best hot start method?
02-15-02, 02:55 PM
#26
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when I hot start it, i always havto tap the gas a lil bit. but i hate doing that because then i havto keep my foot on the gas at all times to keep it idling, if i dont it will simply die. my car idles like every once and a while but i havto watch it for stop signs and lights so the clutch always goes in earlier. and somtimes when i come to the light and its about to stall i tap the gas @ 350rpm and it stays alive, somtiems it doesnt. any reasons for this ? btw my compression is low as hell 54psi 73psi
02-15-02, 06:38 PM
#27
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Hmmmmm
JUST SOME IDEAS:
Did anyone look at the Mazdatrix fix? It does work for most start problems.......not all, but most. It's great for troubleshooting anyway.
http://www.mazdatrix.com/c-bleed.htm
I have never tried a switch although I thought about it. I'm sure it would work good. The "spring type" sounds like a great idea (as long as the switch is high quality and doesn't open with old age, which would be really bad at high boost or something).
The fuel-pump hold pressure causes old injectors to leak too.....even if they have been sent off to get cleaned and balanced. Check the fuel system hold pressure. If it drops really fast after the pump stops, then your injectors or fuel pump are leaking.
The computer is the other half of the problem since it is known to open the injectors too much at startup and it gives too much fuel (supposedly to keep the engine from getting vapor lock).
Also, the starters don't turn the motor fast enough for hot start on a rotary motor (a known issue at Mazda) and with the added problems of lower than new compression etc, etc, etc.......You just get TOO much fuel and not enough compression and spark to light it off.
Do the ECU fixes such as better (or more) grounds to the engine. The ECU ground is on the engine. The better grounds make a big difference on ALL the common RX7 problems.
I spent MANY hours and lots of $$ checking this problem on the cars that I have owned (2 FD's, 3 TII's, and 2 GXL's)
I now have no problems with my 87 TII, and it used to have the same startup problem. I have no switches or bleeds either. I do have an SX fuel pressure regulator though, and it lets the pressure off the system after the pump stops.
Good Luck!
Greg
Did anyone look at the Mazdatrix fix? It does work for most start problems.......not all, but most. It's great for troubleshooting anyway.
http://www.mazdatrix.com/c-bleed.htm
I have never tried a switch although I thought about it. I'm sure it would work good. The "spring type" sounds like a great idea (as long as the switch is high quality and doesn't open with old age, which would be really bad at high boost or something).
The fuel-pump hold pressure causes old injectors to leak too.....even if they have been sent off to get cleaned and balanced. Check the fuel system hold pressure. If it drops really fast after the pump stops, then your injectors or fuel pump are leaking.
The computer is the other half of the problem since it is known to open the injectors too much at startup and it gives too much fuel (supposedly to keep the engine from getting vapor lock).
Also, the starters don't turn the motor fast enough for hot start on a rotary motor (a known issue at Mazda) and with the added problems of lower than new compression etc, etc, etc.......You just get TOO much fuel and not enough compression and spark to light it off.
Do the ECU fixes such as better (or more) grounds to the engine. The ECU ground is on the engine. The better grounds make a big difference on ALL the common RX7 problems.
I spent MANY hours and lots of $$ checking this problem on the cars that I have owned (2 FD's, 3 TII's, and 2 GXL's)
I now have no problems with my 87 TII, and it used to have the same startup problem. I have no switches or bleeds either. I do have an SX fuel pressure regulator though, and it lets the pressure off the system after the pump stops.
Good Luck!
Greg
02-15-02, 07:38 PM
#28
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Originally posted by Powridah
when I hot start it, i always havto tap the gas a lil bit. but i hate doing that because then i havto keep my foot on the gas at all times to keep it idling, if i dont it will simply die. my car idles like every once and a while but i havto watch it for stop signs and lights so the clutch always goes in earlier. and somtimes when i come to the light and its about to stall i tap the gas @ 350rpm and it stays alive, somtiems it doesnt. any reasons for this ?
when I hot start it, i always havto tap the gas a lil bit. but i hate doing that because then i havto keep my foot on the gas at all times to keep it idling, if i dont it will simply die. my car idles like every once and a while but i havto watch it for stop signs and lights so the clutch always goes in earlier. and somtimes when i come to the light and its about to stall i tap the gas @ 350rpm and it stays alive, somtiems it doesnt. any reasons for this ?
btw my compression is low as hell 54psi 73psi
02-15-02, 08:21 PM
#29
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Originally posted by StarionX
Well, like everybody says, the kill switch solves the problem, so that's all I'm concerned about... and as for 'throwing' parts at it, I hear you! I spent CA$2500, which did nothing, then spent $10 on a switch, some wire, some connectors and bada bing bada bang... problem solved. It was a big relief not to have to lock the car and leave it idling while I went shopping, anymore (I guess I'm lucky I don't live in LA or NY... bye bye car!
)
Well, like everybody says, the kill switch solves the problem, so that's all I'm concerned about... and as for 'throwing' parts at it, I hear you! I spent CA$2500, which did nothing, then spent $10 on a switch, some wire, some connectors and bada bing bada bang... problem solved. It was a big relief not to have to lock the car and leave it idling while I went shopping, anymore (I guess I'm lucky I don't live in LA or NY... bye bye car!
)
I feel your pain. I spent about the same $$$ trying to fix the same problem on my 88 Turbo II. Compression is great, new injectors, new coils, wires, plugs, filters, etc, and it still won't start when its hot. 
