ATF supost to eat seals? yum
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12-21-07, 12:40 PM
#10
Hm...I used to be all anti-ATF 'till RotaryRessurection and Aaron Cake had a little row and Rotary showed me some proof...
The seal sitting in the ATF should swell and begin to deteriorate after a length of time. This is AaronCakes argument... However, using ATF to store your motor or dislodge a stuck seal should be fine, because the ATF will not be coming into contact with any seal that it could damage.
The seal sitting in the ATF should swell and begin to deteriorate after a length of time. This is AaronCakes argument... However, using ATF to store your motor or dislodge a stuck seal should be fine, because the ATF will not be coming into contact with any seal that it could damage.
12-21-07, 12:58 PM
#12
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I think The ATF should only come in contact with the seals if you put in where the oil goes. Putting it in the intake to allow it to enter the combustion area should not cause the rubber seal to become completely soak as it is when submerged.
As for the swelling, do you have a micrometer to measure the seal after its been soaked? You should measure it on a regluar basis to see the rate that it swells.
As for the swelling, do you have a micrometer to measure the seal after its been soaked? You should measure it on a regluar basis to see the rate that it swells.
12-21-07, 01:48 PM
#14
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its been sitting in atf for 5 days/
haft in the fluid and other haft not in the fluid, the seal looks fine. Im pretty sure even in 10 days it will look the same, so lets wait.
I think when you do atf trick on the car , the smoke car take a day to go away, maybe more since its in ur cats or in the mufflers.
haft in the fluid and other haft not in the fluid, the seal looks fine. Im pretty sure even in 10 days it will look the same, so lets wait.
I think when you do atf trick on the car , the smoke car take a day to go away, maybe more since its in ur cats or in the mufflers.
12-21-07, 02:46 PM
#16
Hmmm... Are there any benefits to using atf rather than mineral oil?
For the sake of building compression couldn't you use 75/90w gear oil? just put a few drops in the spark plug holes? Or would that create problems with spark or fouling?
Good experiment though, are you using viton oil rings or oem?
For the sake of building compression couldn't you use 75/90w gear oil? just put a few drops in the spark plug holes? Or would that create problems with spark or fouling?
Good experiment though, are you using viton oil rings or oem?
12-22-07, 10:55 AM
#18
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The exact effect will depend on the additive package you ATF uses.
I used Castrol several years ago to do something similar.
After a few days, the rings were swelled and felt a bit like elastics.
They remained like that for a few weeks, after which I put the whole thing away and forgot about it for a few months. After several months the rings turned to jelly and could be easily pulled apart.
I used Castrol several years ago to do something similar.
After a few days, the rings were swelled and felt a bit like elastics.
They remained like that for a few weeks, after which I put the whole thing away and forgot about it for a few months. After several months the rings turned to jelly and could be easily pulled apart.
12-22-07, 02:24 PM
#19
The problem with this experiment is that it is not accurate. Injecting ATF into your engine for storage or unflooding purposes will not soak the oil control rings. The ATF would have to penetrate both the corner and side seals as well as the metal oil control scrapers to get to the soft orings. So, this experiment really proves nothing, because the soft rings should never be sitting in ATF to begin with.
Obviously ATF will not hurt metal parts, but will in fact help lubricate them so this is a good thing.
Obviously ATF will not hurt metal parts, but will in fact help lubricate them so this is a good thing.
12-22-07, 03:06 PM
#20
The mystery of the prize.
The problem with this experiment is that it is not accurate. Injecting ATF into your engine for storage or unflooding purposes will not soak the oil control rings. The ATF would have to penetrate both the corner and side seals as well as the metal oil control scrapers to get to the soft orings. So, this experiment really proves nothing, because the soft rings should never be sitting in ATF to begin with.
Obviously ATF will not hurt metal parts, but will in fact help lubricate them so this is a good thing.
Obviously ATF will not hurt metal parts, but will in fact help lubricate them so this is a good thing.
If the cause is a stuck seal from carbo buildup, like a side seal with tired springs then it's not going to be sealing which is probably why the person is trying ATF as a last resort. On a tired motor the oil control rins do not seal well either because of the stepped wear on the side housing...
it's probably not a good idea to soak a tired motor with ATF in an attempt to rejuvinate it for these reasons.
12-22-07, 03:45 PM
#21
Even with no side seals at all, the metal oil control ring scrapers are still there and sit tightly against the iron face. The ATF fluid would take the path of least resistance and simply drain down/around the orings. Not to mention there is already lots of motor oil residue coating the oil orings and everything inside that area to protect them.
I've taken apart plenty of motors stored with atf and there is never any inside the oil control ring scrapers. Who else here can offer that experience? Other than perhaps Chris Sanders, I doubt there is anyone else that posts regularly on this forum who has torn down as many cores as I have. I have built over 300 engines (obviously I have torn down that many cores) plus I have probably torn down 100 extra cores that I have bought myself for my parts shelf.
I do not post this information solely because I am a proponent of using ATF. I post it because this is what I have observed, and that has reinforced my prior views on the use of atf.
I've taken apart plenty of motors stored with atf and there is never any inside the oil control ring scrapers. Who else here can offer that experience? Other than perhaps Chris Sanders, I doubt there is anyone else that posts regularly on this forum who has torn down as many cores as I have. I have built over 300 engines (obviously I have torn down that many cores) plus I have probably torn down 100 extra cores that I have bought myself for my parts shelf.
I do not post this information solely because I am a proponent of using ATF. I post it because this is what I have observed, and that has reinforced my prior views on the use of atf.
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