turbo fb guys.. spark plugs/oil changes question
11-17-03, 11:25 AM
#1
turbo fb guys.. spark plugs/oil changes question
How often you guys go through spark plugs? Im replacing mine like all the time. I dont drive the car much, but anyways, Id say I get maybe 250 miles out of the plugs. And no they arent ALL hard miles. On the last set, I never went over 13psi. NGK BUR7eq and BUR9eq's
Now onto oil changes, my god does every have to change oil all the time. I change mine and it is wrenching of gas smell...
I thought Id ask these questions... To see if anyone has any input.
Now onto oil changes, my god does every have to change oil all the time. I change mine and it is wrenching of gas smell...
I thought Id ask these questions... To see if anyone has any input.
11-17-03, 12:01 PM
#2
Yeah, shutup kid.
I don't know about the oil, I havn't even went 1000 miles yet. I use B8EG plugs gapped down to .015, and they have lasted at least 750 miles, and still run like when they were new. They are mostly hard miles, boosting between 7 and 15 psi.
11-17-03, 12:06 PM
#3
RX-7 Alumni
Ouch!
Something isn't right (yea you guessed that).
Sounds like fuel is getting leaked into the oil system, maybe after shut down? That's real bad cause it thins out your oil and can cause premature wear of your engine.
Does your fuel system vent back to the tank after shut down? If not, it could be venting into the engine from a leaky injector. I know you have a real nice setup but can't recall it right now, will have to go search to find it.
The plug deal would have me worried also. I would think a min of 10k miles. My old stock 12a would go like 20-30K with no problem--but I've heard 10k is common.
Good luck finding it. And I'll be back.
Scott
Sounds like fuel is getting leaked into the oil system, maybe after shut down? That's real bad cause it thins out your oil and can cause premature wear of your engine.
Does your fuel system vent back to the tank after shut down? If not, it could be venting into the engine from a leaky injector. I know you have a real nice setup but can't recall it right now, will have to go search to find it.
The plug deal would have me worried also. I would think a min of 10k miles. My old stock 12a would go like 20-30K with no problem--but I've heard 10k is common.
Good luck finding it. And I'll be back.
Scott
11-17-03, 12:27 PM
#4
Got Boost?
What do the plugs look like when you pull them out? Really, what are your reasons for replacing the plugs all the time?
Do you have your evaporative emissions system working? If you don't have the crankcase cleaned out by moving some air through it, gas and water can build up in the oil.
Every time the engine gets flooded some gas will get into the oil. To a lesser degree,even with normal startups and operation small amounts of gas can migrate to the oil. The natural operation amount won't hurt if the evaporative system is working. A single incedent flooding won't do any damgage either, if you let the car warm all the way up before driving it. Though repetitive flooding, disfunctional crank venting, or not letting the engine run warmed up often enough is bad because gas will build up in the crank, causing the oil to thin out.
Do you have your evaporative emissions system working? If you don't have the crankcase cleaned out by moving some air through it, gas and water can build up in the oil.
Every time the engine gets flooded some gas will get into the oil. To a lesser degree,even with normal startups and operation small amounts of gas can migrate to the oil. The natural operation amount won't hurt if the evaporative system is working. A single incedent flooding won't do any damgage either, if you let the car warm all the way up before driving it. Though repetitive flooding, disfunctional crank venting, or not letting the engine run warmed up often enough is bad because gas will build up in the crank, causing the oil to thin out.
11-17-03, 02:33 PM
#5
the spark plugs are black in color when I pull them out, i know that usually means rich, but I cant lean the idle too much more or the car wont run. however the upper ranges I have leaned it quite a bit. The reason I change plugs is simply it wont start worth a crap, and it sure as hell wont run anymore. When the plugs are bad it will start and run like its running on one rotor, back firing wildly etc. Put new plugs in and its perfect again. I had a problem with it smoking really bad, so I sent the turbo in for repair, they sent it back, I put it on the car it still smokes. I know that usually means rotor control oil rings, but it doesnt smoke for the first minute or so that I start it. If the oil control rings were bad it would smoke from the first instant i fired it up. also wouldnt they seep some oil into the combustion chamber over long periods of sitting? It doesnt smoke a lick from first fire up. It just starts about a minute after and seems to get worse. Especially if you rev it hard.
Crankcase venting LOL I asked that question and I was told to leave the 2 vents completely open.
One of these days Ill work this car out or something.
Crankcase venting LOL I asked that question and I was told to leave the 2 vents completely open.
One of these days Ill work this car out or something.
Last edited by MIKE-P-28; 11-17-03 at 02:36 PM.
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11-17-03, 02:59 PM
#8
Yeah, shutup kid.
