FD upper intake and TB on S4 NA
01-05-03, 12:05 AM
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FD upper intake and TB on S4 NA
this has got to be a feasable swap right? im not sure if it worth a power increase( but its got to be some) but i am just tired of looking at the boring S4 bay. i have been doing a lot of searching, and i know this can be done to a TII but i did not uncover anything related to an NA? im hoping that this is not because it is totally not possible? after doing a lot of thinking, i think it could work, i just need some help figuring some things out:
-what do i do woth the BAC valve on the S4
-incorporating the AFM
-vacume and coolant lines
there is also another issue i wanted to deal with. on the S4 intake duct, their is a split air tube that some off of it right before the throttle body, i remember hearing that this can be eliminated by eliminating some other things, one of which might have been the BAC valve, and if thats the case then that solves one of my questions. so if anyone can offer any insight that would be great. if its totally not possible, be kind. thanks
-alex
-what do i do woth the BAC valve on the S4
-incorporating the AFM
-vacume and coolant lines
there is also another issue i wanted to deal with. on the S4 intake duct, their is a split air tube that some off of it right before the throttle body, i remember hearing that this can be eliminated by eliminating some other things, one of which might have been the BAC valve, and if thats the case then that solves one of my questions. so if anyone can offer any insight that would be great. if its totally not possible, be kind. thanks
-alex
01-05-03, 01:08 AM
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If it will bolt up to your existing lower intake manifold, it should work. Isn't the FD engine a 4 port engine? NA second gen engiens are 6 port so an FD lower manifold might not work, but if the upper FD man will bolt to the NA lower you could probably rig it up.
NA upper manifolds are designed to utilize the "tournament effect" or dynamic induction pulse relaying as a form of increasing inertial supercharging. I know that was a mouthful but what I mean to say is, Turbo manifolds do not need this effect because they get boose from their turbo. NA engines need all the help they can get so that is why the NA manifold is built this way. It is probably another reason why the NA manifold is so long and has a larger surge tank (the part that the throttle body attaches to).
I don't know much about the FD but doubt you would get any performance gain. It would likely not work as well as your stock manifold.
NA upper manifolds are designed to utilize the "tournament effect" or dynamic induction pulse relaying as a form of increasing inertial supercharging. I know that was a mouthful but what I mean to say is, Turbo manifolds do not need this effect because they get boose from their turbo. NA engines need all the help they can get so that is why the NA manifold is built this way. It is probably another reason why the NA manifold is so long and has a larger surge tank (the part that the throttle body attaches to).
I don't know much about the FD but doubt you would get any performance gain. It would likely not work as well as your stock manifold.
01-05-03, 04:11 AM
#3
maybe u guys haven`t noticed one thing.....
turbo motors (13BT and 13B-REW) does get flow from drivers side to passenger side......from intercooler
NA motors flow goes in other direction ( directly from intake)
i can`t imagine to fit FD upper intake manifold backwards in engine bay.....
turbo motors (13BT and 13B-REW) does get flow from drivers side to passenger side......from intercooler
NA motors flow goes in other direction ( directly from intake)
i can`t imagine to fit FD upper intake manifold backwards in engine bay.....
01-05-03, 11:29 AM
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well that sucks. i know it would fit on there, and i cant see it being a problem that the fd upper intake manifold flows from the drivers. but what you say about the "tournament effect" bugs me. i never took that into consideration. just thought id find out, thanks
01-05-03, 05:50 PM
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The tournament effect has been refined by Mazda over the years and has reached a new level of sophistication with the Renesis engine in the new RX-8. The S4 NA engines had a "one phase" (for lack of an official term) ram effect tuning setup, where there is a "u" shaped passege inside the manifold to allow a closing intake port to sling intake gasses back around toward the other rotor and help squish the moving intake gasses inside its chamber.
Part of the reason the S5 13B NA engine is rated at 160HP instead of 145HP (which is the S4 engine's power rating) is because it has "Variable Dynamic Effect" tournament effect intake runners. This allows a "two phase" tournament effect that can be used at two ranges of engine speed. The first phase is much like the S4 engine, but above 5500 RPM the second phase comes into effect by a valve opening on the manifold. The Renesis engine is "three phase" and has three different sized "u" runner passages that are tuned for three different RPM ranges.
If your car is not already equipped with an S5 (89-92) intake manifold, you may be able to buy this manifold off Ebay or the parts for sale forum on this site and install it. You will need to use an RPM switch to get the second phase tournament effect to come online by opening a solenoid valve but you will get a genuine performance improvement from this mod.
Turbo manifolds are not tuned for NA applications and is why they are shaped differently.
Part of the reason the S5 13B NA engine is rated at 160HP instead of 145HP (which is the S4 engine's power rating) is because it has "Variable Dynamic Effect" tournament effect intake runners. This allows a "two phase" tournament effect that can be used at two ranges of engine speed. The first phase is much like the S4 engine, but above 5500 RPM the second phase comes into effect by a valve opening on the manifold. The Renesis engine is "three phase" and has three different sized "u" runner passages that are tuned for three different RPM ranges.
If your car is not already equipped with an S5 (89-92) intake manifold, you may be able to buy this manifold off Ebay or the parts for sale forum on this site and install it. You will need to use an RPM switch to get the second phase tournament effect to come online by opening a solenoid valve but you will get a genuine performance improvement from this mod.
Turbo manifolds are not tuned for NA applications and is why they are shaped differently.
