iceblue

Have been trying to find a stupid key off drain on an SA and it is fairly strong spark test arch's hard like a dead short almost. Here is the thing the volt meter will read the short like a capacitor or coil it builds voltage slowly about 1vdc per second up to 12.5vdc.

Test this by unplugging the - terminal and putting a continuity tester on the - wire strap and other on the - terminal.

After isolating everything and figuring it out heres whats showing.
2ga wire going from +batt to 2 Sterio AMPS. This item shows a draw on the meter but very slow about .1vdc about every 1.5seconds up to 12vdc. Why the hell would an AMP do this? You shouldn't see any draw on a short test without there being a + wire shorted to a ground wire.

The second draw was coming from the E-fan. The wiring checks out it has one wire 30AMP fused going to the + of battery this is the constant for the relay. The trigger/switching wire is going to the + on the coils so it only runs when key on. The ground is grounding to a thermo sensor. The + out is going to the Fan and the Fan - goes to to a Radiator mounting bolt.

I can here the relay charge when you put the battery terminals on this one shows a strong draw. As mentioned about 1vdc a second to 12vdc and it builds much like a capacitor would read. If you let it build then tap the - cable back to the terminal it will arch. Then fan don't kick on because the switching wire is not charged coming from the coil unless key is flipped on and the grounding wire from the thermo sensor is up to temp.

Any ideas of whats going on? If you unplug both items from + sources the meter read 0.00 as it should.

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

How fast does the battery drain? I would remove the battery (-) and put your meter into Amps mode with the meter inline with the battery and cable (one end to battery (-) the other end to the disconnected battery cable). See what current you get.

On my SE, it'll show 120mA for a few seconds (ignition light on) and then will drop to about 20mA once it goes out. You should be looking for a draw around that.

The relay should draw nothing. It is just a switch, so the circuit is broken when the efan is off. There should not be a parasitic draw there. The amp should have a small draw when off, but shouldn't be much.

What alternator do you have installed? If you have say an S5 or later alt, you will get this discharge if not properly wired.

DivinDriver

iTrader: (15)

Sounds like a capacitor (fairly large one) is shorted across the power leads. Nothing on the stock vehicle has a cap of that size, that I'm aware of.

Ignition coil shorted to power could conceivably do it, but it'd need a resistor in-line to exhibit such a slow charge curve.

iceblue

Takes about 12-24hrs to kill the battery. It does act like a capacitor or coil but apparently its not after the E-fan and AMP were disconnected all VDC ceased. The alt is a S4 alternator no wiring changes.

That was my understanding of a relay my assumption was bad relay but it worked properly so I asked. I will go try an AMP draw and see what I get thanks so far.

Thats what I did with VDC now will try with AMP

iceblue

Ok well crap. I Under DCA I don't read anything. But regardless of Efan or AMPs its showing a 12.7vdc draw again. Originally thought it was the starter solenoid because I unhooked Efan and interior power cable and had a draw only thing connected was the starter. But when new starter was installed it didn't go away. I unplugged the started it didn't go away left it unplugged did the above tests in post 1 and it went away. Now starter is plugged back in just tested along with amps it is shows 12vdc draw all the time but no DCA draw. Tap negative wire to terminal it will arch.

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Measure the current draw (amps) like a said above. If you are killing your battery that quickly, you probably have a 5A or so draw.

Also, explain again how you are measuring this. It sounds like you have removed the battery (-) cable and have put the meter between the cable and the battery terminal. Is this correct? You also mention the continuity tester, but you are reporting things in volts. At the end, you say it reads 0.00 when you disconnect the amp and the relay. What reads zero (what setting is the meter on)? Maybe I am not understanding you correctly.

What you want to do is remove the battery (-) cable, put the meter inline, set the meter to read AMPs. You may have to move the (+ wire in the meter to a different spot for current readings. The only trick here is that most meters have a capacity of 10A-20A. If your draw is more (doubt it), you may blow the fuse in the meter. If you are pulling a couple amps for example, then unplug the amp and see what happens. Then unplug the relay.

It sounds like a pretty large draw (assuming your battery is in good shape).