Originally posted by MIKE-P-28
the spark plugs are black in color when I pull them out, i know that usually means rich, but I cant lean the idle too much more or the car wont run. however the upper ranges I have leaned it quite a bit. The reason I change plugs is simply it wont start worth a crap, and it sure as hell wont run anymore. When the plugs are bad it will start and run like its running on one rotor, back firing wildly etc. Put new plugs in and its perfect again.
the spark plugs are black in color when I pull them out, i know that usually means rich, but I cant lean the idle too much more or the car wont run. however the upper ranges I have leaned it quite a bit. The reason I change plugs is simply it wont start worth a crap, and it sure as hell wont run anymore. When the plugs are bad it will start and run like its running on one rotor, back firing wildly etc. Put new plugs in and its perfect again.
11-17-03, 04:00 PM
#11
Got Boost?
a coolant leak causes plugs to foul! as well as running way too rich.
As far as crankcase goes, a little vacuum assist to pull gunk out never hurt anything. When I got my car running, I ran into oil-smoke issues kindof like yours. One thing that really helped was hooking up the crankcase to the inlet of the turbo. The constant vacuum (especially when under serious boost the pressure right before the turbo is quite low) completely elliminated the smoking when driving. If it sits for too long still smokes, though.
11-17-03, 07:19 PM
#13
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Hey Mike, same problem here but not as bad. The plugs will start to foul up I'm guessing. Once I give it a good 1st-3rd boost run they always clean out but I run bur9eq's all the way around. You need a WB!!! 
only 350 bucks
I also get a **** pile of fuel in the oil (think I've told you that). When driving it in the cold last week it would also get a ton of condensation in the fillerneck. I'm going to do what fatboy7 did. Drill/tap the aluminum TID for a fitting and run the line to the top port on the fillerneck. I'll plug the one at the bottom. I think this will get rid of a ton of the condensation and fuel vapors, well hoping it will anyways...
only 350 bucks I also get a **** pile of fuel in the oil (think I've told you that). When driving it in the cold last week it would also get a ton of condensation in the fillerneck. I'm going to do what fatboy7 did. Drill/tap the aluminum TID for a fitting and run the line to the top port on the fillerneck. I'll plug the one at the bottom. I think this will get rid of a ton of the condensation and fuel vapors, well hoping it will anyways...
11-17-03, 08:21 PM
#15
standard combustion
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I ran the stock 12a plugs still I noticed a piece of porcilian missing. Then I went to stock TII's NGK BUR7eq and BUR9eq's. No more problems. I'm running my home-built blowthrough 12a turbo setup. I noticed though, if I run the 9's in the leading, then they fowl out, unless its driven hard out all the time. But normal driving, the 7's are what I run, and they stay pretty golden brown in color, no problems with porcilian breaking off.
My plan is to replace them every 4000miles or till the 12a breaks again. LOL!!! But I've had REALLY good luck with this latest engine I built in early sept, it runs great still, no issues Whatsoever! This is with it set at 6-8psi, as I'm not too interested in cracking a endplate again or getting so much sideplate to rotor housing movement without additional dowling of the block.
My plan is to replace them every 4000miles or till the 12a breaks again. LOL!!! But I've had REALLY good luck with this latest engine I built in early sept, it runs great still, no issues Whatsoever! This is with it set at 6-8psi, as I'm not too interested in cracking a endplate again or getting so much sideplate to rotor housing movement without additional dowling of the block.
11-17-03, 10:41 PM
#16
Yeah, shutup kid.
Originally posted by ioTus
Coldy13, how do you know it will detonate?
Coldy13, how do you know it will detonate?
he sees a apex seal bouncing down the road in his rearview.
11-17-03, 10:48 PM
#17
On the Cosmo block you guys need to run B9EV's or B10EV's.
They are designed for Motorcycles, have only 1 electrode, and will last 20K miles like nothing. They are designed to take 12K RPM no problem either.
Do a Seach here on the forum and see.
They are designed for Motorcycles, have only 1 electrode, and will last 20K miles like nothing. They are designed to take 12K RPM no problem either.
Do a Seach here on the forum and see.
11-18-03, 03:14 PM
#19
Originally posted by fatboy7
Or burning oil...
As far as crankcase goes, a little vacuum assist to pull gunk out never hurt anything. When I got my car running, I ran into oil-smoke issues kindof like yours. One thing that really helped was hooking up the crankcase to the inlet of the turbo. The constant vacuum (especially when under serious boost the pressure right before the turbo is quite low) completely elliminated the smoking when driving. If it sits for too long still smokes, though.
Or burning oil...
As far as crankcase goes, a little vacuum assist to pull gunk out never hurt anything. When I got my car running, I ran into oil-smoke issues kindof like yours. One thing that really helped was hooking up the crankcase to the inlet of the turbo. The constant vacuum (especially when under serious boost the pressure right before the turbo is quite low) completely elliminated the smoking when driving. If it sits for too long still smokes, though.
