SAFC in my S5 TII FB
07-16-06, 09:29 PM
#1
#garageguybuild
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iTrader: (32)
SAFC in my S5 TII FB
Today in hooked up my SAFC and i did the setup and she fired right up! Just a couple of questions!
Will it be ok to boost 10 to 12psi on a stock turbo? I also bought some 720's that i will putting in soon for the extra fuel i think ill be needing.
I have a 3 inch exhaust, FCD, K&N, ported wastegate, and i have a M300 wideband i plan to tune with.
Thanks Steve
Will it be ok to boost 10 to 12psi on a stock turbo? I also bought some 720's that i will putting in soon for the extra fuel i think ill be needing.
I have a 3 inch exhaust, FCD, K&N, ported wastegate, and i have a M300 wideband i plan to tune with.
Thanks Steve
07-17-06, 12:08 AM
#4
FB+FC=F-ME
If your running stock EFI,whats the need for the SAFC?
The stock EFI is tuned rich from the factory.The stock injectors are also considered by the FC community to be adequate for bolt on mods up to the 230-240 crank HP mark(but dont quote me on that number)
Typically,the stock pump is considered the weak link in the fuel system.Ive run 14psi on both my TII engine swaps over the years with no AFC or fuel map trickery needed...just an FCD to prevent fuel cut.
I run a SupraTT fuel pump in the tank and I used 680cc secondaries with my S4 setup and stock turbo.It ran great,but the turbo was screaming to be upgraded.Never a problem with mixture.
I now run 800cc secondaries with my S5 setup and TO4B,its a hair on the rich side,but runs great and never,ever complains.Still hit 14psi on a daily basis,Id guess that your 720cc injectors would be right on the money as secondaries for 14psi,but youll need more fuel,so another set of injectors should be considered.Id also upgrade the turbo to at least a hybrid TO4,and be sure to run a FMIC.With that,the A/F mix should be right on for a 14psi peak,and the SAFC should be un-needed.
If you want to hit 14psi and your running the stock SE injection with only two injectors,then youll need a lot more fuel.The stock TII runs (4) 550cc injectors,you only have (2) 680cc.
Id think about moving some 550cc primaries into the stock SE sockets,then putting the 720cc injectors into the secondary runners.
The stock EFI is tuned rich from the factory.The stock injectors are also considered by the FC community to be adequate for bolt on mods up to the 230-240 crank HP mark(but dont quote me on that number)
Typically,the stock pump is considered the weak link in the fuel system.Ive run 14psi on both my TII engine swaps over the years with no AFC or fuel map trickery needed...just an FCD to prevent fuel cut.
I run a SupraTT fuel pump in the tank and I used 680cc secondaries with my S4 setup and stock turbo.It ran great,but the turbo was screaming to be upgraded.Never a problem with mixture.
I now run 800cc secondaries with my S5 setup and TO4B,its a hair on the rich side,but runs great and never,ever complains.Still hit 14psi on a daily basis,Id guess that your 720cc injectors would be right on the money as secondaries for 14psi,but youll need more fuel,so another set of injectors should be considered.Id also upgrade the turbo to at least a hybrid TO4,and be sure to run a FMIC.With that,the A/F mix should be right on for a 14psi peak,and the SAFC should be un-needed.
If you want to hit 14psi and your running the stock SE injection with only two injectors,then youll need a lot more fuel.The stock TII runs (4) 550cc injectors,you only have (2) 680cc.
Id think about moving some 550cc primaries into the stock SE sockets,then putting the 720cc injectors into the secondary runners.
Last edited by steve84GS TII; 07-17-06 at 12:14 AM.
07-17-06, 01:25 PM
#5
#garageguybuild
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iTrader: (32)
thanks for the info.. Steve84GS TII
I'm running stock S5 TII, i plan to upgrade the turbo really soon to a BNR stage 3, or is that to much?? i would like around 300 to 350 rwhp.. Do you think i have the suporting mods for a stage 3? my mods are on my sig. I just want to have everything in place before i upgrade the turbo!!
I'm running stock S5 TII, i plan to upgrade the turbo really soon to a BNR stage 3, or is that to much?? i would like around 300 to 350 rwhp.. Do you think i have the suporting mods for a stage 3? my mods are on my sig. I just want to have everything in place before i upgrade the turbo!!
07-17-06, 02:02 PM
#6
FB+FC=F-ME
Uhgg....here we go again with RWHP.
