Steel

Hey guys n' gals how goes it. I was wondering if you guys can help me out. I was wondering if 7-9G's was aobut enough money to get myself a 20b into my '87 N/A? Heres what im thinking

1. 20b engine (duh)
2. TII tranny
3. Racing clutch of wahtever brand
4. Halteck E11 or a Motec controller
5. TII driveshaft/rearend
6. 20B mounts.
7. Stock exhaust system

Im not too worried aobut tuning it up to power yet, but anything you see tham im missing? Im planning on throwing the intercooler somewhere where it will work, yes the stock one, cause i wont be running high boost until i get the money to throw in:

1. T78 turbo
2. BIG FMIC
3. 2.5" exh. sys (or 3"?)
4. nice intake system of some sort.

And one final question... How can i make the 20b pass emissions in Mass? Do i tell the guy at the inspection station that im running a 20b engine in there (as if he knows what that is) or should it pass under 13b specs?

Thanks in advance for any advice!!

cymfc3s

Mike's was 12k. Not including about 36 + hours of labor. And that was going into a T2 using the stock tranny and drivetrain. If i were you, id sell the NA and get a t2 before even thinking about dropping a 20B into an FC.

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

a couple things.
1. its about 360 hours of labour
2. its actually a federal crime to put the 20b in a car, on public roads. it will not pass smog
3. it doesnt come with an intercooler so you have to buy something
4. it needs at least a 3" exhaust and the stock system is nowhere near bolting up
5. you need a giant radiator (www.k2rd.com)
6. you need motor mounts (www.k2rd.com)

mike

AP1_Drew

Three hundred and sixty hours of labor?? Or was that a mis-type?

cymfc3s

hahah, i dont think it was quite 360 hours, but it sure seemed like it.

After doing a 20B, im more partial to the 13B. =]

Steel

federal crime, really? cool....

Hm, so you think a 13b-REW would be a better option then?

*edit* i was planning on getting a JSpec used 20b, so most of the peripherals are already on that, iirc. i.e. alternator, intercooler, all that kaka.

NeilTII

all the JDM stuff will be on that motor but you wouldn't be able to use it. Plus you have to get a custom D/P made. You would have to upgrade you suspension cuz it would handle like a barrel of ****. There's too much to list so I would just get a TII or drop a TII 13b in.

Steel

dratto. I meant the 13b-RE engine, not REW. Why must mazda make this so hard? And yet be so cool?

vaughnc

$12K is the "buid it right for 450HP" price I'm assuming.

You could do it for $8000 at stock Cosmo HP & Boost levels right??

Besides the $4000 for a crate engine (includes turbos & injectors), what other "big price" items would you be buying. If you do all the work yourself, then I'm assuming:

- using the STOCK JC Cosmo Intercooler & piping
- Stock 20B boost levels & injector sizes
- making your own motor mounts
- buy a used high output fuel pump
- stronger clutch
- used haltech
- used knock sensor
- make your own wiring harness
- muffler shop "el chepo" exhaust piping
- cone intake

What else am I missing here ??

Steel

yeah, that's what i was thinking vaghn. Like, i'd need the TII tranny too, but i get get one from fc3s.org for $350, and get a TII drivehsaft pumpkin and halfshafts, not a big deal. Also, FC3S.org has custom 20b/13bREW mounts, for a lot cheaper than k2rd is selling them for. Im not looking to make my car a beast yet. I know it costs 10-15k to make it REALLY POWERFUL, but im just looking at mouting stuff as stock as i can, and next year (summer 2004 even) when i get more money, then i can start putting cool stuff in, like a big single turbo, racing exhaust, racing suspension, all that diddly. Cause i would like to avoid putting in another 13b when in the future i could afford to put in a 20b in. And even a 20b bone stock as i can make it in my car, is a lot better than the ~120hp my N/A is making.

cymfc3s

dude, we did all that. This is totally beating a dead horse. Go check out the 20B forum. It adds up, trust me. And honestly, building motor mounts isnt as easy as "making your own." Theres ALOT of stuff that come up once you get the motor IN the car.....

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

it was at least 360hours, and the 20b's dont come with intercoolers

mike

poor college student

360 hours = 12 days at 24 hours... that's a LOT of time...

vaughnc

your 20b importer should be able to get the stock one.

Dyre

The stock one sucks and you'll still need to a)make it fit the front bumper b) make piping for it.

And its only built to handle the 320 or so hp the 20b comes stock with.
Its a dead horse, trust the people that have done it when they tell you the price. If you have to ask how to do it cheaper, you can't.

RETed

http://fc3s-pro.com/TECH/20B/20b.html


-Ted

jamesdeanrx7

i didint know it was a federal crime to put a 20 b in a car then why does pettit advertise it on there site, hhmmmmm....

zelgadiss-san

jamesdeanrx7, it's not a street legal engine. it's like the grey-area exhausts. as long as you don't have emissions testing, you'd be fine, but if they ever check your emissions for any reason, you're screwed.

Evil Aviator

If you are asking the question, then it means that you probably don't have the skills and resources to fabricate enough components to meet that price range. Plan on $10-15K for a very basic conversion. There is a reason why you don't see very many RX-7's with this engine.

Oh, and sell your NA and start with a TII. I started with an NA, and the extra time and money was absolutely not worth it.

It's not. You can make it pass emissions if you want to. It just depends how you build it. This one passes emissions:
http://www.cris.com/~Asam/20B.html

If you think that you will have a problem passing emissions, then just run it on propane, hydrogen, alcohol, or some other alternate fuel.

Steel

You're absolutley right. I don't have the resources to do the 20b conv. for "cheap". But i'm not getting rid of the N/A. Nope. It's gonna be a TII conversion job now. Depending on how much money i make, i can go all out with the T04 (B or E) and greddy FMIC and all that jazz, or just keep it stock until the next time i make money. I'm pretty close on getting a donor TII to rip the rusty old hood, drivetrain and ECU off. And depending on the inside, some trim pieces too. Im not afraid of putting the work in. After i'm finally done and satisfied my car will look..... exactly how it does right now. A sleeper. No hoodscoop. Maybe a new paintjob, and that's it. Stock rims. the lowest key tailpipes i can find (yet good exhaust system.) My car has to be like my personality. Doesn't look really tough, but once you **** it off, it's gonna kick your ***, quite simply. I dont mind the people with the bodykits, or even the stock TII hood, heck, i even like them, but that just isn't me. And ill put in as much work as necessary to keep my car ME.

*edit* and oh yeah, its impossible to find a decent TII around here anyway

bingoboy

maybe you're not supposed to put it in a street car. i'm sure you can run them in race cars. maybe .

Dyre

Technically the 20b is illegal. Its never been federally tested, therefor, its not a legal engine.

Doesn't mean you can't pass emmisions with one, but its still illegal for highway use according to federal law.

Evil Aviator

Do you happen to know the source for that info? As far as I can tell, the 20B swap (and other emissions tampering) is legal for a private citizen just as long as the car is not sold.
http://www.epa.gov/

LOL, I was really upset that the 20B didn't clear my NA hood (misses by about 1" - doph!). Oh well, now it looks like a riced-out TII, so I guess that's good enough.

Anyway, your sleeper project shouldn't require any major fabrication, except maybe for the FMIC piping if you can't find an FC kit. You can always convert to a 20B later.

fc3s.org

That 20B 10th AE that Mariah made is street legal and emissions legal, in CALIFORNIA