Mazda to resurrect the rotary engine next year in range-extended electric car | Fox News

 

I figured they would try something like this. Rotaries seem pretty ideal for use as generators.

 

Must all of my favorite car companies turn to garbage because of this green movement?

 

^^ if it means they will start producing rotaries again then who cares? id rather see a rotor hybrid then a piston one.

 

They have to meet the new CAFE standards somehow, and I'd rather it be using a rotary than not. Plus, it's not like they'll suddenly start producing only hybrids and nothing else.

Also, there's no reason you can't have a high performance hybrid sports car. It's just that no one has one in production yet (though there are several in the works).

 

I've often thought about how PERFECT a GIANT electric motor would fit in place of a rotary engine... That would be a BALL of torque! But thats another topic.

This actually isn't a bad idea cause you could program the engine to warm up and esetially maintain itself (because usualy bad ownership destroys the rotary engine).




Also, this thing better be RWD!!!

 

It'll probably be a minivan...

 

I agree. Mazda dabbled with a hydrogen hybrid rotary engine years ago, around 2000 I believe, and it was in a minivan.

I am a nature lover. So I am all for the clean energy movement.

 

The Prius, for example, is actually designed to essentially be in closed loop as much as possible. The automated cooling system will wait til roughly a minute or so after engine shutoff, to allow for heat soak, then use an electric pump to siphon off the coolant from the cylinder head area (cuz obviously , heat rises) and store it in an ultra efficient, for the lack of better words, thermos. that can store coolant for several DAYS at relatively high temperatures (180+ degrees F), so that when the engine is used at next start up, the pump can dump the high temp coolant into the engine cooling system and minimize, if not eliminate altogether, open loop operation


With a rotary, that would help tremendously with fuel efficiency, to eliminate or minimize cold starts and anything like the AWS

 

Then why not make a hydrogen rotary RX like they had at the autoshow? This electric crap just takes the joy out of it. Sure speed is speed, but going from the sound and feel of my FC to an electric... may aswell kill me now. And if you want to help nature, buy a clean diesel. U.S. companies finally think you are ready for clean diesel cars...

 

Could we be so luck as they would use the 12A sized housings and start remaking compatable parts? or just a pipe dream.

 

yet i don't foresee hydrogen filling stations becoming a popular "green" movement.

hydrogen is great, yet very violent and expensive to handle and to produce. solar power is free, do we take advantage of that? nope.

some people call me negative, i prefer the term: "realist"

 

dry fuel is the only way they are going to beat the emissions targets,, they dont stratify so badly and thus dont end up self quenching at the trailing end of the rotor before full combustion

the engine has several inherent advantages when on a dry fuel that boinger doesn't
.. the cold side inlet for hydrogen is just one example


take LPG ( propane ) for an example
( in a boinger ) it must run at lamda to minimise Nox production ,, overfuelling also adds to chamber temps and brings the obvious unburned hydrocarbons

the boinger motor makes best power and cleanest emissions on this propane fuel at close to lambda

the rotary engine will idle on LPG at lambda ( yet wont on wet petrol )
and can be run under most loads at leaner than lambda without pushing the NOx or temps off the screen ..

ie,, run maximum CO2, minimal CO , minimal hydrocarbon and minimal N0x .. all while running with economy ,,leaner than lambda ( on propane )
...... the only engine that can do so , and that is before you add the expensive 3 way catalytic exhaust ( that the boinger MUST use to get even close )

to stretch this even further ,, there is great potential for economy under power when combining water injection

with dry fuels,, the disadvantages of the rotary become advantages,, a larger surface area and a high degree of heat exchange make the rotary cope without excessive chamber temps that would normally make excessive NOx at lean mixtures in the boinger

the larger angle at which TQ is applied to the crank in a rotary also suits the slow burn rate of the LPG fuel

the homogeneous nature of the dry mixture also much negates the need for the split ignition system ( there to light off that trailing edge rich mixture )

plus , plus , plus,, the only negatives is that most nations lack filling infrastructure and pricing to suit
LPG is cheap in oz and most of europe,, and avail at most pumping stations,, im lead to believe that some parts of the us arent so accommodating


as for the range extenders,, audi has done one too
,, and the benifits of the vibration free and small package of the rotary at its most efficient rpm is obvious to all


however,, i look at the middle plate on the current engines and see potential in building them with the stator inside,, so the motor runs a centre bearing and has a generator/ electric motor combination ( with FBW throttle to remove the pumping losses when in electric mode ) to make the ultimate micro hybrid

 

^ LPG is an interesting fuel and the distribution network is more or less already there, but it doesn't help with the sustainability effort and is thus unlikely to gain enough traction to displace gasoline in the U.S.

The storage problems of hydrogen are as bad as or worse than batteries, and the stuff is very expensive (both in energy input and cost) to produce. I just don't see it happening on a consumer basis. Maybe once fuel cells get cheap and reliable it will be worthwhile, but then we're back to using electric motors. Not that I mind that, personally.

As far as diesels go, Mazda is working miracles with their SkyActiv-D stuff. They've also talked about HCCI gasoline engines, which could be pretty neat.

 

To frame the hydrogen argument in a way that takes energy conservation into account: Hydrogen is not an energy source. I hear people dredge it up over and over again as a solution to our energy needs, but it will not provide energy. Why?

Hydrogen is created by separating water into H2 and O2. This process takes slightly more energy than the resulting hydrogen contains. You can burn it in any type of engine you like, but you'll get less out of it than it took to make it.

I'm not opposed to hydrogen, but it should be looked at in the same way as a rechargeable battery or a flywheel. It's a way to store energy -- not create it.

 

The same is true for gasoline. It's just that some of the process has already been done for us.

 

Yeah, but since it's on FOX news, you can't believe it.

 

That's true for any energy source; it's impossible to get more energy out than was originally put in. In all cases it's a question of the efficiency of conversion.

E.g., the energy in wood or coal is considerable, which made it useful to heat water for steam engines (which aren't particularly efficient users of that energy). But humans didn't need to expend the original energy to create that wood and coal.

Hydrogen separation schemes that rely on passive energy sources such as solar, geothermal, nuclear, etc. would suggest opportunities for hydrogen-based engines may yet present themselves.

 

the sun puts off more energy in a day than the earth would consume in hundreds of thousands of years.

wrap it with aluminum foil and convert it into energy! you might just power a prius for a day..