Roen

iTrader: (2)

Commuting with R-Comps is dumb for two reasons.

1. You forget the average income of the FC owner on this board.

2. If there's standing water built up, your tires will hydroplane like no tomorrow. Driving in the rain on R-comps is only acceptable during drizzles or when no water has built up significantly.

ultrataco

iTrader: (2)

Why would you spend hundreds of dollars per tire on dry-pavement track tires for a dd commuter car? That sounds like a waste of money to me.

ColinShark

If you do any sort of racing, tires are a large help. However, they will not matter at all if you are doing highway races in an N/A seven. For daily driving, any tire that has tread and is properly inflated will be acceptable for safe driving, snow excluded.

jdmsuper7

iTrader: (1)

so you can brag to all your friends about how siiiiqqqqqqqq you are y0!

Personally, if you driving hard enough on the street to feel that you "need" r-comps, your license should be revoked because you are seriously endangering yourself and others. This is besides the fact that you will heat cycle all the stick outta them far before you run out of "tread."

Photonic

Ive ridden in street cars on r compounds from the drag strip and its a constant game of fighting the steering wheel. I swear..oversteer like a mother ******..and we were putting through traffic at 50 mph at like 1/8th throttle.

It was a 500hp car though...*shrug*

Tofuman FC3S

iTrader: (1)

1) Where did you hear me say the average FC owner should drive witrh R-comps?

2) R-comps are perfectly drivable in rain/standing water. You'll have to adjust your driving style though like you always have to in rainy conditions. It's called common sense.

I guess cause people like nice grip in their car? Why people put coil-overs on their car? Why do they bump up boost? Maybe they only own one car, maybe they have money to waste, I dunno. I'm not their mom, they don't have to report to me.

Anywho: R-comps aren't anymore race tires as Ling Long tires. They are street-tires you can run on track, or track-tires you can run on street. You say potato I say tomato.

Wow, you are so cool, I wish I was more like you! What is your problem? I never said anything about need, nor did I say I have r-comps on currently. I don't get what the problem is with complementing the race inspired suspension of you car with a good set of tires.

My licence actualy got revoked for speeding on a straight line that is, without r-comps. LoL!

About the stick: I can have a set of R888 in my front yard for a year in rain, and after a cycle of 15 mins they will still have more grip than any Ling Long piece of crap. Believe me, I know.



You know what guys, you have actualy all convinced me. I shall spread the word that r-comps are stupid, ghey and deadly to everyone I see threathning mankind with their evil tires. I will tell that guy with Porsche GT3 he should ditch his R-comps, so should the two Exige drivers. They'll say: but they came from the factory like that, and then I'll say: yeah, but the yanks from the RX-7 forum don't like em, so... They'll probably say: OK, if that is so I'll buy some Ling Longs.


Don't you guys see I only made an example to Tek that people DD the r-comps all day, so threadwearon a set of nice performance tires shouldn't be the reason to buy 20 dollar tires?

Riz.

F.T.P. rotaryrocket

what's a ling long?

clokker

iTrader: (2)

Oh, stuff and nonsense.
During the course of a normal day- all while staying within posted speed limits- a DD can see speeds ranging up to 75 mph and all sorts of variable road conditions.
Even the lowly street driver can tell the difference between a POS "Ling Long" tire (as Tofuman so charmingly calls them) and a tire that actually works.

Saying any properly inflated, treaded round thing is acceptable is just like saying that any shock that keeps the car off the ground is OK suspension for a DD.
If you really believe that, I have a set of 100k KYBs that you'd be interested in...

Your french fries must be truly wretched.

cmanns

The r comps i had were like 700 for a set, came with my old rims

Those tires were badass, I could beat a **** load of cars till about 3rd if I got the take off right

that brand new 350z with it's super wide tires caught better though

Tofuman FC3S

iTrader: (1)

A tire manufacturer I like to make fun of.

Riz.

KhanArtisT

iTrader: (2)

Right, maybe the person can tell the difference but anyone that doesn't care about performance could care less.

Even if you just drag race on the stock turbo and don't participate in any type of competition events, spending the money on nice tires will be the biggest waste. The people that daily drive their cars for example and occasionally "get on it", lol...

Roen

iTrader: (2)

What's wrong with a Bridgestone Potenza RE-11, Yokohama Advan Neova AD08, Dunlop Direzza Z1 Star Spec, Kumho Ecsta XS, Nitto NT-05 or Toyo Proxes R1R?

