GTU_FAN

So basically if the lights dont work my ECU is bad?

GTU_FAN

Alright let me see if I get this right. My ACV isn't working right and the 2 lights you use to set the TPS wont work either...but since the 2 lights actually indicate function of the "switch" and "relief" solenoids in the rats nest which operate the ACV (instead of full or narrow range on the TPS) the two issues are one and the same. I cant really callibrate the TPS properly until the signal to those solenoids is restored. And the most likely reason the ACV solenoids are malfunctioning is because the ECU isn't grounding them when it's supposed to.
How do I check this? Back-probe the ECU at terminals 2O and 2P? I've checked the mechanical function of all the solenoids in the rats nest recently and they are fine. I read voltage to them but like you said they are looking for a ground before they function not voltage. So when I back-probe the ECU am I even able to tell if its sending the grounding signal and not just different voltage? How does that work? I'm confused....

HAILERS

Yeah. If you backprobe the pins either at the ECU or at the solenoid plugs, the voltage should Drop when they come into play.

Actually, just FULLY warm the car up and go to the Relief (Blue) solenoid and pull the connector on then off on then off. You should feel the solenoid click OR put a meter on the solenoid and the thing should read less than 2vdc but if you blip the throttle it should go to 12v.

At idle the Switching solenoid (grey) should read about 12vdc but when you rev the engine it should go to less than 2vdc.

In other words the Relief is engergized at idle with a fully HOT engine and the Switching is de-engergized at idle with a fully HOT engine.

Another way to see if things are working is to idle the engine FULLY HOT, and then pull the vacuum line that sticks straight up off and you should have vacuum being pulled on that hose. Then pull the very bottom small vacuum line off and feel the hose output. No air should be coming out of it (it's pressure on that line, not vacuum). Now rev the engine over 3800rpm and air should be coming out that small hose on the bottom, showing the RElief solenoid is working.

In other words you don't have to go to the ECU to check the pins. Just check them at the solenoid plugs.

Before I did any of that I'd take a piece of spare vacuum hose and suck on the nipple on the acv that sticks straight up and make sure it holds a vacuum. If not, then the things shot. Same with the small very bottom nipple. No hold vacuum....no damn good.

HAILERS

Tell you what. Since you have enough sense to know what pins the Relief and Switching solenoid are at the ECU..........I'd go to the Narrow Range input AT the ECU, and put the meter on it. The with a fully HOT engine, see if the voltage meets the specs of the S5 FSM. IF not, then go turn the TPS screw til it does meet the FSM specs. HOT ENGINE, please.

By the way, I just went to my car and the Relief and Switching Solenoids with a meter. The Relief with a fully hot engine reads less than 2vdc and the Switching (grey) reads 12vdc. Rev the engine over 3800 and the Relief (blue) goes up to 12vdc and the Switching (grey) goes under 2vcc.

Do the tps check at the ECU. That's alllllllllll folks.

I just looked at the S5 FSM and it says the narrow range at pin 2F should read approx 1vdc at idle (fully hot engine). By the way, don't get carried away and start messing around looking at the full range tps. Forget that sucker for now. It's not important at all. Just the narrow range set to approx 1vdc To me APPROX means from 0.95vdc to 1.05vdc.

I only mention this tps bs because I find it hard to believe the tps isn't putting out a gnd to the Relief and switching solenoid. I've no idea why your green, three pin check connector isn't doing it's job.

GTU_FAN

^I didn't neet to adjust the screw on the TPS to get the voltage range right at the ECU in the first place. You know how the TPS is bolted to the TB by 3 bolts? Well a while back I removed the bottom bolt so now its easy for me to swap TPS' and adjust their position on the TB without having to remove the TB. All I had to do to set the TPS by the ECU was loosen the 2bolts on the TB and move it back and forth until the readings at the ECU were within spec. Having done that I have adjusted the screw/spring since trying to raise the idle however. I guess I should re-check the readings at the ECU now to make sure I didn't throw it out of whack.
But assuming the TPS is still reading correctly at the ECU I still cant adjust my idle correctly if the 2 lights dont work. And since the 2 lights dont work my first priority is to see if those solenoids are activating when they are supposed to. Like I said I can already vouch that mechanically the solenoids are fine. I'll check them with a meter though to make sure their voltage changes with RPM changes.
Now what if the solenoids are working and my ACV and the 2 lights still dont work correctly? What do I need to do then?

HAILERS

Frankly, I wouldn't care a bit about the two lights if the tps is set right. And while having the TPS set right is one of the first things you might do when setting the idle of a RX, IMHO you don't set the idle with the TPS at all. TPS does not control the idle imho.

You set the TPS with a HOT engine. Jumper the initial set coupler and then make sure the timing is right with a timing light with a fully HOT engine. Then adjust the bac screw to set the idle speed to approx 750rpm. Then remove the initial set coupler and your done.

Unfortunatly life does not work like that because someone in the past has monkey fucked the throttle body/screws/fast idle cam/throttle stop screws/afm screw/afm internals/etc, so it's sorta finding square one if you can and start from there.

OH. I know your solenoids are good. They hardly fail. It's the control signal that is usually amiss to the solenoid or the vacuum lines from the solenoids to the acv that are misrouted.

GTU_FAN

I checked the relief and switching solenoids this morning after warming the engine. The relief solenoid was constantly reading full voltage and the voltage of the switching solenoid didn't lessen with raised rpm.

I unburied the ECU and the first thing I noticed was the ECU ground was loose? After snugging that I replaced the ECU with my spare, (I guess I should be glad no one was interested in it at treasure island last weekend) and reattached the negative battery cable. Then I put the meter back on the solenoids.

