters or starts for a second, if it does then you have a fuel issue, which could simply be a large vacuum leak in the system which isn't pulling the AFM door open enough to keep the fuel pump turned on.

compression is the usual issue with rebuilds, do a compression test and see if it has less than 70PSI of cold cranking compression, if it does then you need to put a few squirts of MMO in each leading plug hole before cranking it over to help build compression.

for spark there have been suggestions to test to see if there is spark. if you are unsure about the timing then follow the CAS stabbing procedures in the FSM or haynes manual. the crank pulley for timing can only be bolted on one way, unless someone decided that it was a good idea to dremel out the holes for some reason..

another common issue with rebuilds is reversed fuel lines, especially if it has a Jspec rats nest on it.