Will FD injectors fit into GSL-SE?
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From: Long Beach, CA
Will FD injectors fit into GSL-SE?
I already tried searching and found nothing, I was just wondering if the stock FD injectors will fit into the GSL-SE? What are the flow rates of the stock SE injectors? Has anybody ever tried this and does it require any major modifications? Any info would help
stock injectors are two 680cc injectors. Which flow more than the stock Turbo II injectors which are only 550cc injectors, however the SE only has two injectors instead of the turbo II that has four.
I'm not sure what size FD's have.
I'm not sure what size FD's have.
Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,020
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From: Long Beach, CA
Ohhhhhh
**** only 2 injectors damn didn't know that at all.
What other upgrades can be done to the SE? I have a walbro 255 pump that I would like to wire up to the SE? I want at least 150 RWHP N/A but I know it wont be easy.
**** only 2 injectors damn didn't know that at all.
What other upgrades can be done to the SE? I have a walbro 255 pump that I would like to wire up to the SE? I want at least 150 RWHP N/A but I know it wont be easy.
From the factory GSL-SE's make 130hp at the flywheel. 150whp is about 170hp at the flywheel. You might be able to hit that number without porting. For that reason you will need the absolute most flow from the intake and exhaust. A downdraft weber will flow abit more then the factory GSL-SE intake setup, but I can understand wanting to keep the mpg and driveability of the EFI. I had an SE a few years ago and performed these mods for the most gain possible. Granted, I didn't have alot of money but the thing ran awesome!!
1. Header with full 2.5" exhaust
2. CAI
3. Pull the entire intake manifold, cleen thoroughly, remove 6 port sleeves and rod actuators
4. Port TB
5. MSD or DFIS of choice.
Do not fret for the 6port removal. I have performed this on 3 GSL-SE car's and have never seen a low-end loss and saw nothing but top-end gains. Fc's may see a loss, but the SE's rotors are the heaviest of any rotary, and that momentum makes the torque consistant down low. It was another "Mazda,......why did you do that?"
Also, Fd's have 4 850cc injectors.
1. Header with full 2.5" exhaust
2. CAI
3. Pull the entire intake manifold, cleen thoroughly, remove 6 port sleeves and rod actuators
4. Port TB
5. MSD or DFIS of choice.
Do not fret for the 6port removal. I have performed this on 3 GSL-SE car's and have never seen a low-end loss and saw nothing but top-end gains. Fc's may see a loss, but the SE's rotors are the heaviest of any rotary, and that momentum makes the torque consistant down low. It was another "Mazda,......why did you do that?"
Also, Fd's have 4 850cc injectors.
Last edited by XLR8; Oct 29, 2006 at 10:53 AM.
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Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,020
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From: Long Beach, CA
Originally Posted by XLR8
From the factory GSL-SE's make 130hp at the flywheel. 150whp is about 170hp at the flywheel. You might be able to hit that number without porting. For that reason you will need the absolute most flow from the intake and exhaust. A downdraft weber will flow abit more then the factory GSL-SE intake setup, but I can understand wanting to keep the mpg and driveability of the EFI. I had an SE a few years ago and performed these mods for the most gain possible. Granted, I didn't have alot of money but the thing ran awesome!!
1. Header with full 2.5" exhaust
2. CAI
3. Pull the entire intake manifold, cleen thoroughly, remove 6 port sleeves and rod actuators
4. Port TB
5. MSD or DFIS of choice.
Do not fret for the 6port removal. I have performed this on 3 GSL-SE car's and have never seen a low-end loss and saw nothing but top-end gains. Fc's may see a loss, but the SE's rotors are the heaviest of any rotary, and that momentum makes the torque consistant down low. It was another "Mazda,......why did you do that?"
Also, Fd's have 4 850cc injectors.
1. Header with full 2.5" exhaust
2. CAI
3. Pull the entire intake manifold, cleen thoroughly, remove 6 port sleeves and rod actuators
4. Port TB
5. MSD or DFIS of choice.
Do not fret for the 6port removal. I have performed this on 3 GSL-SE car's and have never seen a low-end loss and saw nothing but top-end gains. Fc's may see a loss, but the SE's rotors are the heaviest of any rotary, and that momentum makes the torque consistant down low. It was another "Mazda,......why did you do that?"
Also, Fd's have 4 850cc injectors.
this is from another thread about bridge porting an SE if you wanna start with upgrades then you should start here with this post!
you dont nesserly have to port it but every other mod on his list will be good enough and i had them all on my last SE and it was a blast to drive i even have an electric fan on mine.
edit: i also did the TB mod that helped abit too but she ran rough until she was all warmed up
Originally Posted by rotarygod
If you intend to retain the stock factory fuel injection, don't even think about a bridgeport. The stock air flow meter has a total area for air to flow through of 4 square inches. That is equal to a 2.25" intake pipe. WAY too small. You will absolutely choke the engine. To make matters worse, there is a spring loaded door in the way further hindering airflow. It almost flows enough air to supply a single rotor bridgeport! You want to feed 2 rotors through it? No way!
