HAILERS

Something is wrong with this picture.

Key to ON. Pull the small plug off the ECU. The green/red..........green/black.......green/white.......light green wires should have batt voltage. The same wire out of the Main Relay that feeds the coils, feeds those fuel injector wires. What do you have on those wires?

If you have a solenoid resistor package about a foot below the air filter/afm, pull its large round plug off, and check for batt voltage on the harness side of the plug. Should have batt voltage on the pin in the middle of the plug. Same wire that feeds the coils. With the exception of a ORANGE elec plug inbetween.

I think you need to try that other Main relay or cut up two pieces of wire and do the jumper job I took a picture of.

The jpg I attached in the post waaay above does not show the solenoid resistor package, because the dwg came from a 88 FSM.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

Hmm, discovered something today. Somehow in the process of pulling the engine and putting it back in, my little bunch of ground wires under the trailing coil disappeared! Think that could have anything to do with it?

HAILERS

The last time I looked, the ground for the Main Relay is there. The ground for the headlights is there, the ground for the water temp switch is there, the ground for the neutral switch is there, the ground for the check connector is there, the ground for the air bypass relay is there. And others.

That said, it isn't a given that if JC-01 is disconnected those items won't be grounded.

Like the fuel pump gnd (25) is at the right rear corner of the car. You unbolt it. Guess what. The pump still runs. Because it's daisey chained to another ground point up front (9).
'
In post #18, I made honorable mention of the ground wire for the Main Relay.

Then again, if the four wire connector of the Main Relay is jumpered like the jpg I attached, then no ground would be needed to supply power to the ECU, injectors and coils. And the coil assy's themselves get grounded thru their metal base being bolted to the chassis. So those grounds at JC-01 wouldn't be required for power to the coil assy (jumpers installed).

Yeah, reinstall JC-01. There's a jpg of the gnd points on the car attached and what they do in life.

HAILERS

Just in case: that JC-01 does have to be installed for the Main Relay to pull in. But at the same time you can see what I was driving at. You can see how (5) will still get a gnd even if JC-01 isn't plugged in. It'll still get a gnd from JC-02. Same can be said of (6). See jpg attached above for the gnd diagram.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

Sigh...

ECU - Has NO power on GREEN/RED, I couldn't find GREEN/BLUE, voltage jumps from 2VDC to 12VDC all over the place on GREEN/WHITE, and nothing on light green.

NO power going to the Solenoid middle connector on the harness.

Swapped MAIN relays, nothing changed. Getting .5VDC to the white 2 pin connector for the LEADING coil.

Didn't try the jumper method yet, going to in a few.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

...

HAILERS

Did you install the jumper wires in the four hole Main Relay connector yet?

Still, since you installed the MAIN RELAY ground, does the Main Relay now click when the key is put to ON??? What you could do, if unsure, pull the four wire connector off the Main Relay but leave the two wire plug on that relay. Key to ON. Now go to the Main Relay and pull it's two wire plug off then put it back on. When you put it back on it should click. Does it?

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

Did not try the jumper yet, it's been raining all day. Will do it in a little when the rain calms down.

I did not get to install the ground connector by the trailing coils, I need to find it, not sure where it ran off too.

Would the main relay be the cause of no power to the pins on the small connector on the ECU? And also the solenoid resistor?

HAILERS

Yeah. The MAIN RELAY sends power from the two EGI fuses to the coils and on to the ECU's small plug and also to the Solenoid Resistor. It passes thru the solenoid resistor package and feeds the fuel injectors, and goes thru the fuel injectors to the small plug on the ECU. So, the small plug on the ECU should have power on the light green wire, light green/red, light green/black, light green/white wires.

What 'cha could do, is install all plugs including the main relay. Key to ON. Now with a piece of wire bare at each end, put one end of that wire in one of the sockets the JC-01 plug. Touch the other end to a good ground. Keep moving the bare wire to each socket til the Main Relay clicks. THAT would be the ground wire for the Main Relay and you could jury rig somthing knowing that so the Main Relay will pull in when you go to ON.

Then again, the two wire jumper should also do the trick.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

Alright, Ill try that. So you think the MAIN relay is not getting grounded for some reason?

I'll do both of those tests tonight and see if I can get anything.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

More updates

MAIN relay - on the 4 pin connector, only getting 2.4VDC to the BLACK/WHITE wire, and .5VDC on the BLACK/YELLOW wire.

Jumper method did nothing.

Tried the unplug 4 pi, key to on, unplug 2 pin plug back in, nothing, no click.

HAILERS

Are you real SURE your getting batt voltage to the four wire MAIN RELAY plug?

If you pull that plug off the Main Relay, two of those wires should have batt voltgage on them. The Green/Black and the White/Blue.

The power flows just like the redline in my jpg that's attached. IF there is batt power on the B/G wire coming from the engine bay fuse box, then you should be able to jumper b/t the B/G and the B/Y wire of the Main Relay plug and ....walla, power shows up at those other places i.e. the small, white plug of the Lead coil and at the solenoid resistor and if it's plugged in, at the four wires at the small plug of the ECU.

I don't know what to say. There's NO plugs inbetween the coil plug and the Main Relay. So I"ve come to the conclusion that there's NO power on the G/B wire at the Main Relay. Either that or it can't be fixed from this end of the internet.


The power for the MAIN RELAY works like this. The Main Relay has a ground on it's coil all the time if wired per the FSM. What pulls it in, is you turning the key to ON. That sends power from the key to the interior fuse box and the line of fuses labled IG1 and IG2. The ENGINE fuse is on IG1 row of fuses. Power goes thru that fuse to the Main Relays coil and the relay now pulls in.

