Sniper_X

Okay.....

My engine:
idle bounced...
died at idle with ac on...
had a stuck rear port..
got "not so good" mileage
lacked power.

Otherwise it was perfect.
(I reordered and reinstalled most of the interior from the dealer, so thats why it was perfect otherwise...)

I decided to get rid of all the gremlins once and for all.
I knew about the ATF trick, and decided to do it WED night.
I also knew the car would be down for 2-3 days for the time i wanted it to soak in ATF.

SO....

I checked everything:

all vaccum actuators - ok
all sensors (that were within reasonable reach) - ok
6 ports - Front, ok / Back, STUCK

So i started by beginning the ATF process on the rotors...
Okay, thats started....

now, the 6 ports...

I could't really rotate the back one unless I exerted ALOT of force.

So I started the task of "port removal" when I decided that I didn't have the guts (or gaskets) to tear the intake all the way down to the block.

I had removed the upper intake, and saw the secondary fuel rail.

Here I realized that the secodary injector was directly above the frozen port.

Hmmmmmmmm.......

I removed the fuel rail, and put Automatic Transmission fluid down the hole over the stuck port (about 1/4 - 1/2 cup).

(Yes i made sure the port was closed, but for you ATF tricksters... with the port OPEN, think of this as a way to soak the top of the rotors instead of turning the engine so often.)

This should have soaked the port, and I hoped it would free it while still in the block.

Then, while it soaked I took time to check out the intake and throttle body stuff.

After only about 2 hours, (with me manually moving the port armature with my fingers - I also removed the actuators), It BEGAN TO MOVE FREELY! (slowly but surely..)

WOW!

Anyway, oddly enough, when I had looked down my injector hole PRIOR to putting ATF down there, I noticed that there was a small grille that was just under the injector nozzle.

This grille was silver in color.

After the ATF it was black!!!!

I used various cleaners on it, (which by the way also joined the ATF obviously, so keep in mind that i have now put ATF and WD-40 and carb cleaner down there, but only a small bit), it was still black.

(I say this just in case these cleaners had an effect on freeing the port.)

I was unnerved by this change in color, but proceeded (as there was nothing i could do about it anyway).

Today (Saturday) I drove the car, and after checking, adjusting, all sensors and actuators, and after soaking the rotors in ATF for 2 days (each day rotating the engine to each rotor face by hand and adding ATF), and after unsticking the rear port actuator, I have what feels like a new engine that doesn't die at idle with the AC on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

For good measure, I added THREE bottles of injector cleaner to a new tank of HIGH octane gas and will run this tank all out before refilling.

(this by itself helped alot when I first bought the car...)


So, to fix all these problems?

Do the ATF trick
Free up the 6 ports (I know you can wire them open, but hate defeating things that must have been there for a reason)

• Free up the 6 ports with ATF (or by removing and cleaning them)---(i know they can be wired open, but hate doing that)
• adjust the throttle body parts (thermowax, Dashpot, etc.....)
• replace ALL REMOTELY LOOSE vaccuum hoses
• check / adjust the trottle cable tension
• check / adjust the timing
• adjust the Throttle position sensor (it always needs it)
• adjust the idle (WITH THE INITIAL SET WIRE SHORTED PEOPLE!!! -don't skip that part)
• Spray -silicone lube- into ALL diaphram operated actuators (keeps em LoOoOse and happy)
• AND... last but NOT LEAST........ reset the computer after you are done with EVERYTHING. (and drive for 2 days to let it learn)

Suparslinc

Okay, I want to comment on this post because it kicks ***!!!!
Its amazing how a little bit of planning and logic can go a long way...the car was probably owned by someone who drove it too easy and over time the complicated VTI thing gets all gunked up, yes, WD-40 is magic in a can but its also corrosive so don't be too liberal with that stuff. I put some grease on my actuator rods and they have moved smoothly ever since. The ATF trick is really a great place to start when restoring power because its so essential for the engine to be clean and have good sealing many people try to fix problems by throwing money at them but you have to address the root of the problem first!

