1st Generation Specific (1979-1985) 1979-1985 Discussion including performance modifications and technical support sections

Ignition Coil Upgrade

Old 02-12-14, 09:09 PM
  #26  
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I burned a j109. But I had assumed it was because of the 8202 I was using horizontally. The coil had a slight leak and then ended up failing resistance checks.

Im on gm 7 pin HEI's with three msd 8222's. Trailing j-109 has been fine for a little while, but I have been collecting back-ups just in case!
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Old 02-12-14, 11:17 PM
  #27  
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You're right - ignition is bone stock, as I've never had any issues with it and the car performs just fine as designed originally back in 1984!

That said, I'd be up for better performance and/or fuel economy and would consider making it a Direct Fire ignition - and even looked closely into MSD boxes awhile back - but there are so many confusing write-ups that I've never gone at it.

If you have a clear link with pictures and a tutorial, I'd give it a shot.

Also, I appreciate the kind words, but my engine bay is anything but pristine! Right now I'm fighting a power steering pump leak that's going through a 1/2 cup of fluid every commute (50mi), coolant being lost through seals at a rate of 1 cup (50mi), fuel economy that's dropped like a rock due to poor overall sealing (apex/side) at about 13mpg city, and it's drinking about a quart of engine oil every fillup (250mi) due to bad oil control rings.

I suppose at 220k miles, the engine's pretty tired at this point. My spare 13b sitting on the engine stand in the garage is going in at some point this year, because I'm tired of dumping $$$ into replacement fluids!
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Old 02-13-14, 07:06 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by Jeff20B View Post
It killed you HEI ignitor? Wow, I never knew the 2GCDFIS was so problematic. I always thought the HEI could withstand the hungry leading coil. Was that with or without the ballast resistor?
Actually, I never got an HEI ignitor to fire it. Tried two different new ones with every (to me) concieveable wiring and grounding scheme. The MSD was easy and fired right up.
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Old 02-13-14, 09:45 PM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by t_g_farrell View Post
My SA ignition burned itself out after running the 2G coils. Not sure if it was the
ignitors though because the little circuit board in the SA control box had some
scorch marks on it. The symptoms when your SA ignition fails will be it starts up cold
fine but when it gets warm it will start to miss and when it gets hot it will fail to run.
Once it cools it will work ok, lather rinse repeat until it happens so fast you can't
drive anywhere. At first you will think its something else and eventually it will strand you somewhere.

Ask me how I know.
Originally Posted by Jeff20B View Post
A leading 2G coil left PercentSevenC stranded. It killed the J-109 he was using. Yes we did include the ballast resistor but it still was too much for the stock ignitor.

His is an '83 that was set up for 2GCDFIS. I was there and "edited" his car to use trailing, which was still stock, going to the leading plugs and I think we rotated the dizzy for closer to leading timing. It got him home.
Wow... would have been nice to know this before I blew $100 on a pair of coils.

Just to verify; when you two gents are talking 2G coils, are you talking MAZDA 2nd Gen, or MSD Blaster 2's?

The MSD instructions are completely unclear if the ballast resistor is needed for stock ELECTRONIC ignition; in one place it says "...stock, points style ignition..." and in another it says "...a points or stock style distributor..." requires the resistor. The website says that stock electonic ignitions don't. Or seems to.

The Mazda points ignition also used a ballast resistor to limit coil current, of course.

Obvious mods like the DLI**** stuff won't get past cali smog any more - - the MSD coils come with CARB-approval stickers.
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Old 02-14-14, 06:27 AM
  #30  
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Jeff, I did not use the resistor with my 2g coil. Sorry 'bout incomplete reply above.
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Old 02-14-14, 08:32 AM
  #31  
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I only reacently started using "2G". Doubt I'll keep using it. But when I used that term recently, I was refering to the 2nd gen leading coil. I can't say the same for anyone else using that term. There is no such thing as a 2G coil made by a company like MSD to the best of my knowledge.