So it SEEMS you missing that power also since the Main Relay does not pull in.

Which brings up the subject.........does anything happen if you put the key to ON??? To START???? If nothing is happening, then your missing the power to the ignition switch from the engine bay fuse box.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

when I put the key to on all my lights works, a buzzer goes off(water temp I think), a constant beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep, when I put it to start the engine turns over but I get no spark and no fuel.

I AM getting 12VDC to the OTHER 2 wires that I didn't not mention above on the 4 pin in main relay connector.

HAILERS

Well, darn. It sounds like most things are working. When you say all lights work, I assume you mean the WARNING lights in the dash are all coming on Red.???

If the Warning lights are coming on, that means the ignition key is feeding the interior fuse box which means the ENGINE fuse should be getting power and sending it to the black/white wire in the two wire plug of the Main Relay.

So you've got power to the two wires in the four wire plug of the Main Relay. So that means when you jumpered that plug, the coils and the fuel injectors (solenoid resistor package) should be getting batt voltage. Mystery to me as to why not.

I THINK your not getting the fuel pump to come on due to a lack of a ground to the circuit opening relay. That bundle of grounds you found not connected, supplys a gnd to the Circuit Opening Relay (memory here).

To kinda prove that, jumper the yellow two socket fuel pump check connector. Key to ON. Fuel pump should be heard to run continuosly. If not, then most likely the ground for that circuit opening relay is missing.

But another thing that will keep the pump from running and the Main Relay from pulling in, is the ENGINE fuse in the interior fuse box being blown. You really need to find a way to ground all those ground points in that JC-01 plug under the Trail coils assy. But heck, if you did the jumper job like in my jpg, then those gnds would not be a player.

Next time you check the black/yellow wire in the white, two socket Lead coil plug, put your ground wire on the batt neg post so you'll know that you've found a good ground spot.

The only other thing I can think of, is if you don't have power to the coils with the jumpers in, is that SOMETHIHNG is pulling the voltage down. Maybe disconnect some plugs. I'd disconnect the two ORANGE PLUGS in the passengers foot well and look again at the coil plug.

I've no real idea why you lose power b't the Main relay and the coil plug. It's only two feet and no connectors inbetween.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

Yeah my WARNING lights all work, everything in the interior works perfect. I can hear the circuit opening relay click if I hold the AFM flap open, but that doesn't make my fuel pump work.

Power to both sides of the fuse block, power to main relay, but only 2-3VDC to the pump AND the LEADING coil.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

I'm going to see if I can find that ground point connector. Do you have a picture of what it looks like, JC-01?

HAILERS

Well pooh. That's a good sign about the Warning lights.

Pushing the afm vane aft and hearing the click is a good sign.

That's really odd to me, because the ENGINE fuse feeds the coil on the Circuit Opening Relay. And that must be good since the relay clicks. But that same power that pulls the relay in, feeds the pump itself. Odd that it does not.

On a series four the BLUE wire at the pump is the fuel pump power., On a series five it's a blue/green something wire. But yours is series four so it's blue. Huh. 2-3 volt. So something is there. Do the waring lights ttay bright when you push the afm vane aft with key to ON?????

Did you install some new harness. I think you did. Too lazy to re-read this thread.

Same series car?

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

88 harness, 87 body, everything is S4, and everything engine related is NA.

HAILERS

I'll look tonight, but I seem to remember there's some differences in the 88 vs 87 harnesses.

HAILERS

***Check the main fuses, all good. The car is a S4 T2 with a S4 NA engine in it, T2 drive train, NA running gear(ECU, EFI harness, atmospheric sensor, pressure sensor, AFM, etc.)********************************************* ***

I might be dense. The 88 harness........what part of the harness is 88? Just the EM harness that attaches to the engine and ECU? Or some other harness are from the 88?

The 88 models don't/didn't have a solenoid resistor package is one reason I ask. So maybe you mean another harness is from the 88????

A 87 non turbo jpg attached showing solenoid resistor package etc.

I think I'd pull apart both ORANGE plugs on the EM harness and then go back and look at the black/yellow wire on the Lead coil assy with key ON. See if the voltage has now gone up to something acceptable. Won't solve the whole problem. Just looking for clues.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

The engine harness(injector clips, BAC, CAS connectors, etc. etc.) is from a 88. Body harness is from my s4 T2. ECU is 88 NA, pressure sensor(engine bay and kick panel) both from a 88, AFM from a 88.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

And my 88 harness has the solenoid resister plug. Hmm.

HAILERS

Only cars built prior to June 87 used the solenoid resistor. Also maybe we're talking apples and oranges????? There's a Fuel Pump Resistor Relay on turbo cars located on the aft side of the bulkhead that the right headlight is attached to. Just in FRONT of the air filter assy.

The Solenoid Resistor Package is located about a foot below the air filter assy and is bolted to the fender. A jpg of it is attached. Unfortunatly the jpg is of the bottom of that item. Pay no attention to the red line part of the jpg. It was for another thread at another time in another universe.

You say you have the turbo body harness. I wonder if that includes the fuel pump resistor relay mounted to the bulkhead that the right headlight is attached to?????

I've a partial jpg of the Fuel Pump Resistor Relay. It's not mounted just right, but it's located in THAT area. Maybe the air filter has to be removed to see it on your car.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

I know the difference between the 2, and I deff have both.

w00t

iTrader: (-1)

I'll take some pictures and stuff if that will help