Stock sways good enough?
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Damn, it did start!
Joined: Feb 2001
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From: washington
Stock sways good enough?
As opposed to RB's red wonders. I'm looking at where I need to compromise to complete my project, and replacing the bushings would save me cash over aftermarket sway bars. I do plan on RB springs and Koni's...but I am thinking my money is better spent there than on the sways. Driving will be weekend excursions for spirited runs. No competition.
ancient wizard...
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 2,335
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From: Maryland
You're already upgrading the rest of your suspension,install a larger front bar.
Wouldn't replace rear bar,you may find with the larger front bar you can remove the rear bar. Every car is a bit different.
If you have the car apart presently,it's easier to install front bar. You will have to radius the bottom of frame fenderwell to accommodate the larger bar so there's no contact in bar's normal cycling,also easier to do with suspension apart.
As far as cost,look for a used RB bar. They don't wear out. You can install an Energy suspension pivot and end link kit and performance will be as new and save yourself 1/2 or more over cost of bar.
Look at Suspension Techniques swaybar,less expensive than RB red and works just as well.
Yoh don't have to replace bar now,but it is easier than going back and disassembling later to install it.
You are definitely not the 1st to wrestle with "should I upgrade front bar while doing other suspension work" and won't be the 1st to wonder how much better the car would handle after driving it with the spring/shock upgrades you are already doing.
Certain the majority of respondents to this thread will recommend a larger front bar.
Wouldn't replace rear bar,you may find with the larger front bar you can remove the rear bar. Every car is a bit different.
If you have the car apart presently,it's easier to install front bar. You will have to radius the bottom of frame fenderwell to accommodate the larger bar so there's no contact in bar's normal cycling,also easier to do with suspension apart.
As far as cost,look for a used RB bar. They don't wear out. You can install an Energy suspension pivot and end link kit and performance will be as new and save yourself 1/2 or more over cost of bar.
Look at Suspension Techniques swaybar,less expensive than RB red and works just as well.
Yoh don't have to replace bar now,but it is easier than going back and disassembling later to install it.
You are definitely not the 1st to wrestle with "should I upgrade front bar while doing other suspension work" and won't be the 1st to wonder how much better the car would handle after driving it with the spring/shock upgrades you are already doing.
Certain the majority of respondents to this thread will recommend a larger front bar.
Personally, I didn't do it when I went to poly bushings and RB springs. Don't see the need really. If I was tracking it and saw a need for it, sure. One thing you might want to get instead is the adjustable lower control arms from RB or T3 so you can get some bit of extra negative camber on there. That I think is worth it and since you already have it all apart anyway. Something to think about.
84SE-EGI helpy-helperton
Joined: Oct 2002
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From: Phoenix, AZ
It will stiffen the car substantially if you like that sort of thing. What I found is that it is not likely to increase net cornering force over having good stock suspension because stock bushings and links are so soft as to allow a lot of deflection which makes for smoother transition of weight in corners and across the tires. The heavier front bar will keep the front plane more level (*with your other mods, Joni strut cartridges, springs, etc.) But this results in heavy reliance on your tire limits of adhesion. If your tires won't carry the load, they will slip and it will all happen more suddenly.
It's likely you will appreciate the flatter cornering in the seat of your pants, but for max cornering, you'd do better with lowering the car, balancing the weights at each corner and sticking with new, stock rubber bushings and links. For spirited street driving, I like the RB bar in front. Some dont.d
Note that this doesn't even get into the argument about rear bars, as that's an entirely different conversation, and it will also affect how the front end feels and corners.
It's likely you will appreciate the flatter cornering in the seat of your pants, but for max cornering, you'd do better with lowering the car, balancing the weights at each corner and sticking with new, stock rubber bushings and links. For spirited street driving, I like the RB bar in front. Some dont.d
Note that this doesn't even get into the argument about rear bars, as that's an entirely different conversation, and it will also affect how the front end feels and corners.
Joined: Mar 2001
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From: https://www2.mazda.com/en/100th/
ive upgraded bars a couple times, but i don't feel its needed, especially for a street car.
you should try your favorite road with and without the rear sway bar, and just keep the one you like (i have usually kept it on 12A cars, and removed it on GSL-SE's)
you should try your favorite road with and without the rear sway bar, and just keep the one you like (i have usually kept it on 12A cars, and removed it on GSL-SE's)
I just recenty upgraded my front sway bar to the racing beat bar about a year ago. I went with RB springs and KYB shocks about 5-6 years ago. In my case the front sway bar made a fairly big difference. It helped cut my oversteer and how tail happy my car could be. There were several quick switching corners on the backroads around me that I had to be careful with because my rear would skip or feel like it is lifting off of the ground. Upgrading the front sway bar made a noticeable difference. Not as much of a difference as going to 30 year old shocks and springs to the RB shocks and springs however. But I did gain some extra confidence and predictability in tight corners. I stuck with leaving the stock RSB on the car as removing it caused me to understeer in a not fun way.