SpeedRacer

The "grill" thing you referred to is your diffuser...its built into the extension(or VDI)manifold...I think it is break the fuel bits into smaller pieces and distribute it more evenly in the mixture to get a faster more reliable combustion.

I also did the ATF trick this weekend(although my engine already idles pretty good, and my compression was already pretty good(is around 90lbs good for each rotor face?) I didn't have another set of spark plugs to use after the ATF treatment though. Immediately I noticed an even smoother idle, and smoother revs from 0-8k...I took it out for a spin to get the rest of the smoke out after letting my car warm up. I could barely get my car above 110mph after driving around for 15-20 minutes. Then I went back home, and popped out the spark plugs. They were gunked up and black and brown. So I used a grinder with metal bristles and cleaned off the spark plugs and reinserted them. I them took my car out for a high speed run and hit 140mph for the first time in my 90GTU. My previous record was 135...and believe it or not my car still felt sluggish. Maybe it was my computer adjusting, cause later that night I was driving around for awhile and it felt better. I will have to do another high speed run today. I love living out in the country.

Suparslinc

I think that even if the plugs are clean now they still won't be operating at 100%. I heard from a few people that once a spark plug gets fouled, it will never fire right. Since you got all the ATF out now you might want to think about putting new plugs in they probably need replaced.

adding 5 mph to the top speed is really impressive; have you done any mods? I topped out around 133 with a racepipe and 95k on a Mazda rebuild.

SpeedRacer

Yeah, iI havwe a decent amount of mods, mostly weight mods, and getting rid of emissions..here is what I've done to my car:

Bonez Racepipe(I have headers that I need to install yet)
K&N Cone Intake Filter
6-ports wire open
VDI Wire open
Airpump removed
P/S Pump removed
AC Compressor and all components removed
Ground Control Coilover suspesnsion
375lbs. Front Eibach Springs, 325lbs. Rear Eibach Springs
Upgraded front Brake calipers to 4-piston, and upgraded to larger front rotors, rebuilt rear-calipers and added brembo cross-drilled rotors, Hawk HP+ pads at all four corners.

I'd estimate I'm running at least 150lbs. lighter than stock. And probably about 10-12 flywheel HP more than stock. With all my pulley's gone except for the alternator I'm probably running 10-15hp more at the wheels than stock. I really need to dyno my car. I realize my plugs probably aren't as good now that they have been fowled, but I Just got these plugs like 2 weeks ago, so I'm going to buy another set of plugs this thursday when I get paid, and use the set thats in now as thrash plugs(in case I need to do another ATF treatment again, or something like that). I'll have to go for 145 once my headers are on(I have to get a straight pipe welded from off my Bonez racepipe first to make my headers fit) and once my new plugs are in...I'd be pretty damn proud of my little NA if I get'er to 145.

JarrardB

Pardon my ignorance - but what is the ATF trick? Obviously its auto tranny fluid but exactly what is the process you've used?

Will it work in a TII?

Deathbots

The ATF trick!

http://www.mazspeed.com/atf.htm

have yet to do it myself. Heard it works wonders.

JarrardB

Hey - that sounds cool - gee - I wonder who will lend me their car for a weekend? Maybe I can rent a bomb for $20 a day and do it that way.

sweet

Sniper_X

Make sure to change the spark plugs AFTER the ATF trick!!!!

I did, and i just cant beleive i missed writing this down!

Anyway....

I started the ATF trick FIRST, then checked everything i could reach.

(I would also sometime lean over and stare at the open spark plug holes dripping ATF and imagine all the "ATF goodness" that was happening in those dark holes.)

-but thats just because im a freak.

blue88gxl N/A

how can i check my 6 ports?
is there a step by step thing on how to do that?
this must be something involving the fuel or intake.

:o

Sniper_X

Remove the actuators from the exhaust tide of the engine.
There are two.

The back one angles back, the forward andgle tward the front.

they are attached to a rubber hose.

Once the two bolts are removed from each, slide them off while holding the metal actuator arm straight and level.

once removed, simply try to rotate the actuator pins by hand.

if they are hard to move, or frozen, real the posts about how to fix them that are throughout this board.

MaxRX7

question..

After the ATF has been sitting for 24+hours, and I want to start up the car, I still use the same "old" spark plugs ?