As for whether to use a ballast resistor with a 2nd gen leading coil if using an MSD, I honestly can't remember. I'd like to say no because the capacitive discharge causes the coil to behave less like a coil and more like a step up transformer.
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Old 02-14-14, 09:54 AM
  #32  
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Originally Posted by DivinDriver View Post
Obvious mods like the DLI**** stuff won't get past cali smog any more - - the MSD coils come with CARB-approval stickers.
I mounted my TFI coils for the leading in the stock location. Would that fool em?
I bet you can get cali sticker on em too! You'd have to hide the trailing somewhere
else and then theres the missing wires on the dizzy cap. Oh well it was a thought.
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Old 02-14-14, 10:23 AM
  #33  
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Originally Posted by Jeff20B View Post
I only reacently started using "2G". Doubt I'll keep using it. But when I used that term recently, I was refering to the 2nd gen leading coil. I can't say the same for anyone else using that term. There is no such thing as a 2G coil made by a company like MSD to the best of my knowledge. As for whether to use a ballast resistor with a 2nd gen leading coil if using an MSD, I honestly can't remember. I'd like to say no because the capacitive discharge causes the coil to behave less like a coil and more like a step up transformer.
To be clear, I have a second generation leading coil firing directly on the leading plugs. It is being fed by an MSD 6201 ignition box.
It works well, noticeably better than stock.
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Old 02-14-14, 10:54 AM
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Thanks for the clarification, Jeff. I'm still running the stock 80 ignitor/control box, so no CD in this one.

I guess it's worth the risk to try it; I do have a spare known-good control box just in case, but there's no point in just wantonly wrecking hard to find parts if there's existing known results for a particular app. Weren't all that many 80 ignitions made, in comparison to later years.
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Old 02-14-14, 11:55 AM
  #35  
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Originally Posted by DivinDriver View Post
I guess it's worth the risk to try it; I do have a spare known-good control box just in case, but there's no point in just wantonly wrecking hard to find parts if there's existing known results for a particular app. Weren't all that many 80 ignitions made, in comparison to later years.
Especially living in Cali, you may need to use them someday. Thats why I remade my
ignition to use COTS GM/Ford parts because the 80 ignition is fragile and rare. When
mine died I saw no reason to keep it (because I live in a state like NC).
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Old 02-20-14, 08:45 PM
  #36  
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msd blaster 2 1979 rx-7

I just got a pair mounted them in stock braket airways and one blew up today advise not too put them in horizantaly. At leaat I still have new one for lead :-)
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Old 02-21-14, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by fearfulear69 View Post
I just got a pair mounted them in stock braket airways and one blew up today advise not too put them in horizantaly. At leaat I still have new one for lead :-)
Are they red or black?

If they are red, you are using the wrong ones.

Get the black ones. I guess referencing the part number doesn't work for some people.
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Old 02-21-14, 05:12 PM
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Yea they were red
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Old 05-09-14, 06:46 PM
  #39  
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Hey sorry for the horribly newb question, and the semi-gravedig, I just read through this whole thread and have only been left in more confusion. I recently aquired an 81 GSL and would like to stage zero the car before I get it on the road, but I want to do all these efficiency mods/clean the engine bay up before I stage zero it. That way I can have it primo when I clean and replace everything.

So my question is, on my 81 can I simply slap on 2 MSD blasters (8222) and that's be all and end all?
If not Then I'll do some more research and figure out whether or not to do the DLIDFIS mod as opposed to this one.
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Old 05-09-14, 07:52 PM
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Unless you go direct fire, coil upgrade is no real gain. If you go direct fire, stock coils work fine. There are many opinions on this. I use a 2nd gen coil dfis, but dont think it's the best necessarily. But as good as any for all intents and purposes.
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Old 05-09-14, 09:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Cookboy View Post
Unless you go direct fire, coil upgrade is no real gain. If you go direct fire, stock coils work fine. There are many opinions on this. I use a 2nd gen coil dfis, but dont think it's the best necessarily. But as good as any for all intents and purposes.
Cool! Will look into it more, thanks.
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