Also just consider the setup you are planning. If you use a 12A intermediate housing, where are the fuel injectors going to go? Also i assume you are trying to use the large port center plate. Look at the size of the intake runners vs. the stock intake manifold. The manifold runners are about half the size. Don't even think about port matching them. You will lose a ton of air velocity once the air gets to the center housing. This will slow down the intake air and less will actually get in the engine. The center ports are also the wrong ones to bridge if you are only going to bridge 2 of them. You have far too little airflow through the intake manifold for a bridgeport. Actually this is true for any ports. The stock intake system is a huge restriction.
Your combo is a prime example of how bigger is NOT always better. Your proposed setup may actually be even slower than stock! Yes it is possible. What counts in the power department is the total package. It all has to work together properly.
I have a GSL-SE. It is streetported. I ported it myself so I am very familiar with how it was done. The end housing ports are about the same size if not very slightly larger than the stock 2nd gen intake ports. The primaries are a little larger but nothing insane. One very common mistake you see damn near everyone do on this forum is to go hog wild with the porting on the outer housings. Don't ever open both ports up into one large one. You'll kill velocity and make no low end power. Since your stock afm is so restrictive you won't make much about 7000 rpm anyways. Do you want a motor with no low end or top end? My ports are very close to the ones on Mazdatrix's site.
Here are the mods on my SE up to this point. Cone filter. Didn't notice ****. Long primary collected exhaust system. Very nice power upgrade across the whole rpm range. It's the first thing you should do. Underdrive pulleys. Maybe felt something but not enough to really matter. Light aluminum flywheel. Oh yeah this is noticable! MSD direct fire conversion. This is a very nice upgrade as well. It makes the car run really smooth. Starts are better and gas mileage is improved. It sounds like a 2nd gen now. Reset timing to 25 degrees total advance witha 10 degree timing split. Combined with the direct fire conversion, this was noticable. Streetport. Yes the car is faster. All of the other mods up to this point have made a much larger improvement than the porting did though. Is it worthwhile? Yes. Do it last! I have an S5 n/a intake manifold. The 6 port system and the VDI still work. While the afm is still a restriction, the VDI effect on the car improves the top end. The next upgrade for me is a standalone ecu. This should make the biggest difference yet and it isn't uncommon to see 15% gain in power just solely off of the fact that the airflow meter is gone! Then you can also tune it to your combo. All of these things work together very well.
If I were to bridgeport it, I would go no faster. I would be forced to change intake manifolds and ecu's. I would lose drivability and gas mileage. I would not pass inspection. Without a port job, you can get an SE to run mid 14's!
Do everything else first. Trust me on this one. You'll be glad you did. Then save porting for last and even then don't go too crazy. This forum is full of people who insist bigger is better but you never see anyone with a street driven car with bigger dyno numbers than the streetport guys. I wonder why! My car idles at a stock 750, makes good low end power and still gets me 20 mpg in the city. Good enough for me. If I wanted more, I'd turbo it. Why sacrifice drivability for speed when you can have both?
Also just consider the setup you are planning. If you use a 12A intermediate housing, where are the fuel injectors going to go? Also i assume you are trying to use the large port center plate. Look at the size of the intake runners vs. the stock intake manifold. The manifold runners are about half the size. Don't even think about port matching them. You will lose a ton of air velocity once the air gets to the center housing. This will slow down the intake air and less will actually get in the engine. The center ports are also the wrong ones to bridge if you are only going to bridge 2 of them. You have far too little airflow through the intake manifold for a bridgeport. Actually this is true for any ports. The stock intake system is a huge restriction.
Your combo is a prime example of how bigger is NOT always better. Your proposed setup may actually be even slower than stock! Yes it is possible. What counts in the power department is the total package. It all has to work together properly.
I have a GSL-SE. It is streetported. I ported it myself so I am very familiar with how it was done. The end housing ports are about the same size if not very slightly larger than the stock 2nd gen intake ports. The primaries are a little larger but nothing insane. One very common mistake you see damn near everyone do on this forum is to go hog wild with the porting on the outer housings. Don't ever open both ports up into one large one. You'll kill velocity and make no low end power. Since your stock afm is so restrictive you won't make much about 7000 rpm anyways. Do you want a motor with no low end or top end? My ports are very close to the ones on Mazdatrix's site.