@setzep Yeah I know I need a wideband...
11-18-03, 06:05 PM
#21
Rotary Enthusiast
Get yourself some B9EGVs from NGK and run 4 of them. These are what I use, and they're fine. A good high boost boot full every time you drive the car will help to keep the plugs clean.
It could be crankcase venting that's your problem as everyone mentioned. My car has a hose from the outlet on the oil filler pipe to a little bung on the turbo inlet pipe (between the filter and turbo). I suppose it helps, but i've actually disconnected it, because I believe it's coating the inside of my I/C with oil film, that leads to other problems.
How does your OMP work? Is it physically controlled from the TB or electronic (I can't remember with these motors). I have a S5 engine that normally has an electronic OMP, but because I don't have the S5 ECU the OMP is cable tied open. I believe this is causing a smoking problem that i'm having, where the car will smoke after sitting idling for a few minutes, but is clear when first started and when under load.
It could be crankcase venting that's your problem as everyone mentioned. My car has a hose from the outlet on the oil filler pipe to a little bung on the turbo inlet pipe (between the filter and turbo). I suppose it helps, but i've actually disconnected it, because I believe it's coating the inside of my I/C with oil film, that leads to other problems.
How does your OMP work? Is it physically controlled from the TB or electronic (I can't remember with these motors). I have a S5 engine that normally has an electronic OMP, but because I don't have the S5 ECU the OMP is cable tied open. I believe this is causing a smoking problem that i'm having, where the car will smoke after sitting idling for a few minutes, but is clear when first started and when under load.
11-18-03, 06:34 PM
#22
Special Dark
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What rpm do you idle and what is your injector size? You might want to bump up the idle and see if you can lean the mixture further. As far as oil goes, I have the same problem. It degrades too quickly. Turbo cars seem to suffer fuel dilution a lot more than N/A cars, particularly 3rd gens.
11-18-03, 07:26 PM
#23
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Hey Mike I ran a line from the top of the filler neck to the inlet of the turbo and it helped a lot with the water/fuel liquid that accumulates near the oil fill cap. At first I didn't think it did anything but after I took it down the freeway and some hard boost runs it cleared up. I plugged the one at the bottom of the fill neck.
Alex- why should we be running those plugs over the standard bur9eq's on the cosmo engine?? Do they keep cleaner and run at a lower temp? Also what's the difference between the B9EGV's and the B9EV's?
Alex- why should we be running those plugs over the standard bur9eq's on the cosmo engine?? Do they keep cleaner and run at a lower temp? Also what's the difference between the B9EGV's and the B9EV's?
11-18-03, 09:55 PM
#24
Rotary Enthusiast
Alex- why should we be running those plugs over the standard bur9eq's on the cosmo engine?? Do they keep cleaner and run at a lower temp? Also what's the difference between the B9EGV's and the B9EV's?
EGV's have greater durability from reduced errosion due to a higher quality gold palladium blend. Otherwise they're the same thing.
They're about AU$12 a plug and i've had one set in my car for the past 12 months (not sure how many km's that is), adn they're fine. I've even experienced the one rotor running due to fouled plugs on this set, but they cleaned up and are still firing strong.
11-19-03, 08:26 AM
#25
Originally posted by S2-13BT
Get yourself some B9EGVs from NGK and run 4 of them. These are what I use, and they're fine. A good high boost boot full every time you drive the car will help to keep the plugs clean.
It could be crankcase venting that's your problem as everyone mentioned. My car has a hose from the outlet on the oil filler pipe to a little bung on the turbo inlet pipe (between the filter and turbo). I suppose it helps, but i've actually disconnected it, because I believe it's coating the inside of my I/C with oil film, that leads to other problems.
How does your OMP work? Is it physically controlled from the TB or electronic (I can't remember with these motors). I have a S5 engine that normally has an electronic OMP, but because I don't have the S5 ECU the OMP is cable tied open. I believe this is causing a smoking problem that i'm having, where the car will smoke after sitting idling for a few minutes, but is clear when first started and when under load.
Get yourself some B9EGVs from NGK and run 4 of them. These are what I use, and they're fine. A good high boost boot full every time you drive the car will help to keep the plugs clean.
It could be crankcase venting that's your problem as everyone mentioned. My car has a hose from the outlet on the oil filler pipe to a little bung on the turbo inlet pipe (between the filter and turbo). I suppose it helps, but i've actually disconnected it, because I believe it's coating the inside of my I/C with oil film, that leads to other problems.
How does your OMP work? Is it physically controlled from the TB or electronic (I can't remember with these motors). I have a S5 engine that normally has an electronic OMP, but because I don't have the S5 ECU the OMP is cable tied open. I believe this is causing a smoking problem that i'm having, where the car will smoke after sitting idling for a few minutes, but is clear when first started and when under load.