Final Pictures and Status of NA Turbo Install
06-09-02, 10:57 PM
#179
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Good luck on the startup!
It'll take a fair bit of fuel tuning before its running strong I'm sure.... don't expect a ton from the first run around the block...
I am surprised you stuck with that custom made intake flange at the throttle body. The throttle plates are right after it, and there is going to be a ton of turbulance with that huge step right before the TB!
BTW, what do you have in the way of injectors??
Well, this has been a landmark thread. The much sought after N/A-turbo swap, fully documented step by step with pics and all.
You should probably setup a DIY manual, with all the parts needed, etc, and make it available on your web page. Step by step with pics.
Again, good luck... and I still want to race!
It'll take a fair bit of fuel tuning before its running strong I'm sure.... don't expect a ton from the first run around the block...
I am surprised you stuck with that custom made intake flange at the throttle body. The throttle plates are right after it, and there is going to be a ton of turbulance with that huge step right before the TB!
BTW, what do you have in the way of injectors??
Well, this has been a landmark thread. The much sought after N/A-turbo swap, fully documented step by step with pics and all.
You should probably setup a DIY manual, with all the parts needed, etc, and make it available on your web page. Step by step with pics.
Again, good luck... and I still want to race!
06-10-02, 12:31 PM
#180
Engine, Not Motor
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Yes, I stuck with the old turbulant strawberry. I will probably be making a better one when I have time, but I just want to get the car on the road ASAP...Tired of driving the beater..
For injectors, I have 4 TII injectors (in both primary and secondary positions). It's going to run REALLY rich on first startup, but still should run...
I will be setting up a web page with step by step instructions....
Oh, and mods, if you want to sticky this, just combine it with the 3rd one that's already up there. No sense clogging up the forum.
For injectors, I have 4 TII injectors (in both primary and secondary positions). It's going to run REALLY rich on first startup, but still should run...
I will be setting up a web page with step by step instructions....
Oh, and mods, if you want to sticky this, just combine it with the 3rd one that's already up there. No sense clogging up the forum.
06-10-02, 12:38 PM
#182
06-10-02, 12:48 PM
#184
Engine, Not Motor
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No? Hmm...Well, I will be keeping the boost down very low until I have things tuned in and am confident everything will work....I'll probably know long before there is any trouble if I need more fuel or not...Either way, I think I have some GSL-SE (680cc?) injectors hanging around, so I can put those suckers in at any time on the secondary rail.
06-10-02, 12:50 PM
#185
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Looks good! I may be missing something but your custom strawberry thingy seems to only be bolted on by one large bolt in the upper right hand corner. And how can you get away with a simple slide over rubber hose on the oil cooler when the motor hoses need to be made with those damn fittings? I would think you turbo oil hose would see the same pressures and temps that the motor lines see. I will be really surprised if you get it to start on the first try. I know it will run; but the first try is almost always a disapointment. Good luck!
06-10-02, 12:56 PM
#186
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The strawberry is held on with two bolts in the stock locations.
The oil hose should be fine...It is slipped over a inch long barbed nipple designed for hydraulic fittings of 500 PSI and greater, so oil pressure should be no problem for it. If anything, the weak point is the fuel line hose (high pressure injector, of course) I used for the oil supply. I will be replacing it with 2000PSI hydraulic hose as soon as I go by the hose shop again. And those hose clamps are on hella tight.
The oil hose should be fine...It is slipped over a inch long barbed nipple designed for hydraulic fittings of 500 PSI and greater, so oil pressure should be no problem for it. If anything, the weak point is the fuel line hose (high pressure injector, of course) I used for the oil supply. I will be replacing it with 2000PSI hydraulic hose as soon as I go by the hose shop again. And those hose clamps are on hella tight.
06-10-02, 02:31 PM
#187
Rotary Enthusiast
My car wan't pleased with two 720 secondaries and factory n/a fuel pump. I installed an msd fuel pump which is rated for cars up to 500 hp Capable of 43 gph at 40 psi/162l/h. I got it for around $79 at Summit Racing. I will be taking the engine out to see if there is any damage, I'm picky for that kind of ****... So you guys will finally have detailed pics of my n/a turboII. The car runs fine and beats mustangs but I need to open the engine for my own interior PEACE... I got a spare full gasket set so there will be no spending if everything goes well...
I got a spare full gasket set so there will be no spending if everything goes well...
06-10-02, 04:01 PM
#188
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Wow... Now you've got me wondering if my setup will be OK... I bet any money it will be. I think the FD pump and the 4 550's will be fine as well.
Well, the superchargedrex guy on here only put 550 in the secondaires, and was running 210 rwhp or something, and it was fine.
Aaron, FWIW, you CAN set your lower rpm (3000 or less) S-AFC settings to just under 20% less and it will run with the same A/F ratio as the 460's. The difference between the 460 and 550 is 20%, and it actually applies! Wow.