Here are the mods on my SE up to this point. Cone filter. Didn't notice ****. Long primary collected exhaust system. Very nice power upgrade across the whole rpm range. It's the first thing you should do. Underdrive pulleys. Maybe felt something but not enough to really matter. Light aluminum flywheel. Oh yeah this is noticable! MSD direct fire conversion. This is a very nice upgrade as well. It makes the car run really smooth. Starts are better and gas mileage is improved. It sounds like a 2nd gen now. Reset timing to 25 degrees total advance witha 10 degree timing split. Combined with the direct fire conversion, this was noticable. Streetport. Yes the car is faster. All of the other mods up to this point have made a much larger improvement than the porting did though. Is it worthwhile? Yes. Do it last! I have an S5 n/a intake manifold. The 6 port system and the VDI still work. While the afm is still a restriction, the VDI effect on the car improves the top end. The next upgrade for me is a standalone ecu. This should make the biggest difference yet and it isn't uncommon to see 15% gain in power just solely off of the fact that the airflow meter is gone! Then you can also tune it to your combo. All of these things work together very well.
If I were to bridgeport it, I would go no faster. I would be forced to change intake manifolds and ecu's. I would lose drivability and gas mileage. I would not pass inspection. Without a port job, you can get an SE to run mid 14's!
Do everything else first. Trust me on this one. You'll be glad you did. Then save porting for last and even then don't go too crazy. This forum is full of people who insist bigger is better but you never see anyone with a street driven car with bigger dyno numbers than the streetport guys. I wonder why! My car idles at a stock 750, makes good low end power and still gets me 20 mpg in the city. Good enough for me. If I wanted more, I'd turbo it. Why sacrifice drivability for speed when you can have both?
edit: i also did the TB mod that helped abit too but she ran rough until she was all warmed up
Last edited by 3rd and final 7; Oct 29, 2006 at 07:25 PM.
It amazes me how much incorrect info and lack of understanding there is here some days.
13BNUT, if you were to add 1200 cc secondary injectors to your FD, what would happen? Would you see a hp increase? Would you need to make any other changes, if so, what, how? Whatever those changes are, the SE ecu does not have the ability to compensate for it.
First hp upgrade for any NA rotary is the exhaust system. If after that you still want more, then mod the intake. Since the SE is a 6=port FI, there aren't many options. You can carb it, or you can modify an S4 intake and ecu to fit for a whooping 16 more hp. Very few do the latter, it's not worth all the extra work.
To get the most hp out of a 1st gen 13B, you tear it down, use 12A end irons to make it a 4-port, then port as much as your willing to put up with for streetability, and carb it.
13BNUT, if you were to add 1200 cc secondary injectors to your FD, what would happen? Would you see a hp increase? Would you need to make any other changes, if so, what, how? Whatever those changes are, the SE ecu does not have the ability to compensate for it.
First hp upgrade for any NA rotary is the exhaust system. If after that you still want more, then mod the intake. Since the SE is a 6=port FI, there aren't many options. You can carb it, or you can modify an S4 intake and ecu to fit for a whooping 16 more hp. Very few do the latter, it's not worth all the extra work.
To get the most hp out of a 1st gen 13B, you tear it down, use 12A end irons to make it a 4-port, then port as much as your willing to put up with for streetability, and carb it.
Dont forget about pineapple racings sleeve inserts!
http://pineappleracing.com/Merchant2...tegory_Code=EA
Those are good for a couple HP
http://pineappleracing.com/Merchant2...tegory_Code=EA
Those are good for a couple HP
i know that i had an exhust, K&N intake, electric fan, dual alt belt pully, modded SE throotle body mod, 2gen dircetfire , lightweight flywheel and i was on my way to getting the sleeve inserts and i took off pulled about 200- 300 pounds of weight off the car! i did nt mess with the timing but it was a hella quick car.
edit: i never got it dyno'd but im sure it was something close to 150 or so "just a guess"
i just gotta se that im using for parts for my S model and im going to swap the engine and suspension and a few other things and all the things that i listed is what im going to be doing again with a few other things on also!
sorry guys i didnt mean to hijack
edit: i never got it dyno'd but im sure it was something close to 150 or so "just a guess"
i just gotta se that im using for parts for my S model and im going to swap the engine and suspension and a few other things and all the things that i listed is what im going to be doing again with a few other things on also!
sorry guys i didnt mean to hijack
Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,020
Likes: 0
From: Long Beach, CA
I just recently installed my RB headers and 2 1/4" piping with a dynomax muffler and it responds nicely. I can really feel the difference. I have a 3rd Gen Alt with dual belt pulley but dont know how to wire it up. I know there is a connector in the back and another for ground but they seem to be different. Anyone care to show me a pix of one installed, also in what way will this help my SE?




