redbstd

is it posible to run 2gcdfis with a msd? and if so you should really do a write up on it.

SCCAIT7

Damn... what happened to making this simple!

Siraniko

iTrader: (13)

I will make it simple:

One MSD 6A/AL
1. To replace the stock leading igniter - no direct fire.

2. Direct Fire using 2 leading coils (aftermarket or stock coils). Strong and consistent spark.

3. Direct Fire using a FC leading coil. Spark is not as good as option 2. You have to remove/disconnect the FC igniter wires. If not, the MSD box will short out.

mazda6guy

iTrader: (1)

Thank you wackyracer for simplifying things for me. Now I know what to do now.

Siraniko

iTrader: (13)

yw

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

I don't know if its too much to ask but, could someone who knows what they are doing (possibly waits or wackyracer ) post a diagram of the way they set their MSD up. A picture would really help.

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

also for the rotary which wires do you cut in the MSD?

kgray

whatever to make it run like a 4 cyl. I think it is all of them iirc.

Siraniko

iTrader: (13)

Starting with the MSD box
MSD green wire to dizzy's red wire
MSD purple wire to dizzy's green wire

MSD thin orange wire to leading coil 1 positive
MSD thin black wire to leading coil 1 negative
*** Plus 2 short pieces of wires as jumpers from leading coil 1 to leading coil 2 and you do the same for negative.

****For FC direct fire, just connect the wires to the coil: orange to + and black to -. Again, be sure to disconnect the FC igniter as it will burn the MSD box.

MSD thin red wire to ignition wire. This is the MSD's on and off switch. Can be tapped to the black/wire wire that was originally connected to the leading coil's + termnal OR connect this to the trailing coil's + terminal. Either one will work.


MSD thick black wire to ground
MSD thick red wire to battery (be sure to add an in line 30amp fuse) OR to the FC fuse block for those who have done the upgrade.

Also, you need to set the MSD's cylinder setting. For rotaries, you want to set it for 4 cylnder - refer to MSD manual.


Be sure not to install the MSD box upside down. If not, just in case, water will get trapped inside and ruin your day.


areas where you can mount the box

kgray

for a visual

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

thanks alot guys. Now its going to be really easy to put my msd in.

rxforspeed

iTrader: (3)

OK-I've got this, but I'm eventually going to run an MSD with a S4 Crank Angle Sensor and a Haltech. Problem is I don't have the Haltech yet, but I do have the MSD,CAS, and an FC leading coil. At least one of you knowledgeable guys has got to know which system will produce a hotter, more consistent spark. If swapping the CAS in with the FC leading coil would be a better system, what wires from the CAS would I use to trigger the FC coil (and would I have to remove the ignitors from it as well)? I know you guys have answered similar questions many of times, so if there is a link that will answer my question I would be thrilled if somebody could direct me to it. Thanks for all your help guys!

-Adam Collins

rxforspeed

iTrader: (3)

Oh yea-I'm not worried about running the trailing plugs. I'll eventually find or build two "plugs" (solid threaded plugs to block-off the spark plug holes) so I don't have exposed spark plugs sticking out of the side of my engine block. I know I don't need to do this, but I'd feel better looking at my engine without the ugly tip of an exposed spark plug protruding from the side. It will look nice enough for me to care about that one day soon...

-Adam

gsl-se addict

iTrader: (3)

Problem is that you cannot run the CAS directly to the FC coil (even with MSD in between). The CAS has no kind of advance (mechanical or vac). All it does is has two sets of teeth. One set to tell e-shaft position, the other to sync the trailing. You need an ECU (2nd gen, Haltech, ect.) to interface between the CAS and the FC coil w/ or w/o the MSD.

rxforspeed

iTrader: (3)

OK-that would be good with boost, right? I'm running it N/A until my project engine is built so even if it could be wired to operate it would hender my performance, not help. I'll clean the CAS and put it on the shelf until the day I install the Haltech...Thanks!

-Adam

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

ok i guess i still don't get it. I understand the wiring it just seems to me like having the two leading coils wired together is going to make the leading plugs fire at the same time? Aren't they supposed to fire at different times?

Siraniko

iTrader: (13)

just wire it up and spark away. if this **** is bad, then my motors would have gone kaboom years ago.

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

this is true, i called msd and they said to do exactly what you said because the leading coils fire at the same time. Im just gunna call it magic because as long as it works that all that really matters. Thanks again.

redbstd

ive been wondering about this for some time will this msd 2 tower coil for GM work as a direct fire coil?(option #2)

[URL="http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=MSD%2D8224&N=700+ 4294925143+400122+4294839065+4294890813+115&autovi ew=sku"]

Kill No Cone

iTrader: (6)

I run an MSD 6AL through a 2nd gen coil with no trailing. I love it. I choose the rev limiter pill and I am set. Great for autocrossing, never have to look down.

Several years ago Paul Yaw did some testing with and without the trailing and found that there was almost not affect to horse power, although the trailing really helped a great deal with emission.

So, if you are not getting emission tested at the track, forget the trailing ignition.

I have also looked at the MSD dual fire GM coil myself (the MSD version of a 2nd gen coil), but what I have works so well I just have not gotten to it.

redbstd

So it will work right?

larrymcclendon

YES..will work just like 2nd gen. coil

slow5oh

im gonna be doing a swap to an MSD 6AL and 2 blaster 2 coils, eliminating trailing altogether. the only thing im worried about is the fuel pump. ive read in several places that the fuel pump is run off the trailing ignition. if so, what wire needs to be relocated to which terminal on the leading coils. ive got an 84 GSL-SE. ive searched around and havent found a definate answer, so i figured id post here.

mustanghammer

iTrader: (3)

Wow, lots of ways to skin this cat! To make this more confusing - here is what we are doing with the race cars in Kansas City. Pretty much what Billy describes above except that we are leaving the trailing side stock - using the ignitor, a single stock coil, trailing plugs fired from the distributor cap, etc.

On the leading side we also pulling off the ignitor and using the black/orange wires to the MSD 6A. In our installations we are using the MSD to drive a dual pole motorcycle coil. The coil is connected directly to the plugs - this is the wasted spark method.

Charlie Clark at KCRaceware.com found the coils - I believe they were originally for a 6V application. They last about 2-3 seasons....eventually they get hot and fail or the epoxy case splits. Yeah, we are over-driving the coil. I am now looking at several Harley Davidson 12V applications.

A couple of us have the leading and trailing ignitions wired separately so that we can easliy spot an issue by alternately switching each on or off. The engine changes pitch when you run only one side of the ignition and believe it or not you can do about 80MPH on the trailing only side.....