If I recall, to get the bar in you have to drop the strut rod mounts which could muck with your alignment slightly...so if you're doing a bunch of stuff then paying for a professional alignment, it's a lot cheaper to put that front bar in now.
I started with RB springs and Tokico blue shocks and stock sway bars. Felt fine and sporty on the road. The body roll scared me on the track so I put the RB front bar in. Borderline too stiff for city streets but just right for back roads and track days and essential for Autocross.
I also tried the rear bar. Might be good with certain tire combos for Autocross. Not recommended at all for track days. It'll make the car neutral through corners...until that moment when it isn't, and there is no correcting what happens next.
I currently run the stock rear bar with the stock rear linkage, no poly bushings, except those that came with the Racing Beat front bar. I plan to upgrade the front strut rod and control arm bushings to poly this winter.
I started with RB springs and Tokico blue shocks and stock sway bars. Felt fine and sporty on the road. The body roll scared me on the track so I put the RB front bar in. Borderline too stiff for city streets but just right for back roads and track days and essential for Autocross.
I also tried the rear bar. Might be good with certain tire combos for Autocross. Not recommended at all for track days. It'll make the car neutral through corners...until that moment when it isn't, and there is no correcting what happens next.
I currently run the stock rear bar with the stock rear linkage, no poly bushings, except those that came with the Racing Beat front bar. I plan to upgrade the front strut rod and control arm bushings to poly this winter.
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ancient wizard...
Joined: Sep 2014
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From: Maryland
Yes you do have to partially remove strut rod swaybar mount to get bar in and out but will be no change in caster as you're not changing actual strut rod dimensions if you loosen the large front nut and leave the rear one alone. The brackets can be bolted back up to subframe in same position by looking at where bolts seated previously,then tightening strut rod nuts and cotter pinning. Camber and toe in are not affected either as swaybar does not change ride height so no need for realignment. It IS easier to install bar when car disassembled for other front suspension work. Much less stress to install bar on non SE car as bar is in neighborhood of fmoc during install on SE.
I have an adjustable bar on rear of mine that i have to change adjustment when changing from oe piemags with all season directional tires to sticky summer tires to keep same handling feel. Tried with bar disconnected with both sets of tires,feels better being connected with both types tires,more so with summer tires.
I have an adjustable bar on rear of mine that i have to change adjustment when changing from oe piemags with all season directional tires to sticky summer tires to keep same handling feel. Tried with bar disconnected with both sets of tires,feels better being connected with both types tires,more so with summer tires.
Thread Starter
Damn, it did start!
Joined: Feb 2001
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From: washington
One apparently uses Rears from a Fox Body Mustang, and the rear struts from a MR2. The catch seems to be the strut mounts are different diameters and the strut rod may need to be machined down.
Rotary Enthusiast
Joined: Mar 2004
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From: Pensacola FL
When i ran racing beat suspension i liked stock front bar and no rear bar. The car was more stable and predictable. This also worked well for autox.
the konis are from 94ish mustangs. I have the part numbers somewhere. You can get single and double adjustable for the rear.
the konis are from 94ish mustangs. I have the part numbers somewhere. You can get single and double adjustable for the rear.
Last edited by mikey D; Jan 10, 2019 at 07:39 AM.
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Joined: Dec 2007
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From: Upton,Ma
When i ran racing beat suspension i liked stock front bar and no rear bar. The car was more stable and predictable. This also worked well for autox.
the konis are from 94ish mustangs. I have the part numbers somewhere. You can get single and double adjustable for the rear.
the konis are from 94ish mustangs. I have the part numbers somewhere. You can get single and double adjustable for the rear.
Have you looked into the MR2 rear struts that people are saying work in the front of the FB?
I'm running Tokico Blues but I picked them up a few years ago before the stock depleted. They are OK, but if I were trying to get the most out of the car I'd say they aren't quite stiff enough.
I'm running Tokico Blues but I picked them up a few years ago before the stock depleted. They are OK, but if I were trying to get the most out of the car I'd say they aren't quite stiff enough.
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