As soon as the engine starts the smoke show starts right? After warming up I take it to redline a few times, and

Then I install NEW spark plugs right ?

Sniper_X

Right..

I wouldn't redline too much, once or twice is fine.

I think its important that you spen two days with putting about 1/2 cup atf on each rotor face.

Move the engine by hand to do this.

Rotate it every 16 hours to get all three faces.

I cant stress enough to MAKE SURE that noone is around when you start the car.


I fogged out an outdoor birthday party THREE DOORS DOWN!

Try to start in in an open space, and in windy conditions!

Drive hard for about 15 beyond the time that smoke comes out the tailpipe.

You MUST check this mby idling the car and waling around to the back and watching the exhaust.

It should stop about 15 minutes into your drive.

blue88gxl N/A

i took the actuator off and it was connected to a shaft that had a spring and pin like thing on it with a groove cut in the middle of it...is that my port or 6 port?
and I just bought some spark plugs an hour ago, they are made by denso are those any good?
what type of Automatic tranny fluid should i use, dexron III, or just some regular type?
Please help me

keith

blue88gxl N/A

I am going to be doing the atf trick this weekend, does it really smoke that bad, how much should I put in, can I put it in the leading and trailing? how do I get it on my 6 ports to clean them out?

JarrardB

OK - I just went down to Repco to get new plugs - coz i figured mine would get stuffed when I did the ATF thing. He - goes - well for all four its gunna be over $200 - wtf?

So I told him what I was doing to the car and he suggested that I buy some plugs that are the same length and size but which are only $3 a pop and use them while I do the ATF treatment. He said it will run like **** but you are gonna throw them out anyway so it don't really matter. I'm wondering if this is such a good idea considering the rotary's reliability when running poorly.

Any other suggestions? Anyone have some old plugs I can use? (i think i threw mine out)

RX-7 GT

200?!!!!!!? that freakin bull ****.

ngk's at most it will be maybe like 40-50. or maybe a lil cheaper.
are you sure it wasnt plug wires he was talking about? sometimes people mess up on that stuff.

JarrardB

These were NGK plugs - remeber I'm in australia - our dollar is **** at the moment.

The 86 - 88 plugs were over $50 EACH
The 89 - 92 plugs were $16 EACH

What the ****?

Will the 89- 92 plugs work in an 88?

Suparslinc

Um, yeah.
NGK BRQ7 AND BRQ9 or something like that.
I can't get over that price. $50 a plug is ridiculous. I get them for about $20 a set here.

SpeedRacer

blue88gxl - yes those are your secondary ports(5th and 6th)

Sniper_X

try $7.32 for DENSO plugs that are MADE for rotarty!!!!!!!!

Go to rockauto.com.

I got mine at Autozone for a bit more and they were NGK!

Don't beleive them!!!

Sniper_X

for those that asked about the type of ATF to use...

I used the nicest i could find.

1 guart was all that was needed and out of that i used only 1/3rd of it.

I used a model airplane hand crank fuel pump to put about 1/2 cup into each rotor face over two days. (every 16 hours)

I also put in atf onver the ports by removing the secondary injectors and put about 1/2 in each hole (with the ports closed)

then after about 4 hours, i move the ports back and forth every few minutes, leaving the ports closed when i was done with each workout.

DO NOT USE a wrench on these port actuators to move them

they should move freely with your fingers.

the actuators only exert 1.5lbs of force to open them.

Suparslinc

Don't waste your money.

You don't need dextron-mercron ATF fluid,

you don't need synthetic ATF fluid,

just buy some cheap penzoil stuff that says "ATF" across the front

Sniper_X

true, no need to get fancy.

HuggyBear

ahhh newb question here.... how do you rotate the rotars by hand?

im planning on doing this once i feel good about having all the steps laid out in front of me.

the only thing im unsure about is how to ratate the rotars, and how to get at these ports so i can give them the treatment as well.

if anyone cares to help me out with an explanation, please remember im a new to this so i could use a roadmap... hahaha. the haynes manual hasnt arrived in the mail yet.

aside from finding these ports and turning the rotars i think i got it covered.