Denholm

The victim: 1986 GX, bone stock, approx. 80k on the rebuild.

The story: Was driving to my buddy's house.. to fix my waterpump housing gasket.. Long story short, I parked the car for about 5minutes, then my bud's mom had to leave so I got in the 7, fired it up, moved it out of the way and shut it off. All was totally normal. 15minutes later, I went to move my car again to get it out of the way of our dirtbike jump, lol, and it wouldn't start. (We hadn't even done the gasket yet) At first I thought the battery was just dead, because i had music playing.. (although only for like 15min) It just clicked once and like attempted to turn over, and then nothing. I didn't think much of it, so we hooked up the jumper cables to the Jimmy thinking the battery was dead. Same thing, it almost turns over once, and then nothing. Now i'm starting to worry, because my starter is BRAND new. We gave it a few taps with a hammer just incase, and try to fire her up.. Same thing. If I leave the key on for 10seconds or so, a tiny bit of smoke begins to come from what appears to be the starter. So now we're both sorta confused, so we figure we'll just bump start it... After attempting to do so in every gear, including reverse to no avail we hooked it up to the jimmy and towed it down the road a ways, still bump starting it, and still making no progress. So by this point we're both sorta like 'well, what the f*ck..' since the car was running perfectly fine a half hour earlier.
Also, the motor wouldn't even turn by hand.
Please don't go and tell me it's flooded because the car wouldn't even turn over, so I highly doubt that.

The only clue is that for the past few weeks the car has been running with unusually high oil pressure. (8bar, sometimes higher) Even though it's running Castrol GTX and it is super clean. Also, it has been runing a little too hot, hence the waterpump gasket, but the car has never actually overheated.

Any serious advice is greatly appreciated, whether you can just confirm that it's siezed or if you know how i might be able to get it running.

Thanks,
Nigel

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

remove all your drive belts and see if it spins over freely, you could have an accessory failing/siezed.

Carzy Driver

check the starter cables to see if they're tighten down all the way?

Boostmaniac

smoke coming from the starter is one of 2 things. Either the motor is completely seized and the starter is overheating from trying to turn it, which isn't the case because when you tried to bump start it the back tires would have instantly locked up because the motor won't turn. This would have been obvious because when you were towing it with the Jimmy the wheels would have been locked. Assuming that this didn't happen, you probably have a short in your starter, most likely in the solenoid that is causing it to burn up, hence the smoke.

Let us know how it goes.

P.S. If the starter is brand new then just take it back and replace it. It should still be under warranty.

Terrh

iTrader: (7)

you have either a toasted starter, toasted battery or shitty battery-to-starter wiring (including the battery terminals and grounds!)

+1 on trying to turn the engine over by hand

if you can turn it AT ALL by hand it is not an issue. Grab the belt on your p/s and try and turn it that way, it's probably easiest.

Boostmaniac

Make sure it is out of gear when you try this.

You'd be surprised at how many people overlook this little tidbit.

My5ABaby

iTrader: (7)

Unless you're really really strong?

Denholm

Actually the tires did just lock up when we tried to towstart it; in reverse it laid a patch on the pavement when i popped the clutch and didn't turn over at all.


**edit**
Also, A/C and P/S are removed on the car, the only pulleys i guess are the airpump and the clutch fan. But I'll try disassembling all that and spinning it by hand again. But other than that i'm stumped.

Carzy Driver

does the car move fine when out of gear?

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

to answer your question, yes these motors can randomly sieze(carbon lock). if it is locked then you will have to try and dissolve the carbon with some ATF or MMO or simply do a rebuild.

C-Murder

I found WD40 worked to unlock my engine, and I trust it a little more than ATF for no apparent reason hahahaha

ahabion

with the start and stopping of the engine, could it be a minor flood? i'm asking more so than commenting...

C-Murder

you'd still be able to spin the engine if it was flooded, it just wouldn't start then

Denholm

Yes

Denholm

Has anyone ever done the un-siezing trick where you soak the engine in diesel, with rotarys?

Terrh

iTrader: (7)

yes diesel works really well!

Don't leave it in there very long though. My last engine got soaked in a combo of mmo/diesel/carb cleaner/brake cleaner/misc other crap when I purchased it and while it freed up the seals very well, when we pulled it apart this spring we found that it had NO OIL SEALS at all, the rubber bits had been practically destroyed, and I'm guessing it was by one of the items that I'd poured into it.

But I've used diesel on other engines with no apparent ill effects so I'm pretty sure it was probably something else. And it did work /really/ well. Diesel eats carbon.

Denholm

So how exactly did you do it? Drain the oil and fill er' up with diesel? How long did you let it sit for, and which technique did you use for trying to spin the motor over?

bebiracer

if u were getting unusually high pressure that means that a bearing might have walk alittle untill it couldnt handle it anymore and boom theres ur seize but other than that yeah use some diesel on that ish

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

i use MMO to free up siezed engines. just got a free FC the other day and it had been open to the atmosphere for probably about a year(no plugs nor exhaust) and was seized up solid so i added about 4 ounces of MMO to every port i could find and first bumped the thrust surfaces to be sure the bearings were not siezed then put a 5 foot breaker bar on it and with all my weight just about it finally gave way and freed itself up, it had stuck seals once it freed up but after doing a full treatment of MMO overnight and cranking it every so often it finally built compression and runs great now and doesn't smoke a bit.

drago86

I'm sorry to say this but since it was running previously and just suddenly seized, its probably not just a rust locked rotor. Try the MMO/ATF but my money is on bearing failure.

* try removing all the belts too, your waterpump could have locked up.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

could be carbon locked but yes a siezed bearing is a good possibility or a simple accessory like i mentioned.

importsown

It was the brake cleaner. Brake cleaner is supposed to eat away rubber/oil because it is used to clean NEW rotors being shipped in oil to prevent rust.

Also, this sounds to me like the water pump is siesed as someone said, possibly from a gasket leak and water building up, resulting in bearing failure.

FC3S Murray

iTrader: (7)

My second rebuild, my cousin and I got a little to drunk and ended up installing the rubber oil seals facing the wrong way(the white mark ). Well that engine ate oil like a champ and one night before I went to bed after a ride I put 2 qts in her. The next day I start her up and get half way down the road and EEEEERRRRCCCCHHHHH!! Engine siezes at 30 MPH. Oil pressure was non existant(realized it right before my neck got hammered), let alone the dip stick was damn near dry. I have no idea where the oil went but it obviously wasn't enough.


I think if this guy has carbon lock the shear force from towing and dropping the clutch would break that free. Especially since it ran fine an hour before, that wouldn't be much lock up. Sorry dude but your engine is prob toast. I know that feeling and it is not cool. Sorry man.

C-Murder

anything that'll soften the carbon should work; wether it be atf, WD40, diesel, etc.... my vote is for WD40 though, ahahahahahahahaha just because I know it doesn't hurt anything

FC3S Murray

iTrader: (7)

I really dont think it is carbon lock C-murder. Something internal f*cked up. WD40 works for everything though.