Voila! the relief solenoid now measured appropriate voltage. I revved the engine and saw the relief solenoid's voltage level jump. I put the meter on the switching solenoid but its voltage didn't drop with the revs. Still I was hopeful there was some improvement so I pulled off the lower hose from the ACV. No air! I revved it up and it started blowing strong.

Wasting no time I reburried the ECU and drove to the smog shop. These are the results.

HCS MAX/AVE/MEAS CO MAX/AVE/MEAS
Idle: 120/29 / 24 1.0/.10/ .01
2500: 140/20/ 1 1.0/.10/ .01

Obviously I passed Many thanks to ya'll who've been so patient and helpful. I wouldn't have figured it out otherwise.

"Every good act is charity. A man's true wealth hereafter is the good that he does in this world to his fellows." Mohammed

The best part of this of course is that I can open my 6 ports again and put my RB race exhaust back on. I miss the speeed! <no wise cracks about slow-*** NA drivers needing every little thing to feel fast please lol.

RotaryEvolution

iTrader: (30)

i told you it was the grounds!

j/k, grats on finding and fixing the problem.

GTU_FAN

I cant believe my bad luck sometimes. First thing I wanted to do today was get my RB exhaust put back on. So I call around and it being the friday before the 4th everyones busy except one shop called "Extreme Diesel and Exhaust". I haul the dissassembled RB system over there so he can take a look at it. I also need him to replace a header stud in the block and re-weld on an exhaust hanger that fell off. No problem, the guy is very cool.

So I leave the 7 with him and walk to the DMV with my new nice shiny emissions report I got yesterday to get some new reg tags. I wait in line for about an hour and the lady is trying to process my paperwork and says there's a problem. Apparently the smog shop didn't include some DMV number they needed. I say I'll call them up and get the number for her, she says no she needs the actual paperwork. Whatever... I call them anyway and the guy's like hmm... yeah that's wierd. This has never happened before. I'll have to call the sacramento office.

Well since I have to drive over there and get the paperwork from him later anyway I leave the DMV and go get some lunch while I'm still waiting for the 7 to be done. I walk over to a pizza joint and as I'm waiting for my food I call the smog shop back up to ask if he got through. The receptionist says the problem is my car was reported as a gross polluter by another smog shop! ****! I ask what I should do. She says I have to talk to a smog referee and jump through some hoops. Damnit!

So now I'm thinking I'm in big trouble. I had no idea my car was ever reported for a failed smog check. All of the shops I had taken it to before said that they would do a pipe-check first and cancel the test if it wasn't going to pass because they didn't want to get their customers in trouble. But apparently the shop I visited last friday, "Payless 4x4", didn't have such a policy. When I went to their shop the first time the guy seemed very cool, he'd even owned a 1st gen before. And even though the car end up failing he didn't say anything about reporting it or that I was in any sort of trouble. Just took my money and waved me out the door.

At this point I'm so angry I've lost my appetite. My thoughts flash to my 7 which at this moment should be close to having the RB exhaust installed. I'm thinking crap what if the 7 needs to be inspected by a smog referee? I'll have to put the stock exhaust back on again so really there is no point in getting my RB exhaust put on right now. I almost feel like hyperventilating from the stress but I force myself to remain calm. Call Payless, find out what the deal is... I tell myslef. So after taking a few breaths I try to get into a civil tone and call them up.

I ask him if his shop had reported me as a gross polluter. Yes he says. I ask why he didn't tell me. He stammers something about being required to do so by the state. I tell him that after I took my 7 to his shop I fixed the issue with the smog and it passed yesterday at another shop but because his shop reported me as a GP the DMV wont allow me to renew my registration. He says that his shop is sort of a major smog referee in this area and the DMV wont lift the GP status until his shop tests my car AGAIN and passes it. I ask him if this retest will cost me anything. He says Yes I'll have to charge you for another smog. At this point veins are starting to pop out of my head and I'm thinking HULK SMASH!

I tell him that I wish he would have TOLD ME last time I was there because I PAID FOR ANOTHER SMOG which was apparently a waste of time. Furthermore I tell him that my 7 is as-we-speak getting my afermarket exhaust installed and now I'll be forced to pay the man to take it off and install the same exhaust he tested it with. He still DOSENT APOLOGIZE! for NOT TELLING ME THAT I WOULD HAVE TO RETEST AT HIS SHOP OR I WOULD BE LABELLED AS A GP. He says that I can bring my car by anytime and he'll test it again and get this cleared up. I say I'll bring it over once the exhaust guy is done. He says fine.

So I walk over to the exhaust guys shop and see that he's about to bolt on the header. I explain my dillema and ask him to please reinstall the stock exhaust. I apologize and say I'll be happy to pay him whatever he was going to charge in the first place. The guy is cool he says he wont charge me until he finishes the job. He'll reinstall the stock exhaust and just charge me an extra hour. He says I can even bring it back once I'm done with the smog and he'll finish it up today. Cool. So as he's putting it back on I call up Payless and tell him I'll be right over. Suddenly the guy is giving me attitude and says he wont be able to retest me until 5pm. I say fine. The exhaust guy says he'll just hold unto my RB exhaust until I can bring it over to him again next week.

So there it is. The stress has exhausted me I'm going to take a nap... I'll let you know how it goes.

GTU_FAN

Alright well I just got the car retested at "Payless" it passed of course. He did apologize for the miscommunication as he put it... but since I had to pay the exhaust guy for another hour of labor in addition to the other pointless smog check his shop cost me a hundred bucks. Plus I'll have to wait till wendsay before I can get my RB exhaust fixed!

GTU_FAN

Ok well my exhaust is on and the car is registered... I'm not gonna keep track of this thread anymore so if you want more details or have any questions PM me....