The Griffin

What wheel/tire size are you running 16's,17's,or 18's on the street with the tein flex's?

BLUE TII

iTrader: (9)

I have had the FLT-A2 for the past 5 years and daily drive/ race it.

When I was on 225 wide max perf (200 treadwear) tires it was a bit "drifty" with the 7/5 springs the coilovers come with.

When I was on 225 wide DOT R tires (100 treadwear) it was perfect as you could still drift with a flick, but it was easier to keep it at the edge of grip.

Now on 245 wide DOT R it feels great on the street and can still be drifted with pronounced feint motion if you are really ballsy, but it bottoms the front suspension on the course at times (lowered 1.5" from stock). The tire rubs the top of the fender liner.

Now, I have stock TII sway bars still that I need to be upgrading from and it will be back to perfect. I hope.

So, in conclusion- pick your spring rates based on your tire grip level and what sway bar you have.

Red_Rabbit86

hey so did the guy who got the max CO's did you write your opinion on them yet with some pics?

Black91n/a

I'm running 225/45/17 Bridgestone RE070's on the street with an RB front and stock rear bar, a little under 2.0 degrees front camber and about 1.3 in the rear (tire temps say that I can take a little out). It's just a little bit understeery like that, but with tire pressure and more alignment fiddling it can easily change. Same sort of balance with the 225/50/15 Hankook Z211 R's.

Sideview_S13

Are you running the standard flex (twin-tube) or mono-flex (inverted). If you have the means to have them revalved call up tein and tell them the exact means of what you plan to do. The off-the-shelf valving is different then if you notified them you would be tracking the car on a regular basis. Tein/Zeal/Apex'i provide this service when you order directly when you order from them

Black91n/a

Standard twin tube Flex, I don't think the Monotube is available yet, and it certainly wasn't when I bought mine.

You really only need to get them re-valved if you're going to change the spring rates more than +/- 2kg/mm, otherwise it's well within the available adjustment range and getting them revalved is just a wasted expense. The stock valving is pretty good right out of the box.

13bchris

So has anyone had the KTS's? And what about the Tein Super Drifts. I know Kevin (45D) has them but anyone else? I know they are stiff 8kg/9kg.

Black91n/a

I'm 99% sure that the Super Drifts are just re-badged Flex's. All the same features with a slightly different spring rate, should be good.

lax-rotor

iTrader: (1)

+1, there's some subtle differences in the packaging (IE paint vs. powder coat) as well as the stiffer spring rate. It has the exact same features of the Flex, so I'd be willing to bet that the valving is almost, if not, identical to the Flex. I was debating on getting the superdrifts, but opted not to after considering those who have more experience with suspension set ups. I do not plan on tracking the car more than I daily drive so having stiffer spring rates has no benefite for me (at least not yet). However for the price difference it's a good deal if you plan on doing more track events than your average joe.

lax-rotor

iTrader: (1)

Just received the Flex's in the mail today (Thanks Jason!). I'll be posting the installation and other pictures of them in my project thread. I will attempt a review of them later down the line for future generations (aka the noobs who want the uber drifto/drag/daily package coilovers).

First impressions, very high quality. Well made. Little bit heavy (But I don't know how heavy compared to stock), but heavy enough to through my back out again (I pulled a muscle playing basketball three days ago. Don't ask). The stock springs are 7/5 and I've been told those would be too soft for any benefit but I'm thinking it will be plenty hard for my needs at the moment. I'll record a review of them in about a month, 6 months, and a year (if I can remember). But there ya go.

Black91n/a

Actually the stock rates are 6/5, I had to change the front springs to get to 7/5, but 6/5 will work ok with a large front bar and no rear for ok balance. I wanted it to be a little more stable and have the option of running a rear bar to adjust the balance, so I went one stiffer in front. They're NOT SOFT, people think that because they're softer than the other overly stiff crap out there that they'll be soft. The fact is that they're around 3x as stiff as stock.

Here's a picture of me at the track running 225/50/15 race tires in the middle of a corner, and as you can see there's not exactly an excess of body roll. Especially if running street tires you'll get more grip out of a softer setup as it's better able to follow uneven surfaces and with stiffer stuff you'll skip over them and have less grip.

I'm very happy with my Flex's, they're a really good entry level setup.

STIFFER DOESN'T EQUAL BETTER!

LaMAr09

I would love to see pics of everyones setups.. How low they go, whats perfect setup for handling all that.

lax-rotor

iTrader: (1)

I stand very much corrected about the spring rates. Excuse me (I wonder where I got the 7 from... probably from reading your post previous).

Wezzmo

**** everyone on here..

go grab some coilies 9/7s , lower then as far as they'll go and git the track.!

i have had cusco 9/7s in my car for ages, no problem on the street.

Roen

iTrader: (2)

you wouldn't say that if you drove in the roads here in new york. Then again, I like not having a sore back when I get out of the car.