All are street tires with an immense amount of grip, are perfectly driveable in the rain (in fact, I can wager than in conditions with puddles, most of these tires will be faster and safer than the R888) You can still do the speed limit on a highway with any of those tires in the rain, that's something I can't say for any R-compound tires I know, especially since THERE'S A F'ING WARNING FROM THE NTHSA/DOT TO NEVER USE THESE TIRES (R-Compounds) ON THE HIGHWAY. But hey, what do I know about safety warnings?

While you never explicitly say an average FC owner should drive with R-Comps, a reasonable person can infer from the following statement that you're recommending buying and replacing R-comps on a frequent basis because "you can't drive your car safely, so it's a small price to pay."
It doesn't matter if you said it outright, it only matters if other people read into it, which is not cool, either. If you want us to understand your position, you should probably restate it in a clearer form.

Once again, there's absolutely no reason why you should move up to an R-compound tire when you can run those on the street. Those street tires mentioned above will give you all the grip you ever should want on the street, and on the track, are usually within 2 seconds on a one minute lap, but with triple the treadwear. They will also provide an extra margin of safety for all weather conditions, since R-comps are much more temperature sensitive than the best street summer tires. Seriously, only posers would use R-comps on their DD's. People who own cars with R-compounds from the factory are excluded, but how many of those cars are DD's? Owning a car that only comes with R-Compounds from the factory is a different problem altogether, such as: I wonder how many of those cars do well in snow?

BLUE TII

iTrader: (9)

Only reason to use a DOT R on the street is if it actually makes your car safer on the street or they last longer.

For instance, if you get wheelspin in 5th gear roll on and you cannot go wider on the tire you may want to go to DOT Rs.

That or when street tires don't last as long as DOT Rs because wheelspin is always wearing them out. I was getting 3,000miles out of 200 treadwear street tires and got 15,000miles out of RA-1s.

My experience with DOT Rs is Toyo RA-1 is the best for daily driving. At full tread height they are used as a race rain tire, so they have excellent wet traction. They do not heat cycle out. The tread squirm inherent in their design quickly heats the tire to sticky even with easy highway driving. They are quiet and they are VERY predictable at the limit with large slip angles.

Their downsides are they are a bit squirmy at full tread height so turn in and limit traction is a bit numb.

In addition, when pavement temps drop below ~40deg F they cannot warm up with normal driving and the usual super grip is not there- which can catch you off guard when you are used to super grip.

jdmsuper7

iTrader: (1)

I didn't really intend that as a personal attack, just a general remark on the dumb kids I've seen asking about V710s or something for their "touging" and such. There is such a small margin of error on R comps, and the speeds needed to push them are so high that it is simply dangerous on the street. I've spun my car so fast that I don't even have time to try to save it enough times that I've gained a serious respect for how quickly they can let go, even in a competition setting with most of the variables you'd see on the street taken out of the equation.

As to the R888s, its the constant heat cycling of DD'ing them that will wear them out, not having them sit in the yard.

eage8

iTrader: (9)

I agree with pretty much everyone here that running R-comps on the street is dumb. BlueTII did have some good exceptions though, but you definitely shouldn't be daily driving cars like that to begin with...

Any extreme summer is going to be more than anyone needs on the street anyway. if you actually use r-comps for I don't know... racing? than you should get another set of wheels anyway so you don't wear out your race tires before you need to use them...

My next set of tires (hopefully my current tires last until spring) are going to be Kumho XSs (which my fiancee daily drives in the summer and says they do quite well in the rain...) mostly because they're the only good extreme performance summer that's available in a 275 on 17s.

And I actually auto-x my car... (weird right?)

Korsch_RS

Back on topic, tires are the second most important part of the car.

The absolute BEST way to make your car faster (and any vehicle that you ever drive for the rest of your life) is to learn to drive.

Seriously, I've been to Skip Barber twice, best thing I've ever done for my driving and my car. I had been to several autocrosses before my first Skip Barber class in CT, and I thought I knew how to drive. Totally wrong. Average speed on my favorite road back home increased by ~5mph, from 35 to 40mph. That's a huge increase in speed, and that carries to any vehicle that I ever stick my butt into, for the rest of my life.

Now that's bang for the buck.

PvillKnight7

iTrader: (16)

40mph! Slow down Skip! You should drive for F1 or something

Korsch_RS

ha, it's a tight road.

OT, are you on a FSAE team? that looks like a FSAE car in your avatar

Tofuman FC3S

iTrader: (1)

Nothing is wrong with them. They are very nice tires.