It's actually a little less. More like -15 at idle, up to about -19 after that. This is how mine panned out after I put in the 4 550's.
You might want to do that for you initial startup- then tune from there...
Good luck..
Well, the superchargedrex guy on here only put 550 in the secondaires, and was running 210 rwhp or something, and it was fine.
Aaron, FWIW, you CAN set your lower rpm (3000 or less) S-AFC settings to just under 20% less and it will run with the same A/F ratio as the 460's. The difference between the 460 and 550 is 20%, and it actually applies! Wow.
It's actually a little less. More like -15 at idle, up to about -19 after that. This is how mine panned out after I put in the 4 550's.
You might want to do that for you initial startup- then tune from there...
Good luck..
06-10-02, 04:33 PM
#189
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I am thinking about modifying the Flow Meter by moving some of it's teeth forward, so that it will run richer. What do you guys think?
06-10-02, 06:10 PM
#190
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Originally posted by Angel Guard Racing Team
I am thinking about modifying the Flow Meter by moving some of it's teeth forward, so that it will run richer. What do you guys think?
I am thinking about modifying the Flow Meter by moving some of it's teeth forward, so that it will run richer. What do you guys think?
06-10-02, 06:29 PM
#191
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Originally posted by Angel Guard Racing Team
I am thinking about modifying the Flow Meter by moving some of it's teeth forward, so that it will run richer. What do you guys think?
I am thinking about modifying the Flow Meter by moving some of it's teeth forward, so that it will run richer. What do you guys think?
06-10-02, 07:09 PM
#192
Rotary Enthusiast
My engine is so lean that it starves around 5500 at 7psi!!!!!!!! I don't think it would be a problem for the engine to run rich since I got a high compression engine with a turbo. I think that the turbo will take care of the rich problem at mid range(if it ever happens). I also got an MSD fuel pump.
06-10-02, 07:23 PM
#193
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Originally posted by Angel Guard Racing Team
I don't think it would be a problem for the engine to run rich since I got a high compression engine with a turbo.
I don't think it would be a problem for the engine to run rich since I got a high compression engine with a turbo.
I think that the turbo will take care of the rich problem at mid range(if it ever happens).
Like I said, this is a very crude way of tuning, and fixing one problem will simply create another.
06-10-02, 08:44 PM
#194
Rotary Enthusiast
Well it will happen. And how will a turbo "take care of the rich problem"?
06-11-02, 05:42 AM
#195
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Originally posted by Angel Guard Racing Team
Force compressed air into an engine which is already high compression will reduce the rich factor.
Force compressed air into an engine which is already high compression will reduce the rich factor.
06-11-02, 10:57 AM
#196
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You must realize a few things here-
1- Your car will be running unnecessarily rich at any point under maybe 3000 RPM's, or ANY point where you aren't making boost.
2-The ECU has a max injector duty cycle of about 60%, tricking it into running richer will just cause it to hit this max wall sooner, and won't affect the max fuel delivery ONE SINGLE BIT!
Get 4 550cc injectors, and an S-AFC or an FMU (boost sensitive fule pressure regulator)
1- Your car will be running unnecessarily rich at any point under maybe 3000 RPM's, or ANY point where you aren't making boost.
2-The ECU has a max injector duty cycle of about 60%, tricking it into running richer will just cause it to hit this max wall sooner, and won't affect the max fuel delivery ONE SINGLE BIT!
Get 4 550cc injectors, and an S-AFC or an FMU (boost sensitive fule pressure regulator)
06-11-02, 11:05 AM
#197
Rotary Enthusiast
The compressed air is FORCED into the engine AFTER the AFM. So the rpm's will go up faster than if it were an N/A engine. The afm calculates how much air goes into the turbo, but there is noting to tell the computer at what rate the air is going in after the compressor into the engine (Since I don't have the air pressure sensor connected). So the reading would be erratic therefore causing it to go lean. The computer will detect the RPM's going up faster but the same amount of air going in because the AFM's door will be at the same position therefore the injectors will not compensate. Bottomline is I will do It and let you know. You said that this has been done before but you did not say if it has been done in an n/a turbo converted engine. [qoute]Except there will be an error in the airflow reading because of the "adjusted" AFM, so it will always be richer than it was before.[/quote] Thank you that is exactly what I want. Have you ever seen an engine that broke because of running a little bit rich? Me neither thank you....
06-11-02, 03:33 PM
#198
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I've tried the AFM trick on my friends GXL and it ran worse, ran a 106mph at the 1/4 mile and then after the AFM mod it dropped of 2mph so it does run worse.
BTW running too rich is not good for the motor either.
BTW both runs where at 12psi
BTW running too rich is not good for the motor either.
BTW both runs where at 12psi
06-11-02, 03:46 PM
#200
Rotary Enthusiast
No problem, I won't mess with it. I will install my new MSD Fuel Pump. I already got 720's for secondaries. Is there any way to make the 1991 550's work on my 87? I got 8 of them sitting in my garage.