This is getting really frustrating...

I've been unable to get the water temps below 98 at very light cruise and easily up to 104 if I start to get on it. This is even at NIGHT. I haven't been brave enough to see how hot I get during the day!

Themotor still has the 20B water pump on it. I'm running a Fluidyne radiator with a Fiero fan while my Black Magic is waiting on a new blade, stock oil cooler, which has been moved a hair to the left, and a GReddy FMIC. Temps rise reguardless of whether I have the under tray on or off. I've stuffed egg crate type foam into the holes which would let air divert around the IC or oil cooler. I have a CF radiator panel helping to direct air as well.

I'm running the stock twins in parallel, if that makes any difference. Oh, I also have a reverse vent in place of the stock scoop.

I've just rechecked the timing again. I'm guessing that I'm one tooth off, since I have the E11 set at 11 tooth offset and 50 BTDC for the reference point.

I wish I knew what has changed. When I first got the setup, I could drive around and rarely see 100-101 C even if I boosted while driving at Deal's Gap (mountain run The only thing I can think of is that I pulled the rat's nest off of the engine, but that shouldn't have affected anything like this!

The front bumper I'm using is an AIT with two 'nostrils' cut out in the trim area. I've got to figure something out soon as I'm supposed to take a trip to Georgia next month with the car.

Help!

Reese

 

When you had the black magic fan on before it didn't overheat? Does the fiero fan flow pretty good? Maybe it's a change in the fans?

-Destin

 

Destin, I'm not sure. The Black Magic was broken before I installed the 20B.

If I'm sitting in the driveway idling, the temp will stay around 180-185 with the fans. Once I start moving and then stoop again, it often takes sitting still for a couple of minutes to get the temps back down.

I THOUGHT the fan worked well, but even so, it shouldn't be the problem once I'm driving. I mean, 3000 RPM in fifth gear is close to 80. There should be plenty of air moving at that point!

Maybe I should pull the fan off and see if it's any better at speed?

Reese

 

I suspect that radiator and fan are not up to the task, especially with a fmic. That radiator is kind of puny for what you are asking it to do.
You did say the airflow through the front bumper to the radiator was sealed, correct? The undertray does not really accomplish this, it helps but is in no way ideal.

My solution was to add a lower lip from demonspeed to the bumper. The demonspeed bumper has a lowerd center portion ideal for this setup. Then after cutting off the remaining lower portion of the bumper below the ic and rivetting an addition splitter onto the bottom of the ic, I have provided the radiator and oil coolers their own fresh air supply below the ic. Of course everything is ducted and sealed.
You can see pics of it in my sig.

If you are running a TII hood, that is definately not helping. That hood essentially 'pressurizes' the engine compartment reducing the abiltity of air to flow throught the radiator at speed. The na hood is much better and better yet is the na hood raised in the rear or even a vented hood like mine.

Of course your tuning/timing could be seriously affecting your temps too as you have mentioned.

Good luck.

 

Dave, Here's a pic of the front of my car. The only difference is that now there are two 'nostrils' cut into the part where the body trim is. Similar to yours.

The AIT bumper has an integrated lip on it. If I were to add one to it, it would look like crap as well as be about 2 inches off the ground. Heh.

As for the hood, I have the RE Amemiya-style reverse vent on it, so it is actually letting some amount of air OUT instead of pressurizing like yousuggested a stock TII scoop would do.

Also, with the radiator having its own splitter, are you running a belly pan? I couldn't tell from your pics.

I'll look into what you suggested about individual splitters for the IC and oil cooler. Thank you for the suggestions!

Anyone else?

reese

 

Hey Reese, this is a idea I got from Bryan @ BNR Supercars, he took some thin pieces of aluminum and weld'd them around the bottom edges of his radiator to make a scoop so that when he was driving even @ slow speed air is forced to the radiator from under the car. I am doing it to my Koyo

 

Hmmm. .. i'll have to look into that. Hell, if I can't manage to find anyone around here to weld, there's always JB Weld.

 

I would add a 2nd oil cooler to that setup. I would also ditch the koyo, get a twin pass radiator, throw a ford taurus fan on it.

^^ Do that if all else fails.

You also might want to reconsider a different IC. Perhaps get a smaller one and don't have it hogging all of the airflow to the radiator and oil cooler.

 

Ok reese (remember me from way back in the greddy intercooler days?), i think part of the problem is your FMIC, and the otehr part is your opening to it. On my FC, my FMIC is smaller and doesnt block all the airflow. Secondly i have EVERYTHING ducted and air tight to the radiator. Third i have cut an extra 4" in height out of the front bumper kinda like how 1FASTT2 did.

Granted i dont have a 20B, but my car NEVER gets hot. I used to have similar problems as you did, so i shrank my intercooler, and opened up the nose and added the ducting. No more problems!!!

 

Here is what i did, i did a little custom work on the bumper skin cutting a opening
to let more air in.
then i cut a plate of aluminum to completely cover the rad on the engine side,
cut a hole in the plate for the fan to pull air through and mounted the fan to the
plate.
between the rad and the plate i used a foam tape to hold the plate away from
the rad aprox 1/4" this seals off the full surface of the rad so the fan pulls
air through the entire rad.
It was working great to keep the temps down to between 185 and 195 F
during some hard running at an autox, or until the fan burnt out that is.
I have since put a new fan on it and will be trying it out at another autox
in the next couple weeks.
all i can say is that before i did the rad plate thing i would over heat when stuck
in traffic, now i can run it hard to where it will run up to 190 or so, then while
in the autox line up it would start to cool back down no problems.
hope this helps.
matt

 

Pull the thermostat housing and see if one of the 2 thermostats is bad or sticking closed...

 

Fatty, how've you been? I"m going to TRY to keep the I/C I have mainly due to the fact that decent fab shops (piping, etc) around here are scarce. I'll keep it in mind, though!

Now, I'm definitely going to try that! I went driving last night with outside temps around 80 or so. If I kept the speedo at 80mph (about 50kph, I think) my temps would go up to between 205 and 210. Also, what fan setup are you using?

Dragon, I'm already put one new thermostat in there and verified that the other one is fine as well. Next thought? LOL.

Thanks for the suggestions, guys!

Reese

 

will post a pic of the fan and plate as soon as i have a chance
matt

 

Stock FD fans worked great on my 20B FD and the dual flexlites on my FC seem to be keeping the N/A 20B cool... Not sure how your ignition etc is all set up, but I've always run FD water pump housing and water pumps on my 20B's with no problems. You have to change over the main pully etc, so If your running accessories from the 20B set up you will run in to problems..

and can you turn your fans on sooner? Turn them on at 87'C and off around 82'C.

 

Dragon, I'll try the lower temp suggestion.

I'm only running the water pump and alternator. No AC and no PS. All the parts are currently stock 20B.

reese

 

here is my fan.
matt

 

well ran the car hard at a autox over the weekend and ..... it still gets hot when
run hard but it will cool down while idling, and stays cool in the lineup as well.
so for the street i am sure this will work fine, highway driving it stays cool
no problem even after loooong WOT runs.
It would sure be nice if it would stay cool when run hard at lower speeds,
a larger rad i think is the only solution but there just isn't room for bigger
matt

 

2 big oil coolers like setrab 34 rows with a 10" fan on the back of one of them will do wonders...

 

I have a mazdacomp radiator (4" thick) and a Black Magic fan. Also DUAL FC oil coolers. I tried other fans, but only the black magic one did the trick. Also consider a vented hood, that might help (so you dont have to change your IC setup)