That was reply to Tek who was saying performance tires are a waste of money if you don't use them for performance driving. He was complaining about how quickly they wear out, without useing them to the max. I said if they wear out you just buy new ones, cause tires are important. As an example I gave a reference to some people I know who drive R-comps not driven to the max all the time without complaining, cause good tires in good condition again are important.

If you wanna read that as saying every FC should have r-comps, then fine. But don't tell me what I implied with it.

So here is my problem with you. I never said anyone should run r-comps, even though you accuse me of that. However you are saying people shouldn't, without looking at their wishes, circumstances, personalities, laws, money, weather types, etc.

As I said, I know this guy in the GT3, he dd's his car for most of the time, and only uses his Cayenne when he is getting sick of the stiff ride (older fellow). The Exige guy lives in LA, I know him through a forum I used to run years back, and he 50/50 it with his Cooper S. The last Exige one uses it in weekends tho.

About snow: It classifies as special weather conditions, along with heavy rain, hail and such things. People by law have to adjust their driving style to weather conditions and their vehicles capabilities. If you are driving around as normal in the midle of a blizzard as if nothing is wrong because you ahppen to have high performance tires, you're an idiot. There are plenty of people who think they can do so and not crash because of their ABS/STM/TRC systems on their car. I doubt you are one of them? Those tires and systems on their own won't safe you if you don't adjust to the situation yourself, but as I said, I think you already knew that.

It's just that most people buy these cars for those moments they can enjoy them, and good tires (not neccecairely r-comps) help enjoying the ride. For all those other times super extreme grip isn't that important, but good safe grip is. $20 tires won't provide that, nor will they bring fun when driving ahrd (unless you drift). There are always pro's and con's, and the con's of r-comps aren't realy that big (especialy if you are a decent driver). I would hawever advise on a nice set of high performance tires for most people on here, and in some cases r-comps would work out great, but never ever advise Ling Long Nang Kang pieces of ****. It's different from person to person, but there is a lower limit in my oppinion.

I know what you mean, still I don't think it's that bad. I know for maximum potention you should have em shaved and run them only once, but that's on track. On street they won't perform to the max, but I feel they do OK with wearing out. I dunno about Advan AO48, cause I only know the softer compound, but I think R888 are more usable on street, even though Exiges coem with Advans.

Riz.

ericgrau

iTrader: (1)

Performance tires are the cheapest way to get traction in the short run, but by far the most expensive in the long run. IMO get some tires with decent enough grip but last a long time, say enough to have a tread life warranty. Right now the top rated performance tire (but not ultra high performance tire) at Consumer Reports is the H-rated Michelin Primacy MXV4. It has good traction, good tread life, good gas mileage, and sells for an estimated $120 per tire. Or there's the V-rated Michelin Pilot Exalto A/S with better braking but worse tread life and bad gas mileage. CR estimates $125 per tire for it.

For a much better bang-for-the-bunk in the long run, address the shocks and springs. Especially the shocks if yours are worn out. These are what hold the tires firmly against the road.

papiogxl

iTrader: (6)

I actually just picked a couple primacy's up for the front of my FC. $80 for 2 from a buddy, 1 is brand new and the other 8/10. But I need to get the car running before I can do any reviewing.

I loved my Falken FK451's. They've been replaced by the 452's which I've heard are even better. Pulling 1.8 60's in the rain is an incredible feeling. Tread life was pretty decent considering my alignment what way out of whack and I still got 15k plus out of them.

Bunchies

iTrader: (1)

This is a seriously broad statement that I'm sure many people could disprove. And they do ok in very light snow with 500hp. If you act reasonable.

Roen

iTrader: (2)

R-compounds in snow? Really? You're seriously arguing that a car with R-Compounds (forget the fact that it's 500 hp, that makes it worse) does ok for any sort of transportation at a reasonable speed (i.e. not 5 mph) in light snow? If you get any sort of slight snow buildup with summer tires, which take less heat to work right than R-Compounds, you'll be barely moving, if at all.

All-seasons do well in light snow. An actual snowstorm will slow you down tremendously, unless you get a decent pair of winter tires. Even then, a car that's too low will still have trouble if you get snow that builds up.

I currently am in Canada. My definition of light snow will clearly be different than others from more temperate climates. I invite you to drive up in a 500 hp car with R-Compounds to experience a light snowstorm here. I seriously doubt that even summer tires will be able to get enough heat in them to work properly, if at all.