300-350 rear wheel HP is over 400 crank HP,which is more than twice the factory output of the stock TII engine.No one is making that much power with the stock EFI,the AFM cannot flow enough air for those numbers.Ive got mine pretty much maxxed out at around 300 CRANK HP,which is about 250-260 RWHP.As you can see,thats pretty far off, but still a 50% gain over stock...and its plenty quick in a 1st gen.
Also,for those kind of numbers,youd best set your sights on something better than a hybrid.Think full TO4 or a GT series turbo.Check the 2nd gen areas for info on the ideal 400HP turbo.
You current plan sounds very similar to my long running engine.A S5 with a hybrid turbo and bigger secondary injectors.Ive also got all the bolt on goodies and an average streetport....but still,if your gonna retain the stock EFI and not go standalone EFI,your gonna have to settle for the fact that 400 HP is simply out of reach.
300-350 rear wheel HP is over 400 crank HP,which is more than twice the factory output of the stock TII engine.No one is making that much power with the stock EFI,the AFM cannot flow enough air for those numbers.Ive got mine pretty much maxxed out at around 300 CRANK HP,which is about 250-260 RWHP.As you can see,thats pretty far off, but still a 50% gain over stock...and its plenty quick in a 1st gen.
Also,for those kind of numbers,youd best set your sights on something better than a hybrid.Think full TO4 or a GT series turbo.Check the 2nd gen areas for info on the ideal 400HP turbo.
You current plan sounds very similar to my long running engine.A S5 with a hybrid turbo and bigger secondary injectors.Ive also got all the bolt on goodies and an average streetport....but still,if your gonna retain the stock EFI and not go standalone EFI,your gonna have to settle for the fact that 400 HP is simply out of reach.
Last edited by steve84GS TII; 07-17-06 at 02:04 PM.
07-17-06, 04:38 PM
#7
#garageguybuild
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iTrader: (32)
steve thatnks for the info!
Is a bnr stage 2 to much turbo for the stock efi system, or could i run a stage 3 and keep the boost down ?? I would rather get the Stage 3 because its only $50 more... then later go aftermarket ECU
Is a bnr stage 2 to much turbo for the stock efi system, or could i run a stage 3 and keep the boost down ?? I would rather get the Stage 3 because its only $50 more... then later go aftermarket ECU
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07-17-06, 06:44 PM
#9
FB+FC=F-ME
Turbo size isnt much of an issue,the only thing that will change is the response time of the turbo.14psi of boost pressure is still the same 14psi,regardless of the turbo size....provided that the ports have not been enlarged,the power output is unchanged.
The main advantage of the larger turbo is that itll produce the higher boost levels effeciently,without excess heating of the air.The stock turbo is screaming to feed a stock port 13BT at 14psi,its just not within its effeciency range.The bigger turbo will just be loafing along at that level,which keeps the turbo mechanicals and the air temps happy.That will make your reliance on intercooling less,although I wouldnt recommend the stock TII intercooler for anything except a stock engine (and only barely,then)
So, you can basically run whatever hybrid or full turbo upgrade you want,the ECU wont care provided you control the max boost level effectively with a good controller and run properly sized secondary injectors to mach the increased airflow.I use an AVCR digital boost controller with much success.The only down side of the larger turbo is lag,and that can be remedied somewhat by modern turbo design and ball bearing cartridges.The key to keeping the stock EFI happy is limiting the max airflow into the engine so the AFM isnt overrun.With the S5 unit,that means about 14psi with a streetport engine,or probably around 15-17psi on a stock port engine.Most hybrid upgrade turbos are rated to about those levels,but it depends wholey on the size of the ports and redline of the engine.....in this case were talking mostly stock.
The main advantage of the larger turbo is that itll produce the higher boost levels effeciently,without excess heating of the air.The stock turbo is screaming to feed a stock port 13BT at 14psi,its just not within its effeciency range.The bigger turbo will just be loafing along at that level,which keeps the turbo mechanicals and the air temps happy.That will make your reliance on intercooling less,although I wouldnt recommend the stock TII intercooler for anything except a stock engine (and only barely,then)
So, you can basically run whatever hybrid or full turbo upgrade you want,the ECU wont care provided you control the max boost level effectively with a good controller and run properly sized secondary injectors to mach the increased airflow.I use an AVCR digital boost controller with much success.The only down side of the larger turbo is lag,and that can be remedied somewhat by modern turbo design and ball bearing cartridges.The key to keeping the stock EFI happy is limiting the max airflow into the engine so the AFM isnt overrun.With the S5 unit,that means about 14psi with a streetport engine,or probably around 15-17psi on a stock port engine.Most hybrid upgrade turbos are rated to about those levels,but it depends wholey on the size of the ports and redline of the engine.....in this case were talking mostly stock.
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