7/5 is all you need, that's what the ITS racers run on their track cars. Unless your cars are overly heavy or need to slow your weight transfer down that much at the risk of skipping your tires, then yeah, go run overly stiff 9/7 rates.

I guess people in Australia don't know anything about how lowering affects the roll center of the car, or that body roll is still there, even if it isn't visible.

Wezzmo

haha, come to perth and see our road then say that... i bottom out going down the freeway ... i compete at a track in a country town about 3hours out of perth, that had gravel roads leading into it... (i dont trailer my car anywhere)

9/7 is fine....

boohoo.. roll centre/ body roll... who gives a ****... i am out on the track having fun... how many arm chair critics on here regularly hit the track ?? not shitty motorkhna stuff either...

lax-rotor

iTrader: (1)

And you sir are an idiot. You put un-needed stress upon a unibody and even describe your setup as crap. Thank you for such a good post. I'll let the more seasoned members deal with you.

Wezzmo

How is my post crap,

OP wanted to know if coilies are ok for daily drivers... which I said they are... I drive a FC with cusco coilovers 9kg/mm front and 7kg/mm rears on shitty perth roads without a problem...

I am sick arm chair critics that seem to have no idea, crapping on about roll centre, body roll, when 99% of people on here probably wont be able to tell the difference..

Id bet that my suspension is more developed than most cars on here....., who here has actually race their fc? and developed their suspensions setups. wheels alignments, etc?

88Turbodreamz

STANCE x2 my buddy works for them and i live like a mile away from their factory. Saves me from shipping, also good product imo

lax-rotor

iTrader: (1)

So you don't mind bottoming out your car on the Freeway? You don't mind putting un-needed stress on the car? Sounds like just the setup I want for a daily driven vehicle!

Wezzmo

sigh... I dont always bottom out everywhere... but there are places where my kit used to bottom out going down the freeway.. (the gaps when you go over bridges mostly) and no it didnt bother me... I actually have just put 18s on and I dont seem to bottom out anymore just from the change in rolling diameter.

how am i putting un-needed stress on my car?

Black91n/a

So it sounds like you're running street tires on the track. The fact is that people with race tires are running and winning on setups that are softer than yours, so with less grip on street tires you're running much stiffer than ideal.

I'm no arm chair racer. I take my car to the track and I crew for a GT3 class BMW and helped set up the suspension on that car using my knowledge gained from studying engineering and from extensive suspension research. With my help he set new personal best times and was happier than ever with the way the car performed.

Who cares about roll center, and that sort of thing? Suspension engineers care, serious racers care, and why, because it's important and makes a difference to how fast you can go, and that's what matters to racers.

lax-rotor

iTrader: (1)

Alright... Prior to you upgrading your rim size you were bottoming out. You were damaging your car while doing normal driving. You lowered the car excessively (and I am not aware of your setup specifics) but do you have you camber in spec? or are you wearing your tires un-evenly? I don't know what tires you have on there, but is it safe to assume they're just street tires?

Assuming you kept the same final diameter of the tire you now have less compliance in the rubber, bigger solid rims, and excessively firm springs. Accurate description of your setup?

The un-needed stress comes in your choice of those things. Individually they all have their place and provide certain benifit in certain situations, however you have reduced the absorbing qualities of your car (the tires, the spings/struts, possibly bushings?). This means that all the force of your car coming down is transfering from the road to your unibody structure with minimal dampening. Two things are happening, 1 you're jarring yourself (but that's personal preference) and 2 you're putting un-needed stress upon the unibody itself. Over time this may fatigue the already old chasis.

Am I making sense? Granted you'd have to hit some nasty pot holes, hit the unibody itself on some crag, etc. To see these things develop quickly, however given time you may want to either strengthen your unibody, or check/repair the structure itself.

Granted that is a worst case scenario, but why put avoidable stress onto the chasis? It just doesn't seem like a wise choice to me for daily driving.

This however does not mean that excessively firm coilovers are bad, they have their place. I just wouldn't run them on a daily driver.

(Now it's time to be ripped apart)

Black91n/a

I don't think the whole issue of unneeded stress is really important, the car can take it. It's annoying for the driver, which is a bigger issue. But the biggest is that it's loosing grip compared to a softer setup from skipping over bumps where a softer setup would conform to the uneven pavement.

unicorn_squad

here's the thing....

he doesn't care.

his setup does what what he wants it to do, and he's fine with it. he's not trying to win any races. he's just out there to have fun, and the suspension he has lets him do that just fine...

what the hell is so hard to understand about that?


as far as 9/7 springs on the street...
its not that bad. I drove my car down to albuquerquie (from denver, about 8 hour drive), and had no issues, and have driven it on the street many times, never with any issues of the suspension being too stiff. even with a fiberglass racing bucket, I'm still quite comfortable when I get out of the car(other than the heat)... although I'm not 50 years old like some of you.
sure, it doesn't ride like a mercedes, but its not that bad.