Personally, I prefer to be able to drive at least 55 mph safely in all weather conditions that do not impact visibility. Blizzards and torrential rains, I'll slow down for, but with heavy snow buildup on the interstates, I'd prefer to at least be going 55 - 60 mph if traffic is not bad.

Regardless, there seems to be too many disadvantages (cost, treadwear, limiting weather conditions) for the average, rational person to want to DD with R-Compounds. A set of summers and a set of winters would get you through any expected weather condition, and give you more than enough grip to boot. Like jdmsuper7 said, if you're exceeding the grip level of an Extreme Performance Summer Tire on the street, you probably deserve to get your license suspended for one of many traffic violations.

Pele

iTrader: (28)

Very few people have touched on a topic that I think is pretty important to the original topic of this thread... Key point is that the OP has not specified what tires or wheels he's planning on purchasing.

Many have said that it's an upgrade, some say that it's the best bang for the buck. But consider that it could potentially be a downgrade.



There is a brand of wheels that's lightweight. In fact, it's a little TOO lightweight.. Hondas were bending them on hard drag launches. I'd say you should ONLY bend a wheel by doing something absofuckingloutely retarded. Now you can say what you want about Hondas and Drag Racing, but the fact remains that if you're bending wheels SOLELY using the engine's power and the tire's traction, something's VERY VERY WRONG. I forget which manufacturer is was... Rota? König?

Even light brushes with the curb would that would otherwise cause curb rash to the rim would cause the rim/spokes/hub to crack and possibly separate.


Another thing I don't think anyone's touched on is the effect that offset and subsequently a change in track width will change the characteristics of the car. If you run around like some people here (Not generalizing on race) that have the wheels sticking out a foot past the edge of the fender, you'll put that much extra load on the suspension.


Tires are not just round, black rubber things. They're pretty complex. Even changes in pressure can make the car feel way different.


OP, what are you doing with the car? Autocross, Road Racing, Drag, Drift, Daily Driver, or is it a mix of either?
You're in New York... Do you drive this car all year around or do you have another car for bad weather? If you drive this car in poor weather, do you have any interest in getting two sets of wheels? (One for summer use, one for winter use.)

Do you live in the city? Low profile tires will not take kindly to potholes curbs, and the like.

Give us a little more info so we can help you out.
To answer your original question, Yes. Tires DO affect performance. Even changing the pressure in your existing tires will change the car.
They can both positively impact and negatively impact the performance of the car.

As stated above, you don't want to run an R-Compound tire in the wet or snow.


Some key points to look at in tires:

Treadwear rating: This is how soft or hard the rubber is. Soft rubber will stick to the road better, but it will also wear out faster. Hard Rubber will last longer, but it will not stick to the pavement as well

Load and Speed rating: (It's the numbers after the size... You see stock tires as 205-60R15 then you'll see like 86H or something...)
A higher rating means more reinforcement in the sidewall for strength at speed and for carrying heavier weight... Some tires are rated at over 120 MPH. Now this does not mean you always need to go 120 MPH, but the bonus is that the tire will have a stiffer sidewall, and will handle a bit better as there will be less sidewall flex.

If the tire is rated at 80 MPH, you can still go faster, but it won't feel as good as it's a lot softer in the sidewalls.

BLUE TII

iTrader: (9)

I know we have gone off on a tangent from the original posters thread on DOT-R tires, but I just want to clear a few things up.

You know, having been somone who has daily driven on DOT-Rs for over a year and still driving on the street on DOT-Rs.

First- you will not find a better street legal tire for the rain than a DOT-R rain tire.

The best would obviously be something very rain race focused like a WV710, but that cannot survive dry conditions or daily driving heat cycles.

Toyo RA-1 is used as a rain race tire unshaved and will best any all weather tire in the rain as stated before it does not heat cycle out and will last ~10- 15,000miles of daily driviing.

Look if all seasons worked better in the rain than DOT-R rain tires race teams would USE them to race in the rain.

Second point, snow on DOT-Rs

Don't do it. Something like the RA-1 with good tread is passable in ligh snow, but DOT-Rs are made of a soft rubber that will crack in freezing temperatures. The manufacturers has warnings to keep tires above freezing temperares in use and storage. Light snow that doesn't stick because ground is too warm and they will get you home- more than that and you are pushing your luck.

Third point

A 500HP or above turbo car is MUCH easier to drive in traction limited conditions because they will be making NA power up to 3,000rpm or above.

A real beast to drive in limited traction conditions is a very fast spooling car like stock FD sequentials with all supporting mods or very small responsive singles. These make boost the moment you touch the gas no matter what RPM you are at and you get torque.