I've been either pulling the fuse to get it started (at gas staions), left it locked and running like you (while running into a shop), or just let it cool off for an hour.
I'm going to install that switch. Actually I think I am going to make a fuel pump delay circuit so I won't have to mess with a switch.
Later,
Salguod
88 Turbo II
Melbourne, FL
02-15-02, 11:06 PM
#30
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Originally posted by Salguod
I'm going to install that switch. Actually I think I am going to make a fuel pump delay circuit so I won't have to mess with a switch.
I'm going to install that switch. Actually I think I am going to make a fuel pump delay circuit so I won't have to mess with a switch.
02-16-02, 08:20 AM
#31
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Originally posted by StarionX
The delay circuit sounds like a good idea, but is a bit of a waste when the engine is cold, because you would be delaying for no reason. Damned if you do, damned if you don't... sigh... Only one thing to do...
The delay circuit sounds like a good idea, but is a bit of a waste when the engine is cold, because you would be delaying for no reason. Damned if you do, damned if you don't... sigh... Only one thing to do...
Hmmm....well then I will have to design it so that it checks the engine temperature, and then checks the atmospheric pressure, and .........
Aw forget it..... I'll install a switch and grab a
like you suggested.Later,
Salguod
09-05-04, 02:03 PM
#32
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i have an '88 N/A with bigger ports, ported intake, TB, header, the usual, no sleeves, cleaned primary injectors, old sensors though. When hot, i have to floor it and then turn the key, it will usually start right up. It used to hickup, then start before I changed the plugs. the important part is holding the peddle on the floor intill it starts and revs. It only needs this when hot.
11-15-04, 04:56 PM
#34
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I BROUGHT THIS THREAD BACK FROM THE DEAD BECAUSE:
My other sweetie(TII) starts a bit rough and stall out unless I give it gas.......example: drove for 30 minutes, stopped for gas(or anything that requires me to turn the car off) and i restart it 1 minute later and it turns on but then dies, and it does this repeatedly unless I hold the gas pedal....once I am driving the idle jumps between "0" and 500 allmost wanting to stall......I thought it was a hot start problem but I am not sure..........
My other sweetie(TII) starts a bit rough and stall out unless I give it gas.......example: drove for 30 minutes, stopped for gas(or anything that requires me to turn the car off) and i restart it 1 minute later and it turns on but then dies, and it does this repeatedly unless I hold the gas pedal....once I am driving the idle jumps between "0" and 500 allmost wanting to stall......I thought it was a hot start problem but I am not sure..........
11-15-04, 05:44 PM
#35
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Originally Posted by scarysteve
What's the best hot start procedure to save embarrasment at service stations and other public places?
It's frustrating to have school kids laugh while you wish they would understand that rotaries are impossible to re-start once you've driven half a mile!
Foot on the floor until it turns over? Little bursts of key? Whatever I do, it always seems to take 5 minutes to start.
Are the Turbos and S3 RXs the same, or is it just the NA?
Steve
It's frustrating to have school kids laugh while you wish they would understand that rotaries are impossible to re-start once you've driven half a mile!
Foot on the floor until it turns over? Little bursts of key? Whatever I do, it always seems to take 5 minutes to start.
Are the Turbos and S3 RXs the same, or is it just the NA?
Steve
Turn the igintion and you'll hear it turn over, keep it turning over and give it just a TINY bit of gas, you dont want to flood it, I put it down maybe half an inch and it starts up fine now when I do that.
11-15-04, 06:17 PM
#36
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landers installed a kill switch for me to help with rebuild flooding issues .... has worked great ... i mean if you think about it .. it HAS to work ..
you kill the pump/injectors, and it will burn the fuel already in there,
when mine was flooding (due to the rebuild), i would flip the kill switch .. the car would start right up, and then before it would die i would just flip the swtich back to the on position, and it would stay alive just fine ... the switch is the cheapest way to get rid of the flooding
you kill the pump/injectors, and it will burn the fuel already in there,
when mine was flooding (due to the rebuild), i would flip the kill switch .. the car would start right up, and then before it would die i would just flip the swtich back to the on position, and it would stay alive just fine ... the switch is the cheapest way to get rid of the flooding
11-15-04, 07:46 PM
#38
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If the hot start is caused by flooding, why isn't there a problem when the car is cold? Shouldn't the engine still be flooded? I didn't think rotaries unflooded themselves from just sitting for a period of time.
11-15-04, 09:16 PM
#39
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Originally Posted by 1931-smooth7
I BROUGHT THIS THREAD BACK FROM THE DEAD BECAUSE:
My other sweetie(TII) starts a bit rough and stall out unless I give it gas.......example: drove for 30 minutes, stopped for gas(or anything that requires me to turn the car off) and i restart it 1 minute later and it turns on but then dies, and it does this repeatedly unless I hold the gas pedal....once I am driving the idle jumps between "0" and 500 allmost wanting to stall......I thought it was a hot start problem but I am not sure..........
My other sweetie(TII) starts a bit rough and stall out unless I give it gas.......example: drove for 30 minutes, stopped for gas(or anything that requires me to turn the car off) and i restart it 1 minute later and it turns on but then dies, and it does this repeatedly unless I hold the gas pedal....once I am driving the idle jumps between "0" and 500 allmost wanting to stall......I thought it was a hot start problem but I am not sure..........
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