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

We posted at the same time. Make sure that the wires in the meter are in the correct spot for DCA. There are usually three terminals. 1 common, 1 for Volts, continuity, etc., and 1 for Amps It is easy to forget about this especially when going back and forth between voltage and current measurements.

iceblue

Yes thats how I have been testing under 200DCV all the test were performed under this setting unless mentioned under DCA. All DCA tests were done in 10A mode. I show 0.00 in 10A mode but 12.3-12.7 in 200 DCV mode. With starter hooked up I see no changes now in DCV mode it shows 12.7VDC. If starter is removed still no changes unless Efan relay is removed and then it show very slow creeping draw until AMP is removed then shows 0.00 draw across the board.

iceblue

Yup forgot to swap wire to AMP mode brb with new test results

iceblue

I still show a 0.00 draw on 10A mode. Before the new starter it used to arch hard. Now new starter with the efan hooked up it shows 12.7VDC draw and arch's a little, tap the terminal to the battery on and off along with the arch you can here the relay go click click click.

Leave the Efan unplugged and AMP it shows 11.7vdc consistent but no arch when you tap the terminal. It used t arch with the old starter installed.

I'm thinking the relay is bad. Wondering why I get no AMP draw :-/ the meter is a 10A unfused G-B GDT-200A

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Cool. You don't want to measure voltage inline like that. It is basically meaningless. Voltage measurements are to go across points in a circuit. Current measurements are inline with the circuit.

See when you measure volts like that, the meter is the only thing that completes the circuit. The meter has a very high input impedance (resistance) in volts mode. This is so that the meter doesn't load the circuit when trying to measure voltage (otherwise the voltage reading would always be too low). In current mode, the resistance of the meter is close to 0.0. This is for the same reason. You don't want the meter to be adding resistance to the circuit you are trying to measure.

So, if the meter had infinite resistance, you would never get to 12v in your test (broken circuit). However, the resistance is just very high (but not infinite), so the trickle of current through the meter is bringing the potential up to battery voltage (slowly due to the high resistance). This is the behavior you are seeing.

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

If you are showing no draw on 10A scale, try a lower scale. There should be like 20 or 30 mA at least. This wouldn't cause the battery drain, but there should be a little draw at least.

Edit: Also remember it is a good idea to set the scales to best match the ranges of what you are going to be looking at. For instance, I use the 40v scale on my meter when dealing with car stuff as the voltage is never going to be over about 14v. The only exception would be high voltage stuff (like plug wires), but you wouldn't use a meter like this for that. For current, if you have no idea what it might be, start with the highest scale and work your way down.

iceblue

Ok so the gain I am seeing is the meter fault and the arch pretty much explains the relay is bad and thats probably my issue now.

Does this also hold true even if I was using a good Fluke or something?

iceblue

I have a 200m 20M and 2000U all show 0.00 :-/

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Something is very stange. I would make sure the meter is functioning correctly. get it inline, set at 10A scale, and turn on a dome light, glove box light, or something like that. If the light is on and the meter still reads 0.00, the meter is bad or you have it hooked up incorrectly.

Yes, what I explained above is true for all meters. Voltage is measured across a completed circuit, current is measured inline with the circuit. Ideally, the input impedance is infinite in the voltage setting and 0 in the current setting.

iceblue

I will test again and see if I cant get more AMP draw.

Here is what we are looking at now. I changed out the Efan relay the relay no longer clicks and it no longer arches the circuit so the relay was bad. With AMP still unplugged I'm show no more arcing. Now if I hook back up the amp Or single out the amp I can get it to arch. So the AMP now is the only thing causing a short in the circuit. Wonder why there both 2 high end JL amps 2GA wire going directly to AMP 2GA ground going to car body and remote is unplugged and car key of off.

Edit: Yeah I can't get jackfor AMP, But with the new relay starter and amp unplugged its also not arching so I don't think it's draining anymore.

DivinDriver

iTrader: (15)

Sidenote: Every time I've had a meter set to DCA and gotten a zero reading on a circuit that's 100% known to draw current, it's turned out that the meter's internal fuse for the Amps connection was blown. We're talking every time over dozens of years. Happens quick, and there's no indication.